An Interesting perspective on Battleborn's story mode

Oh, there’s definitely an LGBT character in BB. It’s Ambra. I wasn’t sure until the Alani lore came out (not a pun I swear), but that pretty much cemented it. Unless swooning over women and giving them pieces of your clothing means something else to the BB writers than it does to me, anyway!

I feel like most of the characters are meant to encourage an open reading. We already know that Shayne’s character designer thinks of them as genderqueer. And there’s no way Mellka doesn’t get a lot of female attention with the way she presents herself. I should know :wink:

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Hm, methinks I hadn’t read that lore. I wasn’t sure if Shayne’s look was just classic Tomboyism or fully into genderqueer (and I also may not REALLY know the diff) but if that’s what the designer was going for, that’s cool.

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Gearbox character design totally killed any gender exclusivity I had when picking which characters to play.

Choosing not to play a character due to any personal preference or social norm (to me) is like buying a full priced game and then only playing 2 missions from it and thinking you’ve experienced all there is to the game. I’m not saying anyone here is doing that (sounds like quite the opposite in fact), just if you happen to think that way (or know of someone who does), you/they should really reconsider and give other characters a go.

At the very least, I would recommend trying out every character for at least 2-3 hours of play, because you could be missing out on another awesome character to add to your favourites list. Mellka was that for me until I got to play as her in the Prologue and then I had to wait until I unlocked her before I could play as her again. :sob:

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I am! And I’m not ashamed!

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Each to their own I guess :wink: I have a brother who is very much a “I will not play as a chick!!” person and he is not even willing to try despite how I tell him how awesome some of the female characters can be.

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I’ve spent so many years having to play games with male protagonists, I just revel in the choice for female characters in this game. In one session, I might play Mellka, Ambra, Reyna and Galilea… Tons of variety without having to play a male character to get it. So refreshing.

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Inclusivity. Gearbox does it well, and I love 'em for that.

Might also explain why BB isn’t doing so hot, like Overwatch (to invoke a clear example of the lingering misogyny among online gamers).

I have an 18 y/o daughter who beats my @$$ at most games, and a 14 y/o stepdaughter who is a complete Skyrim addict. I want more WELL-WRITTEN female characters in games. I want those two to have that.

Gearbox delivers. <3

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This, all of this. Also, I didn’t read anything like Shayne being genderqueer in her lore, just stuff about her relationship with Aurox and how she got to be in the Rouges.

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Well, afaik, GBX hasn’t included any transsexual, transgender, or asexual (as in, belonging to a traditionally heterosexual species but not interest and quite possibly squicked out by sex) individuals. They’ve been absolutely amazing about making homosexual and bisexual individuals completely and totally normal (e.g. there’s not a token gay in the cast). I can’t find it, but I remember during one of the borderlands AMAs, someone asked about why the BL games are so LGBT-friendly and the response was something like “You mean people actually cared about that stuff back in your time?” It really demonstrated GBX’s mentality behind it: in the future, even in a world of psychopathic violent murderhobos, no one will give the slightest ■■■■ whether you are straight, gay, or bi.

The first two I can understand to some extent because, while many people nowadays couldn’t give two ■■■■■ about which body parts a person has preference for, the idea that someone can change which parts they have or might want to have different parts is a whole different thing (personally, I think it has more to do with lingering homophobia in the sense that a hetero man might fight a woman attractive only to find out that she used to be male, triggering dissonant feelings of homosexuality, to which the only apparent coping mechanism is violent or hostile defensiveness).

(interestingly enough, on that topic, science has actually proven that trans individuals have the brain structure of the gender they identify as, not as the gender they were born with, via MRI and fMRI; when they say they feel like they’re a “man trapped in a woman’s body” or vice versa, they are, quite literally, telling the truth; SCIENCE)

The third, saying this as an asexual individual, is probably due to the fact that asexuals haven’t ever really been discriminated against and are pretty much ignored by society as a whole. Also, most of the people I’ve ever dealt with had a really hard time wrapping their heads about completely lacking any sexual drive or interest in sex whatsoever. It’s also hard to demonstrate asexuality without making it seem like apathy or disinterest rather than an actual orientation.

Going back to the topic, one thing I will say about BB is that, while they did a good job of making the female characters powerful, independent, and multidimensional (and how Mellka is the most obvious protagonist in a game with an ensemble cast; I’m also pretty sure that every single mission in BB passes the Bechdel Test, which is a pretty good indicator of gender equality), they’re all still thin, traditionally attractive women. BL had Ellie as kind of the token “not skinny/traditionally attractive character”, which is something, but all of the BB female characters follow a pretty similar body type: skinny and lean, but not muscular (even Galilea, who is covered up, doesn’t seem particularly bulky which one might expect from a sword swinging space paladin).

I’d like to see them take the same approach with the women as they did with the male character models: go for a larger variety of body types for the women. I’d like to see at least one great big bruiser that’s female (it’s also why I want the grenade chicken DLC char to be female since she’s short and stocky; also, the whole “eggs” thing fits perfectly for a grenadier).

I also think it’d be funny if the answer to the question of “what does a female Thrall look like” is “what do you mean? you’ve been fighting them the entire time; they’re called Bonecrushers and Enforcers”.

Also, not sure if you guys realized this, but, none of the tanks are female and all but one of the support characters are female (Miko definitely espoused more female traits than masculine traits and used a female voice actor); of the 11 female characters (Miko included), 4 of them are support. There’s definitely a “women are support and/or frail; men are tough/strong and protective” bias in the game.

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Not sure I 100% agree with you there. Exhibit A: Reyna. A bit racial-stereotype-y? Perhaps (which means YEAH). But yeah, not your traditional beauty there to be sure. And Orendi? Can’t imagine how having four arms and black feet qualifies as traditional attractiveness, but alright.

This reminds me of the convo over in BL somewhere, about whether Tiny Tina is bi. I’m thinking, “She’s a pre-teen, so she’s not ANYTHING sexual for several years, sick f**ks!”

At any rate, they’re all cartoons. Old Kleese (might’ve babysat Jesus, or witnessed the invention of rocks), Ghalt (as many chins as a … oh, nevermind).

We do agree that only the LGB of LGBTQ has been addressed so far. It’s the biggest step in the mainstream of video games yet taken, though, and I’m as proud of Gearbox for that as can be. We’re not there yet. We’ll get there. And in all likelihood, it’ll be a Gearbox title that gets there first.

As for why there aren’t any overweight or out-of-shape Battleborn, well, you ARE familiar with the concept of combat, right? Doesn’t tend to be forgiving of poor physical condition, or even mediocrity. Come on, we want to keep our game REALISTIC! (And I’m gonna go play a sentient toadstool healer attempting to capture a rogue AI and save the last star in the universe.) :wink:

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A big booty is race related? Last time I checked I had her hips & butt, all in white :smile: Love Reyna. Though I´d need to wear a corset to have her waistline, I think she´s still a good example of a “not-thin-but-not-fat-and-definately-beautifull-as-she-is”-woman.

Side note: I think I develope a crush on Deande… She´s such a wonderfully written character. Assassin and spy for centuries, but still a bit childish, very positive and she´s proud while sometimes derpy.
And though she´s sustained and an assassin she seems to cherish life in all forms - I mean she cries for poor Wolf-Sentry! (Love her callouts in “Voids Edge”)

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Check how she holds her weapon, too. Along with the ‘big booty’. Skin tone. Etc. Hell, listen to her lines. #YaThink

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Mhhh, I really was just wondering about the booty=race-thingy, I´m usually quiet blind when it comes to stereotypes… Is there a latino way to hold a gun?! O.O

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As woman I don´t really see this point. There is Galilea, feared by all mortals. There are Shayne & Aurox (no tanks, but fine controller). Thorn is a monster. Phoebe is a princesslike monster, but still, a monster.
I agree they look a bit frail, but thats all I see there…

Also in contrary we have males as OM. A poem-writing soldier who shares his feelings in a diary.
I think GBX did a great job to show a rather natural diversity of personalities.

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He totally is. Remember he enslaved his own daughter well before the events of the pre-sequel. The only reason he wanted to stop Zarpedon from destroying Elips was to save the vault. Saving the people of Elpis was incidental. Also, he had insider information because his daughter, Angel, was a siren. He knew about the vaults and the key and put himself and others into those circumstances for his own gain.

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Any one thing, and I could let it slide. But the totality of it is that it seems to lean on stereotypes. I’d give GBX the credit to say they’re plying that to try to appeal more broadly, and not to parody a particular demo. Still…

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I gotta say guys this has just been an absolutely wonderful thread to read. Hits so many nails on the head in such a positive tone. +1 to everyone :slight_smile:

I do love the idea also that this is actually the story of deande and Mellka as well

@TheRAbbi I don’t think that’s an issue. They are all about accentuation in this game to the point of near cartoony. They do it quite widely, but in all reality they never make fun of any stereotypes for what they are. They just have fun with it. Lumberjack, luchador, mushroom ninja, space vampire, avatar the last water bender- errrr I mean water monk. It’s all light hearted fun

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Have another like! And honestly? This is pretty much confirmed for me by a scene in the ending which focuses very directly on Deande and Mellka. It just seems like a very personal moment in the midst of all the crazy that’s been going on. And the two of them tend to be very important to most of the plots.

I’m not sure how much more I can say about this but I’ve praised Gearbox before and how progressive I feel Battleborn is. The thing is? I’m neurodiverse and I don’t really feel comfortable with a lot of how so much of gaming is today. I don’t really know why. I just always felt more at home in the '90s and early '00s.

There was just a certain progressiveness back then. I mean, it wasn’t unusual to have a goth girl, a hispanic guy, a dude in a wheelchair, and a chubby black guy (who’s a total puppy dog and about as far away from Samuel L. Jackson as anyone cuold be) in a cartoon. (Extreme Ghostbusters, if you’re curious. Shush, I was fond of that show.) That point in history is my home.

Battleborn isn’t perfect, not at all, but they were trying to do something completely different. And I think they get an A for effort. I really do appreciate that. We still have a long way to go, and in a video games industry that feels like it’s regressed back to the '50s in regards to diversity? Battleborn really stands out as something special.

I’ve pointed out before that Benedict is a really nuanced, subtle take on a disabled person. It’s like how Oscar Mike is so meta. Most people wouldn’t register him as disabled because he’s not in any way that an earth dweller could easily relate to. In fact, the last time I brought it up it was assumed I was talking about Kleese.

Benedict’s wing for a race that can fly without limits is a huge disability. For us, Benedict losing part of a wing would be like losing part of a leg. It severely inhibits his mobility but he’s got the stubbornness and the insistence to not be seen as useless that’s common amongst the disabled. I can speak from experience.

It’s clever because it completely sidesteps expectations and plays with what the viewer thinks a disability is and how it can affect a person.

The fact that Benedict shouts things like ‘flightless bird my butt’ and pushes how majestic he is when in the air belies his pain over losing part of his wing. Again, these are attitudes that can be found in the disabled community as people don’t want to be seen as lesser or subhuman, it can have an interesting effect on the mind.

That’s why Benedict matters to me. He’s my icon for a reason. I have a very specific understanding of him that will evade healthy players. He was put there for disabled people like me to have someone to relate to. And that’s fantastic. I really don’t see disabled people much in video games.

I think everyone deserves characters they can look up to and bond with. This is especially important for younger audiences, but it helps as adults as well. So I think that having Mellka and Deande play such dominant roles in the story is important. It gives them presence in the game. And that Mellka is so flat-chested too and doesn’t push impossible beauty standards? S’great.

Just my views. Feel free to disagree!

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Some real talk, there. El Dragon also has prosthetic arms!

I read the article and immediately thought “Wait, what? Did Galt and Kleese not exist?”. Not because of some rush to defend the menfolk, but because i thought the thing BB accomplished so well was that so many people got an equal shake in the story. 4 factions out 5 narrate the story missions. Of those 4 you get 2 presumed men and 2 presumed women. Different ages, colors, alien races.

The omission of Galt in the article is kind of strange. It is his crew, his ship. The missing Rogues leader is likewise, kind of weird. If Reyna was part of the storytelling outside of her occasional line drop, no different than any other character, then yeah, the author’s point would be more obvious. BB’s women are badasses, for sure. But, then again it is for every kind of badass.

And Kleese is not annoying…

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