The Gearbox Software Forums Go to Gearboxity.comGo to Gearbox Software's Web site

Go Back   The Gearbox Software Forums > Gearbox Games > Borderlands 2 > BL2 Loot and Weapons Chat

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old December 1st, 2012, 02:23 PM   #11
Kriptini
Former S&S Phoenix
 
Kriptini's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 964
Default Re: Double Penetrating Unkempt Harold!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Str1p3s View Post
Actually, the DP Harold loses a lot of its awesomeness with the new Bee. Since the gun card shows x2, the amp damage will be divided in half for each shot. It'll actually be better to have a different variant and pull the trigger twice, just so you get the full amp bonus for each shot.

That is, unless I'm retarded and overlooked something obvious. I just woke up and I'm still kinda drunk on Nyquil.
Well, you're still gonna technically get the full Amp damage per pull of the trigger, but you're only gonna get half as many full Amps as a normal UH... but you also gain twice the base damage.

So I think the question is, which does more damage? The base damage of each pellet or the Amp Damage of the Bee?
__________________
Borderlands 2 Community RPG!

Kriptini is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2012, 02:26 PM   #12
moleculo
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 278
Default Re: Double Penetrating Unkempt Harold!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Str1p3s View Post
Actually, the DP Harold loses a lot of its awesomeness with the new Bee. Since the gun card shows x2, the amp damage will be divided in half for each shot. It'll actually be better to have a different variant and pull the trigger twice, just so you get the full amp bonus for each shot.

That is, unless I'm retarded and overlooked something obvious. I just woke up and I'm still kinda drunk on Nyquil.
Yeah, you're retarded

Anyways, the thing about amp shields is that amp damage is added per every projectile. That dividing thing means you then divide the resulting bonus damage with the number of projectiles listed in the gun card so that multi-projectile weapons get the same bonus per SHOT as single-projectile guns do.

But since Harold basically gets 7 projectiles per shot and the card still reads 1 or 2, I'm pretty sure the amp damage doesn't get divided, meaning you get 7 times the damage bonus you should be getting. Haven't tested this extensively because I try not to use legendaries nowadays but it sure seems like that.
moleculo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2012, 02:28 PM   #13
Str1p3s
Totally Comfortable
 
Str1p3s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Texas, United States
Posts: 1,364
Default Re: Double Penetrating Unkempt Harold!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriptini View Post
Well, you're still gonna technically get the full Amp damage per pull of the trigger, but you're only gonna get half as many full Amps as a normal UH... but you also gain twice the base damage.

So I think the question is, which does more damage? The base damage of each pellet or the Amp Damage of the Bee?
Edit: Need moar thinking times.
__________________

My Channel || Raid Boss Time Trials

Last edited by Str1p3s; December 1st, 2012 at 02:31 PM.
Str1p3s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2012, 02:58 PM   #14
Str1p3s
Totally Comfortable
 
Str1p3s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Texas, United States
Posts: 1,364
Default Re: Double Penetrating Unkempt Harold!!

Alright, so I'm gonna do a little math here. Correct me if I'm wrong.

We'll say both the DP UH and the non-DP UH have a base damage of 15,000, just to make it easy. Then we'll say that the Bee's amp bonus is 40,000. So...

DP UH

15,000 x 14 = 210,000
40,000 x 14 = 560,000
560,000 / 2 = 280,000
210,000 + 280,000 = 490,000

So with one pull of the trigger, DP does 490,000 damage.

Non-DP UH

15,000 x 7 = 105,000
40,000 x 7 = 280,000
105,000 + 280,000 = 385,000

So a non-DP UH does 385,000 damage with each trigger pull.

So yeah, with one shot, the DP wins out... But we already knew that. Its downside is obvious when you compare damage per clip. It we were to say that each gun had 24 rounds in each clip, then the DP would have four shots, while the non-DP would have 8. So multiply each shot's damage by how many shots per clip and you get 1,960,000 damage for the DP UH, while you get 3,080,000 for the non-DP UH.

Right or wrong? I don't wanna spend forever checking my simple math.

Edit: I'm actually gonna be a super nerd here and do some DPS math.

I'm going to give each gun a reload speed of 2 seconds and a fire rate of one shot every second. Again, it's just to make the math easy. DP UH would fire off its entire clip in 4 seconds, while the non-DP UH would take 8. Add in the reload time and you have 6 seconds for DP and 10 for non-DP. So...

DP UH

1,960,000 / 6 = 326,667 DPS

Non-DP UH

3,080,000 / 10 = 308,000 DPS

So yeah, it looks like I was wrong. A DP UH will still be better for DPS, but only slightly, and at twice the ammo consumption.

Edit edit: I forgot to point out that this is with a 2 second reload time, which is pretty close to what the guns actually have. If the reload times were actually higher, then a non-DP UH would have the higher DPS.
__________________

My Channel || Raid Boss Time Trials

Last edited by Str1p3s; December 1st, 2012 at 03:29 PM.
Str1p3s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2012, 03:19 PM   #15
moleculo
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 278
Default Re: Double Penetrating Unkempt Harold!!

^ Pretty sure DP uses 4 ammo per shot and the other one 3. So it'd be 6 shots vs 8 which would mean they'd be pretty even in terms of damage/clip. Except that the DP one would obviously empty faster.


E: Snap, I'm totally forgetting that DP will have smaller RoF but more ammo/clip. That changes things a lot.

Last edited by moleculo; December 1st, 2012 at 03:22 PM.
moleculo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2012, 03:22 PM   #16
Str1p3s
Totally Comfortable
 
Str1p3s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Texas, United States
Posts: 1,364
Default Re: Double Penetrating Unkempt Harold!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by moleculo View Post
^ Pretty sure DP uses 4 ammo per shot and the other one 3. So it'd be 6 shots vs 8 which would mean they'd be pretty even in terms of damage/clip. Except that the DP one would obviously empty faster.
DP definitely uses 6 rounds per shot. I know for sure 'cause I use one. I also did an edit on that post for DPS. Not sure if you saw it.
__________________

My Channel || Raid Boss Time Trials
Str1p3s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2012, 03:33 PM   #17
moleculo
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 278
Default Re: Double Penetrating Unkempt Harold!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Str1p3s View Post
DP definitely uses 6 rounds per shot. I know for sure 'cause I use one. I also did an edit on that post for DPS. Not sure if you saw it.
Damn, I remembered this all wrong then. Still, don't forget the different RoF and mag size stats for the guns, be sure to check the exact stats here http://thegearcalculator.appspot.com...0l0qq0Ik0--9j0
moleculo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2012, 03:41 PM   #18
Str1p3s
Totally Comfortable
 
Str1p3s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Texas, United States
Posts: 1,364
Default Re: Double Penetrating Unkempt Harold!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by moleculo View Post
Damn, I remembered this all wrong then. Still, don't forget the different RoF and mag size stats for the guns, be sure to check the exact stats here http://thegearcalculator.appspot.com...0l0qq0Ik0--9j0
Fair enough. I don't want to do the math for every kind is why I simplified it.

Edit: The differences in variants, now that I did even more nerd math, make a miniscule impact on DPS. You're still going to be looking at an average of 20,000 or 30,000 DPS advantage for the DP. Not real sure if that's worth it, considering how much it eats through ammo.
__________________

My Channel || Raid Boss Time Trials

Last edited by Str1p3s; December 1st, 2012 at 03:59 PM.
Str1p3s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2012, 03:49 PM   #19
Lurch87
I'd Rather Lurk
 
Lurch87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: NC
Posts: 598
Default Re: Double Penetrating Unkempt Harold!!

it is a great pistol for hyperious. use singularity grenades to cluster minions then you can hit minions and hyperious simultaneously. money shot is pretty fun with this thing also.
__________________
Pre-Ordered-1st Day Borderlands Owner/Pre-Ordered-1st Day Borderlands 2 Owner

Borderlands - LVL:69LVL:69LVL:69LVL:69 Borderlands 2 - Maya LVL:72/Sal LVL:OP4/Axton LVL:72/Zero LVL:72/Gaige LVL:72/Krieg LVL:72
I Lurk More Than Post
Badass Rank - 82K+
Lurch87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:52 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.