Additional spawns increase difficulty better than 12500% HP

I dont know wheather this was already discused around here because i kind of disengaged with the game after m2.0 dropped. If so, pls delet.

Playing the mtd with and without the cartel event enabled are two totally different experiences.
Additional spawns are way better to increase difficulty than bulletsponges and annoying mayhem modifiers which resemble an lsd trip gone bad.

The takedown is really enjoyable with cartel spawns, after 15 minutes rererererererolling for the least annoying modifiers.

I really whish GBX would rather utilise the additional spawn mechanic than increasing enemy HP to absurd amounts or garbage modifiers everybody and their dog tries to avoid.

More enemies = more mayhem


Having a lot more enemies instead of a few sponge enemies sounds like actual fun rather than holding the fire button for half an hour while looking deep into the soul of a hardened tink with 3 life bars.

However I somewhat doubt the game could take it performance wise. Imagine like a 1000% increase in enemy spawns and recursion Amara. The screen would probably freeze immediately.


Additional spawns directly impact performance, and they’re likely required to keep some overhead spare for events like the Cartels we’re running at the moment (and even that patch came with significant issues for a bunch of players).

I have been suggesting this forever as a difficulty substitute for the stupid mayhem modifiers. The way you counter “too many enemies” when doing this is having a scale.

You kill a trash mob it has a % chance to spawn a Badass mob. You kill a Badass mob it has a % chance to spawn some mini-boss type mob. So in this setup you are only trading one mob for one mob but a harder one. The faster/more you kill the harder the enemies potentially become and the better the loot is because the harder mobs drop more/better loot with mini-bosses maybe dropping something unique or interesting.

Each level of mayhem would modestly increase health/shields but also the % chance for harder mobs to spawn on death. This would be much more fun IMO than these stupid modifiers or insanely bloated stats and we could maybe tone down or remove item scaling which is causing all sorts of other issues. It would also be build/gun independent so if you have a cryo build that you love you don’t get cry immune enemies that invalidate your build.


No. Additional spawns make the game easier with the right weapons, e.g., Recursion.

I agree, but additional spawns also tank framerates even on decent PCs (let’s not even start on consoles) and appear to cause crashes :frowning:

I enjoy the additional spawns as well, but I also like M10, but that’s because I like the new weapons and I’m using all the best ones typically.

It’s unfortunate that we’re in this spot, because now they have to scale back the health, shield and armor values for M10 to make more guns viable but it also means they have to scale back the new weapons which I reallllly don’t like the sound of. If they mess it up and make these weapons bad I would be upset. I’d like to be optimistic but it’s a little hard with how many issues there have been.

I think there are multiple areas in the game that could use additional spawns once the story is completed. Going back through Black Barrel Cellars, for example, there were huge areas with absolutely nothing to do. This is something I’ve noticed in all the Borderlands games tbh - there will be areas with the same (or similar) spawns as soon as you trigger them, but some story locations will be pretty empty when you revisit.

The cartel spawns have been great for mobbing intensity, but it does get pretty insane. I’ve not personally had a crash that way (it was the extra vfx that did me in a couple of times before I figured it out) but I can see that being an issue. There ought to be some happy medium though.


I wouldnt be too worried of the new guns beeing scaled back.
Kaoson, opq and cake are good weapons, but lets be honest. They are only loved because they are strong. They are not that special.
When i ask ppl their favorite weapon its almost always the current meta. Simply because those guns are powerful right now.

Scaling down the meta together with enemy hp will only make more guns viable.


There’s some truth in that, but they are also very good weapons in their own right, with their fire rate, accuracy and damage, specially the Kaoson. But they’re also M6 weapons, except the O.P.Q so they should stand out above other weapons.

But I agree we should have more weapons being viable than we do now for sure.

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I mean, you aren’t wrong. More enemies = more damage. The only issue I see is the being further pushed into using splash/recursion/redistributer builds and pushing single target guns, especially sniper rifles, out of viability. Its a difficult balancing act.

The answer to that would be more waves rather then simply more spawns. I think there are some areas this would work well for. Things like the proving grounds would have to have the timers adjusted for the optional objectives, but for general mobbing areas it could work pretty well.

If ppl can play a slaughter circle thry can handle this.

Its really the light pollution and vfx which causes issues on consoles and pc
I dont mind a few immune enemies but having. Like 10 outta 12 randomly like this game currently does is insane. Now if they where a special badass spawn. Like the juggernauts and heavys which are immune or resistant than thats ok.

Having a boss suddenly be immune… Oh hell nawl. Frost resistant wotan. Becomes corrosive immune. Lmao

I love the idea of extra and more enemy types and waves.

Instead of flat out immunity they should just have certain enemies be resistant.

Read my suggestion above. Having tougher enemies spawn on death doesn’t make recursion any better or snipers any worse. Yes, more enemies spawn but it’s always one for a harder one (and not 100% of the time). So it doesn’t create huge amounts of extra enemies just tougher enemies over time the more you kill. It might actually make sniper type weapons even more valuable as you need to take down tougher enemies not necessarily more enemies.