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Old September 8th, 2012, 04:19 PM   #11
Wildcat67
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Default Re: 5/5 why do people insist on doing it?

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Originally Posted by ZABIMARU-_- View Post
Gunna need to see some fancy math charts before I believe in diminishing returns
The theory is that it's the same stat increase at level 5 that it is at level 1. It isn't an exponential increase. So assuming two skill are generally equivelent, there is no reason to say that adding the 5th skill to one does more then adding the 1st skill to the other.

So, having a skill that's really good and making it a little better isn't as good as not having a skill at all and then having it a little.
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Old September 8th, 2012, 04:20 PM   #12
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Default Re: 5/5 why do people insist on doing it?

It just depends on which skills are better. For example, in a Zer0 melee build I would put 4/5 in Rising Shot and 1 into Death mark, so that I can advance to Innervate and put the most points into it that I can (the extra movement speed would be very useful when trying to chain deceptions).

Otherwise, I'd much rather be awesome at a few things than slightly above average in many things, which is why people choose to 5/5 most of the skills that are directly applicable to their build. A 5% increase in several different stats is hardly noticeable, while a 25% increase to one stat is very noticeable and therefore you can adjust your playstyle to exploit that strength.
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Old September 8th, 2012, 04:21 PM   #13
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Default Re: 5/5 why do people insist on doing it?

I don't think it's a matter of people thinking there's accelerating returns (which most of the time isn't the case). I think it's more that people like some skills more than others so they're going to invest in the one they like better.
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Old September 8th, 2012, 04:22 PM   #14
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Default Re: 5/5 why do people insist on doing it?

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So why on earth would I put points into a melee skill? Or increasing the length of my phaselock when I am intending to kill them long before that phaselock ends, or certainly plant enough damage into them that its unneccesary to hold them any longer, therefore wasting the points...
Of course this only applies if there are other skills you would use. You wouldn't just put points into something you didn't think was good or that you wouldn't use. This is for the situation where you have a few skills that could be of use. You can focus primarily on one by going 4/5 but I don't feel the 5th point is worth it over having a skill I would otherwise have to forgo IF I can use that skill.
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Old September 8th, 2012, 04:24 PM   #15
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Default Re: 5/5 why do people insist on doing it?

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Originally Posted by Wildcat67 View Post
The theory is that it's the same stat increase at level 5 that it is at level 1. It isn't an exponential increase. So assuming two skill are generally equivelent, there is no reason to say that adding the 5th skill to one does more then adding the 1st skill to the other.

So, having a skill that's really good and making it a little better isn't as good as not having a skill at all and then having it a little.
Good sir, In the absolute politest way I can say this.. You just made me laugh.
I wont even go into explaining this because I don't need the infraction.
Though I'm sure someone will do it for me soon enough.

But as the others said, people use 5/5 for certain builds/playstyles.
Especially when the alternative skill they could put 1/5 in is not as appealing to them.

There is no right or wrong way to build as long as your doing it based off of personal choice/what you like.
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Last edited by Artell; September 8th, 2012 at 04:25 PM.
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Old September 8th, 2012, 04:24 PM   #16
robotsdontcry
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Default Re: 5/5 why do people insist on doing it?

There a couple things to take into account:

1/ OCD yeah green is cool.
2/ Some talents aren't that useful depending on some playstyles. For exemple for my siren i plan on an all out agressive elemental based build. In that build, and because i love that overly agressive elemental fireworks, i'd rather have all points ramped up in the agressive talents that fit that tree rather than diverting myself in all the trees:

Why would i sacrifice 5% critical damage for 5% health regen if in my game plan i don't care about health regen?

3/ The effectiveness of this will depend on the class mods you get too. I plan on using a mostly 5/5 build for my siren and for my other chars, because i found builds that did convey my playstyle, but i may reset and move some points depending on the class mod. But to be honest without said mod, i don't see the use of it.


Long story short: Depending on your game plan and game play, i firmly believe that 5/5 is a totally viable option.
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Old September 8th, 2012, 04:25 PM   #17
Wildcat67
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Default Re: 5/5 why do people insist on doing it?

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Originally Posted by Jaquio View Post
It just depends on which skills are better. For example, in a Zer0 melee build I would put 4/5 in Rising Shot and 1 into Death mark, so that I can advance to Innervate and put the most points into it that I can (the extra movement speed would be very useful when trying to chain deceptions).

Otherwise, I'd much rather be awesome at a few things than slightly above average in many things, which is why people choose to 5/5 most of the skills that are directly applicable to their build. A 5% increase in several different stats is hardly noticeable, while a 25% increase to one stat is very noticeable and therefore you can adjust your playstyle to exploit that strength.
But it's not about a 25% increase vs. a 5% increase. It's about the DIFFERENCE between 20%-25% and 0%-5%. Or another way of putting it..

25% and 0%
or
20% and 5%
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Old September 8th, 2012, 04:25 PM   #18
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Default Re: 5/5 why do people insist on doing it?

your logic goes both ways though.

say you have 2 skills, one is 5% per point of fire rate, and one is 5% per point of damage.

YOU SAY: i would rather have 5% less damage, so i can have that fire rate skill too.

I SAY: i would rather have 25% damage than s tiny buff to fire rate that i probably wont ever notice.

perspective.
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Old September 8th, 2012, 04:26 PM   #19
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Default Re: 5/5 why do people insist on doing it?

Okay so, here for example is my build, the final 2 points going into kinetic reflection.



Explaining my choices...

Flicker vs Foresight... why would I waste 1 point in foresight when I get 50% reload speed from inertia?

Immolate is a clutch skill, if you dont go down, why would you need a skill to give you more damage? (I also intend to be playing mainly co-op where fight for your life is a little less desperate).

Next set, Chain reaction vs Backdraft, a very simply choice, what am I using, guns or melee? This time Guns, no need for Backdraft.

It continues like this, there really is no gain from splitting trees.
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Old September 8th, 2012, 04:27 PM   #20
Wildcat67
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Default Re: 5/5 why do people insist on doing it?

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Originally Posted by Artell View Post
Good sir, In the absolute politest way I can say this.. You just made me laugh.
I wont even go into explaining this because I don't need the infraction.
Though I'm sure someone will do it for me soon enough.

But as the others said, people use 5/5 for certain builds/playstyles.
Especially when the alternative skill they could put 1/5 in is not as appealing to them.

There is no right or wrong way to build as long as your doing it based off of personal choice/what you like.
I never meant to imply that it was wrong. I'm just questioning if we should be so sure that the way it's done now is right? I do the same thing. But is it REALLY the best possible way of doing it?
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