Anyone else worried about iron bear scaling?

In all the level 30 gameplay I have seen it seems like iron bear is capable of holding it’s own and moze looks even better.

I’m worried that once level increases start coming out the bear will get comparatively weaker and weaker. I’m sure moze will be good regardless but I dont want the mech to become totally useless.

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I didn’t think about that till you brought it up, NOW I’m a little concerned. Thanks for that! I hope Gearbox would keep that in mind and sclale IB accordingly.

Well I’m thinking the same thing, or at least be willing to patch it if it needs it since they spent like 6 months perfecting it.

But the summonable pets and such haven’t had a good history.

Granted, but hopefully they have learned from there past mistakes. Iron Bear isn’t a pet, it’s a tank and an essential part of Moze’s character. So they shouldn’t nerf it. If they did they would incur the wrath of every Moze fan on the planet.

O.K. so they nerfed IB… How does one incur wrath upon someone?

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Very true, I’m going to have faith and definitely enjoy it as much as I can before the first level cap increase comes out.

But you better believe I will have an amara at 50 also before that happens in case history repeats itself.

Good idea, I’m going to play Fl4k as a secondary character.

I will try the other 3 out before deciding. But amara is currently in second place with fl4k right behind her.

I have to flip a coin to choose between Amara and Zane. I think I’m leaning towards Zane one moment, then Amara the next.

Honest question, where does this come from? At the very least in borderlands 2, DT when specced properly was very much able to hold his own and scaled in the OP levels. In TPS, Wilhelm’s pet build was basically the meta, and roid Jack was capable of one shotting almost every boss in the game, including eclipse if he didn’t have phases.

With the exception of turrets, which definitely weren’t really meant to do damage especially after tvhm, which summoned abilities have a bad history in borderlands after borderlands 2? At the very least in TPS, summoned abilities work great.

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Is that true? I remember my Bloodwing in BL1 absolutely destroying enemies to the point where I never had to fire a shot when I was playing with my friends.

Admittedly, it probably comes from a lot of Roland and Axton game time and going off of what I heard not experienced. I may be totally off here, but I was under the impression that this could be an issue.

Death Trap was terrible and Wilhelm was even worst…that is all.

See, this is all I have heard. They were decent for the first playthrough then steadily went downhill from there.

Let me clarify…they are not. Its just UVHM was unforgiving towards non broken mechanics.

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You can get both of those action skills to the point that they one-hit everything that’s not a boss. Wolf is borderline broken cause he hardly ever dies, if you’re in a dense map with +6 rolling thunder he will start instant-killing stuff as it spawns by the end of it.

Deathtrap is a different issue. The amount of damage deathtrap does when you have a Hide of Terra + element matching with Make it Sparkle is genuinely broken - as in like, way more than he’s intended to do. He can literally hit for damage cap at OP10. But his AI is kinda wonky sometimes and they needed to give him some kind of health regen skill or something to make up for how much bullet-heavy maps can hurt him in the OP levels.

The fact that both of those action skills can last forever and stack damage bonuses infinitely is honestly a little busted. I don’t know why people think they can’t do good damage

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  1. Wilhelm is perfectly fine…as a support character. Compared to the other VHs…he’s clearly last place.

  2. Deathtrap has the same problem as Iron Bear…Gaige and Moze are better without them so its waste of points to spec into them if you’re Min/Maxing for endgame. I sure DT can do some things…but by the time DT does something I’ve already cleared the screen with another Gaige build.


A lot of people are worried about the effectiveness of iron bear in general. I’m hoping class mods or relics with a damage percentage buff and or armor buff will fix the problem.

I won’t lie, I did my fair amount of bagging on Wilhelm as a damage character. He was undoubtedly the weakest of the bunch, as the raid trials from the best Wilhelm players we had at the time showed his kill times were twice as long as the other characters.
However, Wilhelm himself being weak does not translate into wolf being weak. Unlike most other summons, wolf had infinitely scaling damage, increased fire rate, and could apply a 90% multiplicative debuff. Wolf was a lot of the damage from Wilhelm’s character. In my opinion, the reason overcharge chaining builds fell out of favor was because the combination of laser-guided plus Wolf’s added damage from rolling thunder was simply too good to pass up for the temporary burst. And wolf did not fall off in uvhm, if anything he just scaled better because of the increased buff from laser-guided.

As for Gaige, there’s no reason to really ever play her without DT at all. You can get everything you need from the order chaos tree by just putting one point into nth degree. If you want more you’re welcome to get it, but you are in no way obligated to go all the way down the order chaos tree to get everything you need. This is more true after the increase level 80 cap in borderlands 2, but even back when the level cap was 72, you did not need to spec completely down order chaos. You were always able to get the relevant DT perks to make him a powerhouse in his own right. You don’t even need a hide of terramorphous, simply using any roid shield combined with make it sparkle will still leave enough points for Gage to get the majority of relevant skills she needs in order to be a powerhouse on her own right as well as having a powerful death trap.

Besides, what you’re talking about in regards to clear speed is an inherent design choice with any pet class in any game ever. Pets will almost always attacks slower than the player, not aim as quickly as the player, and will have few ways to increase the rate at which they attack. So yes you can clear out an area faster with your Gaige than DT but not because DT is weak. You can kill faster because you are a human who can aim like a human, shoot like a human, and spec your skills like a human to be able to shoot your gun faster and do more damage. Deathtrap is not able to do those things because it is an AI. That does not make deathtrap weak, it makes deathtrap stupid. And while they may seem similar, they are not the same thing because death trap is still more than able to kill any enemy it comes across. It will just not do it as efficiently as a player would.

That’s kinda the whole with DT…he doesnt fit the game. Gaige doesnt need him for damage or clear speed…so DT needs to add some utility to support what Gaige does best. For example I think Axton Turret sucks…however its does bring utility that it can be thrown and Slag enemies. Maya’s phaslock can crowd control. Krieg can legit can play the game without any weapons.

Outside of being a distraction Deathtrap doesnt bring anything special to the table…at all. It’s just another way of doing something Gaige already does better. Hes basically a redundancy.

I’d also like to add that iron bear isn’t a pet. In my mind unless it has an ai of it’s own (correct me if I’m wrong but iron bear doesn’t) then it’s not a pet. It’s not made to draw aggro or attack on it’s own like FL4K’s pets, Wolf, or Death Trap so I feel those comparisons are just a little off.