A possibly reasonable response to the Oct 29th, 2015 Patch

(NOTE: These opinions do not necessarily reflect those of Gearbox).

Before I begin this.

Please look at this endearing and lovely photo of two otters hugging;

THEY’RE SO CUTE. How can anything in the world be bad, when they’re just so god-damn adorable?

Now on to the substance. I’ve counted several threads issuing grievances against Gearbox’s new patch, and made sure to read through them, as well as consider the points being made.

The real question that must be asked is; “Is there really a response that Gearbox can have to any of these issues which doesn’t provoke a guttural response?”

Yes. They removed an exploit which allowed for weapon merging. Which is something they must do. Weapon merging is not a viable aspect of game play. If it were, we’d have the joy of listening to Scooter or Marcus explain the functions of it with the same disdain we have when we do the “Weapon Types” quest for the third consecutive time.

A portion of the community complained at the use of the exploit during online matches. A portion of the community enjoyed having the easy route during many UVHM missions. The GBX staff had the option of either pleasing the portion playing the game collectively and wanting functions to operate properly, or pleasing those benefiting from an aspect which should’ve never been in the game.

Gearbox opted to do more work at their expense.

Yes. Gearbox removed a function which allowed the player to scale the game to 4 player difficulty. This function had many people walking carlessly in to the area in 1 player mode, and facing enemies meant for 4p (known as a nice trip to the Inferno). A portion of the community used it to spawn Verm, and Tubbies. The GBX staff had the option of allowing more people to accidentally walk in to their own deaths, or inversely, remove a function which wasn’t meant to be in the game.

Gearbox opted to do more work at their expense.

I am aware that they could implement a difficulty slider, which in fairness, may make many of these complaints disappear. They should probably do that, I would be all for it. I do not however believe that they’re required to to do so.

It is not “game breakingly bad” to not have a Twister, or certain Pearlescents, or even spawn Verm.

These are all doable aspects to the game. None of which affect your trophy count, your ability to play nearly every aspect, and the general joy of the game.

GBX is not putting in hours of work to grief their fans. They’re a business, and as such are looking to please them, not out of the desire for a higher function, but because they like making money. Veiled threats of; “I’ll take my business elsewhere” are laughable, as they’re seeking to implement a business standard which is far more important than a single gripe.

If there were a special kind of gun that could only be attained in online 4p mode, I would in no way be hurt by the idea. It doesn’t affect my 2p mode, nor does it make me enjoy the game any less, it is an incentive to partake in a particular aspect of the game. That aspect doesn’t need to be obtainable throughout. GBX is fully allowed to create aspects of the game which are strictly available to those playing certain modes. Hundreds, if not thousands of developers do the same thing.

Game design doesn’t mean equal opportunity distribution of all aspects of the game. Even something as basic as UVHM isn’t a granted aspect. If it is too difficult for you to play without exploitation, I’d wager that is your problem. It is not GBX’s duty to ensure you have the ability to get to the next part of the game.

I genuinely sympathize with Gearbox. When they remain inactive and leave the game as is, they’re harassed for being complacent, “stupid” for not knowing the exploit, or having abandoned their fan base. When they make changes, these changes are railed against for being “game breaking”, “unfair”, and 50 other things.

NOTE: I do know some glitches have been occurring, such as those in TPS. These are obviously not acceptable and your frustration is fair. I would say to give GBX time with it. Yes, they may have messed it up. But they are doing their best to fix the issue. You don’t genuinely believe they’re willingly alienating those who pay for their games, do you? This isn’t a small start up, this is a company who has further games they wish to sell.

I too do not agree with the removal of the strength of Zero’s Kunais, and other such aspects. If there is one thing that has been proved here, it is that they do listen to their community. Whether or not you support the changes if completely up to you. There are some which I don’t like, and I hope they change. I will voice these. I’ll do so calmly, as I don’t think that me writing in capslock will help anyone.

At best, it affects a portion of the most difficult part of the game to play. Which isn’t game breaking. It as a select aspect.

Should you hate my post and have nothing to say but that; Please send me the following PM and let the thread continue on to it’s content;

@Giuvito I hate you. Everything about you is ugly, you’re dumb, and you’re responsible for everything bad. EVER.”

I will like your message and even consider sending you a photo of a cute animal to calm you, as a token of friendship.

If you have anything to say regarding the content of the post, please respond, and I promise to read it through and give you a polite and cordial response.

Thanks for listening.


We should be thankful that GBX is still giving support to a game that is 3 YEARS old already.

100% agree with you my friend.


Required to, no. Would I greatly appreciate if they did? Yes, absolutely… :sunglasses:


Difficulty slider: available once you get to the OP levels. Very difficult to get there, but once you’re there, it’s the most brilliant way to adjust difficulty I’ve ever encountered.


I think if you objectively asked a group of people “what do you think a company which offers a patch 3 years after release” I doubt many would say;

“They’re wholly evil.”

I think much of the issue is a complaint after the fact. When people get used to doing things a certain way, they can become suddenly frustrated by the idea of having to do it another. I believe they’re more frustrated with being incapable of achieving an aspect of the game, and will seek to blame the producer to avoid the idea that they themselves may be culpable for their own inability.

Absolutely. I’d love a difficulty slider. I’m all for it. I would not blame GBX if they never add it in, or if they implement it at a cost. (I.E. You can only get Pearls/Seraphs beyond a certain difficulty.) I always love new features. While I wouldn’t blame them for not adding it in, I may be inclined to put more hours in if they do.

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There is one if you use the ability to select your OP level whenever you pick your character to place your character and his/her gear into easier (or harder) difficulty levels. For the uninitiated, here’s an example:

1; Get a character to OP8

  1. Pick a spot to park your character in the middle of the OP levels somewhere (say OP4)
  2. Use your OP8 character and gear to facilitate farming for a set of OP4 gear
  3. Play at OP4 for typical UVHM difficulty with this OP4 gear set
  4. Select OP5, 6, 7, or 8 for increasingly harder difficulty (if you thought OP8 was too easy, try it with OP4 gear).
  5. Select OP0, 1, 2, or 3 for increasingly easier difficulty (UVHM gets easy quick with severely over-leveled gear).

For bonus points, one can even “buff” gear this way. Consider your OP4 gear set in this case, that you would bring with you up and down in the OP level selection for this difficulty slider. If you want to use a gun that you find is too weak to be viable with this set, include it in your OP4 “library” at a higher level. An OP8 e-tech spiker, for example, should put out enough damage to match an OP4 “regular” pistol.

Keep these two considerations in mind when selecting your parking spot in the OP levels: park too high, and there’s no headroom to buff weak weapons; park too low, and there’s not much headroom below for easier playthroughs. I chose OP3 for my parking spot, and have balanced almost every piece of gear in the entire game to my satisfaction using this method, and I still have the option of difficulties ranging from harder than OP8, and maybe early TVHM every time I load a different character.

Also, BAR can help with this if you haven’t let it get out of hand by spending every single token you’ve earned. For example, I have about 20% buffs across the board from BAR (with over 100 unspent tokens), which I use to take the edge off of UVHM. If you’ve already let your BAR get out of hand, your only option is to turn it off, but if you haven’t gotten there yet, park it at whatever you think a reasonable amount is, and bank the tokens.

Between this and the OP system listed above, I can very finely tune the game’s difficulty. One just has to get past OP8 to “unlock” this entire slider range.

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A very good point. And one that should be noted.

I was referring for a 1-4p difficulty mode. In essence, to get around to more Tubby Spawns, or Verm and OOO. Since many people found that to be an issue.

Ah… I have inadvertently stepped in that puddle myself (usually grabbing those chests in Hayter’s Folly in front of Gee’s place, and then taking cover by the gate). “Man, I’m really starting to lose it here; all these dudes are starting to kick my ass.” :laughing:

I’d actually made it up to the Assassins with Axton using the 4 player glitch when I farmed for Vermi once- totally had forgotten about that when I wondered why things were so tough at OP zero… :grin:

If by “get to the OP levels” you mean finish UVHM, I’m all for it. I wouldn’t want the slider (if we even end up getting one) to be available only at OP8. If the slider becomes available at OP0, as soon as you finish UVHM, that is in fact a great idea. Probably the best one I’ve heard yet about implementing an official difficulty slider.

Also, I’m extremely thankful for this patch and I praise Gearbox for listening to us. I’m actually about 99% happy with the patch. I just think that there are one or two minor problems that still need fixing and that they also need to look into the problems that were caused by the patch itself before calling it done. I’m not mad at Gearbox for any of these issues or for removing any of the glitches, and I’m not demanding any solutions immediately either. I really wanted this to be the final “magic patch” this game needed to be almost perfect. Unfortunately, it wasn’t. But it sure got the game a lot closer to that. I feel this game is just one more patch away from being nearly flawless. I hope we get that patch. If we don’t… I’m just gonna keep playing the game as it is. Cause it’s still pretty damn good.

By the way, you are a gentleman and a scholar, @Giuvito. I commend you for starting this thread.


The issue is not so much about a slider as it is about the accessibility to certain enemies. Would a slider solve it? Yes it would, if it duplicated the gameplay we’re used to, but so would a programmatic slider that would make the chances of the enemies in question attainable in solo play. It’s that simple, but to the original poster’s point, GB doesn’t have to do a thing. It’s their rules, and it’s their court, and they don’t have to lower the rim for anyone. Having said that. I like the old court better than the current one.

GB has delivered on the $ we’ve spent on this game 100 fold. break it down by the hours of enjoyment/frustration/triumph/tears if you need to check.

I would love to continue to play this game in the manner that I’m used to. If it doesn’t work out, I will still play. If not, maybe this battle thing coming out will take up all of my free time, and some of my other time as well.

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You’re saying the inability to adapt when my sniper-melee commando is unable to steamroll op8 is my fault?



A much simpler solution than a slider would be to just increase their chances of spawning in solo play. Still, it’s not like they have to do anything and I wouldn’t revolt against them if they never address this. Even though this is a very common request, there are more pressing issues at hand.

If nothing else Gearbox at least has an idea that they might- might, mind you- want to include this as a feature in BL3… :sunglasses:

There is an easy and free solution. No complaints here. Start by getting a PC. The rest is easy.

We don’t approve of platform warriors here. Take that stuff elsewhere, please.


First you have to acquire a decent gaming PC which, last time I checked, cost money. So, your proposed solution isn’t really “free” for Console owners who already have a Console and a copy of Borderlands 2. A better option for Console players of Borderlands 2 would have been for GBX to boost the spawn rate of Tubbies, Vermivorous and OOO or add a difficulty slider (similar to the one PC players have) to compensate for the removal of the 4 player trick / glitch, so that solo players have a better chance of spawning those enemies. Granted, the removal of the 4 player trick / glitch is a minor annoyance considering all of the improvements the patch added. If GBX chooses to release a hotfix or patch to increase the spawn chances at some point, great. If not, that’s fine too.

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The easiest way BY FAR, just in my own opinion, would be to add Verm and OOO to an arena of their own (not together, that would be madness!), then increase the chances of tubbies spawning.

That way, people can’t complain when they can’t spawn Verm/OOO and they can’t complain if they get a spawn when they don’t want one.


I feel the same way about the patch. The needs of the many out way the needs of the few. I never used any of glitches people are complaining about that got fixed. If they could incorporate a slider that would be great as there are not many active as there were. So its difficult to spawn verm. I appreciate the patch now I can farm offline.

Many companies do not have support for a game so long after release. I take my hat off to gearbox for listening to the community and still providing support.

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