The Gearbox Software Forums Go to Gearboxity.comGo to Gearbox Software's Web site

Go Back   The Gearbox Software Forums > Gearbox Games > Borderlands > Borderlands General Discussion

Closed Thread
Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.  
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old October 2nd, 2010, 08:20 AM   #1
Gothalion
I Used to Moderate Here.
 
Gothalion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 10,316
Default Borderlands, DLCs, Patch 1.41 and You! (Scaling explanation for new folks)

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamF View Post
So here are some more specifics from our dev team in regards to this patch and the scaling.. Big props to Steve J for providing this info for you guys

In the Main Game, DLC1, and DLC4

-These areas only change on the second playthrough once the "Find Steele" mission has been completed. We have always called this 'PT 2.5'. The base level of the game in playthrough 2.5 had been 50 but with this update that level can now go up based on player progression.

Enemy base levels will go up if the players level is at least 49. Enemy base level will be +2 until the base level reaches the level cap.


DLC3

-DLC3 extended the level cap and so it doesn't have the same type of PT 2.5 as the rest of the game. In DLC3 the completion of the 'Loot Larceny' mission created something similar to PT 2.5 except that it adds 5 to each area's base level instead of raising all of DLC3 to max. With the update though DLC3's PT 2.5 will rise in level along with the player once the player is at least one level below whatever the level of each area would otherwise be. Enemy and gear then follow the same rules as the main game.


Crawmermax area was always 61 in both PT's.. so now with the new patch if the host player is at least lvl 60 then Crawmermax will be the host players level +2 until it reaches the level cap.
Ok lets break this down.

Theres alot of speculation about how scaling will work. Some worry that it will just raise the enemy caps to 61 and 58. Not true.

Basically as mentioned above there are "trigger quests" that activate the scaling effect. After said quests are completed, so long as the player is at the base level of whatever area they are in, said area will scale to the players level.

Triggers for Zombie Island, Robolution and Borderlands Original will be the "Find Steel" mission where you go to the vault.

Trigger for Secret armory of General Knoxx areas will be the "loot larceny" mission.

'What about the crawmerax mission completion? Do I need that for scaling?'
No, completion of the Crawmerax mission only related to initial levels of Robot Revolution. Once the scaling patch hits, this requirement will all but be voided and enemies will scale accordingly to your level. Do not worry about enemies being max level if you have not defeated crawmerax... if you are lvl 69, enemies and gear will be level 69 regardless of crawmerax status.
Scaling only takes effect in Playthrough 2. If you completed these quests on PT 1, then there will be no scaling effect.

'So will enemies and gear be the right level everywhere or just in certain areas?'
Post Patch, everything will scale to your level. In all areas. All DLCs. All enemies will drop level appropriate gear. COMs from what I understand will remain a quality comparable to the lvl 55 coms. Example; Zombies will be level 58/69 and drop level 58/69 gear at end game. Same goes for robolution enemies. Knoxx enemies and areas will scale up after you reach level 60.

'What about chests man?'
Chests will have level appropriate loot as well. If you are level 54, they should have gear around that level in them. They will not just jump to cap. Lance chests included.

'What about Crawmerax?'
Crawmerax will scale up as well and remain the appropriate amount of levels above the player. He will still drop a butt load of loot. As to whether he will drop max level loot (he currently drops lvl 60 loot) I wouldnt be surprised if he only drops level 68 loot. Why? Well because of the volume of loot he drops. I believe they want there to still be reason to go out and hunt other areas for loot. Max stat loot is usually found in chests. So if they make HIGH end gear drop from Crawmerax but not maximum statistic gear, it gives those of us who are obsessed with finding the best of the best a reason to go out and farm, see the rest of the game. This move was likely intention and a very smart design move. This game is Borderlands afterall, not Craw-Killer-2010.

'Are the chests from Farmory also scalable, or are they a special case?'
They havent mentioned it in any posts, but as far as I understand chests act independantly... as the farmory has been mentioned in the known issues thread... and they added a mini farmory in DLC4... I wouldnt be surprised if the chests remain level 61 in the farmory post patch... thats purely an educated guess though. It could go either way.

'Will quest rewards scale?'
No quest rewards will likely not scale as the trigger quests are at the end of main quest lines I can only assume its geared towards end game. Alot of quest rewards can be found as boss drops though throughout the game. Though there is a chance that any quests you save may scale. I wouldnt hold my breath on that to be honest.

'Do we know if scaling will kick in the main game, or the DLCs prior to completing the "trigger quests"?'
I dont believe it will. From the sounds of it, it only effects end game. Hence why the Trigger quests are at the end of main quest chains. Also that would be a great deal more programing, I believe, to make the game constantly scale to level rather than just playthrough 2.5.

'Wasnt the new DLC supposed to raise the level cap by 8? Im not getting any experience for my kills or quests'
No, that is coming in a new patch to be released in October. Gearbox didnt want to make players pay for this level cap increase and are giving it away for free... the enemy scaling is in the same patch

'Will the new patch fix issues such as bugged Knoxx quests? Some may have Loot Larceny bugged.'
HIGHLY unlikely. These quests are mostly bugged by the user when using a known terrain exploit to get into the Armory without a timer... hence why they bug.

'When I download the patch sometime in October, can I simply expect to be a level 69 with my enemies generally level 69?'
No, you will be level 61 initially and need to level up via left over qesting and enemy grinding.

'Will the experience Ive collected since hitting level cap count towards my new levels? I.E. will I automatically level up once the patch is installed?'
No. Just as when DLC3 hit, you will need to gain the full experience requirements to increase your level.

'But I dont have Knoxx, will I be able to get level 69?"
No, you will cap at level 58, and the gear dropping under your host will be 58 as well.

'Ive heard that there is going to be a Playthrough 3. Is this true?'
No, not really. Its actually going to just modify the current Playthrough 2.5 so that enemies scale to host level. This got mixed up in a couple interviews but AdamF confirmed it will simply be a modified 2.5.

'When will patch 1.41 be released?'
No official date as of yet but early November, maybe maybe sooner.

'Will there be new weapons or skills?'
There will be leveled up versions of all your gear. Except Coms. Theyll max out at 55. Do not expect new weapon types or varieties. There will not be extended skill trees.

'Will there be Pearl weapons outside of Knoxx areas after 1.41?'
No. Pearls will remain Knoxx exclussive.

THERE IS NOT A PLAYTHROUGH 3! THIS PATCH WAS CREATED TO ENHANCE ENDGAME. ENDGAME WAS THE ORIGINAL REQUEST BY THE COMMUNITY. DO NOT LITTER THIS THREAD (and preferably these forums) WITH COMPLAINTS ABOUT PLAYTHROUGH 3.

I will answer any legit/well-worded questions and add them to the OP
__________________

Last edited by Gothalion; October 27th, 2010 at 04:22 PM.
Gothalion is offline  
Old October 2nd, 2010, 08:29 AM   #2
afk brb 2
Whats Borderlands?
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: the land of 19
Posts: 92
Default Re: Borderlands, DLCs, Patch 1.5 and You! (Scaling explanation for new folks)

Cool. I have a level 50 soldier and i tried to play RR and the enemies were like lv 43. So after i saw that i figured id wait to play the new dlc until the scaling patch hits. Now will i have to go and find a trigger quest or will the game look for other trigger quests ive already done, And level everything across all dlc?
afk brb 2 is offline  
Old October 2nd, 2010, 08:33 AM   #3
nightwolf613
Revy Two Hands
 
nightwolf613's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: NC, USA
Posts: 1,143
Default Re: Borderlands, DLCs, Patch 1.5 and You! (Scaling explanation for new folks)

Noticed this wasn't cover and I am sure someone might ask this...

Quests most likely will NOT scale. Thus the rewards will be around the level of the quests.

Correct me if I am wrong on this....I know I'd like to be wrong on this one
__________________

Thank You Gearbox for keeping offline LAN available for Borderlands 2.
My Artwork http://jamesanimefan.deviantart.com/
nightwolf613 is offline  
Old October 2nd, 2010, 08:42 AM   #4
Gothalion
I Used to Moderate Here.
 
Gothalion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 10,316
Default Re: Borderlands, DLCs, Patch 1.5 and You! (Scaling explanation for new folks)

Good question. Easy answer.

No quest rewards will likely not scale as the trigger quests are at the end of main quest lines I can only assume its geared towards end game. Alot of quest rewards can be found as boss drops though throughout the game.
__________________
Gothalion is offline  
Old October 2nd, 2010, 09:24 AM   #5
Cass277
Poo-bah
 
Cass277's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: England
Posts: 3,039
Default Re: Borderlands, DLCs, Patch 1.5 and You! (Scaling explanation for new folks)

Ya, but the cool thing is that you can get mostly all of the quest rewards again in PT2.5 by killing a specific boss, like Moe drops a Lady Finger, Rakkinshu drops a Sentinel, etc.

I can't wait to get me a full set of elemental Doves (Slither).
__________________
Vermivorous kills: lost count (1 Slag Nasty Surprise, 1 Superduperfly, 1 Legendary Siren mod).
Cass277 is offline  
Old October 2nd, 2010, 10:01 AM   #6
Zarnon
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: New London, NH
Posts: 2,101
Default Re: Borderlands, DLCs, Patch 1.5 and You! (Scaling explanation for new folks)

Quote:
Originally Posted by nightwolf613 View Post
Noticed this wasn't cover and I am sure someone might ask this...

Quests most likely will NOT scale. Thus the rewards will be around the level of the quests.

Correct me if I am wrong on this....I know I'd like to be wrong on this one
That's probably right in regards to vanilla sidequests (since they didn't scale up in 2.5) but quests in the DLC do have the ability to scale.
For instance, if you hold off on "Purple Juice" in Knoxx until after the armory, it scales up and will give a higher level Chiquito Amigo.
With the new patch, I suspect the quest will go all the way to the cap, and give a level 67-69 Amigo.
Zarnon is offline  
Old October 2nd, 2010, 10:15 AM   #7
nightwolf613
Revy Two Hands
 
nightwolf613's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: NC, USA
Posts: 1,143
Default Re: Borderlands, DLCs, Patch 1.5 and You! (Scaling explanation for new folks)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zarnon View Post
That's probably right in regards to vanilla sidequests (since they didn't scale up in 2.5) but quests in the DLC do have the ability to scale.
For instance, if you hold off on "Purple Juice" in Knoxx until after the armory, it scales up and will give a higher level Chiquito Amigo.
With the new patch, I suspect the quest will go all the way to the cap, and give a level 67-69 Amigo.
That is most certainly interesting. Good info to have, especially for those of us who never noticed it. I wonder if those in DLC4 are that way. I haven't tried it at 61 yet but I know without killing Craw currently if you go into PT1 with a character in their 40s the quests seem to be in late 30s. I haven't had time to look at those in PT1 if you have killed Craw to see if they scaled to 61. If they so scale then we can expect them to scale as well in regards to your level.
__________________

Thank You Gearbox for keeping offline LAN available for Borderlands 2.
My Artwork http://jamesanimefan.deviantart.com/
nightwolf613 is offline  
Old October 2nd, 2010, 10:23 AM   #8
Shagsbeard
Resident Mathematician
 
Shagsbeard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,484
Default Re: Borderlands, DLCs, Patch 1.5 and You! (Scaling explanation for new folks)

Question: Do we know if scaling will kick in the main game, or the DLCs prior to completing the "trigger quests"? My main concern is that no matter what you do in borderlands, you have to sacrifice one thing to do another. You have to skip DLC content on PT1 to have the main game stay at reasonable difficulty/reward. You have to skip side quests in order for Story quests to remain "Normal" or "Difficult". It's this skip stuff or else that I hope is dealt with in the patch.
Shagsbeard is offline  
Old October 2nd, 2010, 10:43 AM   #9
Te1vanni Guard
I am the ‹bermensch!
 
Te1vanni Guard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Virginia
Posts: 1,558
Default Re: Borderlands, DLCs, Patch 1.5 and You! (Scaling explanation for new folks)

Question: Are the chests from Farmory also scalable, or are they a special case?

I know it's not the latter, but I can hope.
__________________
Tourettes:
Still torn between Quick Charge and Stat. Went with a balance. (Each at 4, or will be after the Robovolution.)
Te1vanni Guard is offline  
Old October 2nd, 2010, 11:15 AM   #10
Gothalion
I Used to Moderate Here.
 
Gothalion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 10,316
Default Re: Borderlands, DLCs, Patch 1.5 and You! (Scaling explanation for new folks)

Quote:
Originally Posted by afk brb 2 View Post
Cool. I have a level 50 soldier and i tried to play RR and the enemies were like lv 43. So after i saw that i figured id wait to play the new dlc until the scaling patch hits. Now will i have to go and find a trigger quest or will the game look for other trigger quests ive already done, And level everything across all dlc?
Hrmmm this was on PT2 right. But you dont have knoxx.. yeah the RR starts in the lower/mid 40's if you have find steel completed... but after the patch it will all scale up... i made mention of this in the OP already. All DLC will scale to level. If you have find steel completed then DLC1, DLC4 and Vanilla will scale. Knoxx will scale after after loot larceny.
__________________
Gothalion is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:06 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.