Arms Races is simply grind

I surprisingly enjoyed Arms race once I got the hang of it. But there are a TON of things that could be improved. I still get bugs, and it sucks to drop in with the chests you want almost impossible unless you find tediores at the beginning.
I think new maps, a higher class mod drop(be it green purple) and more dynamics would help.
Add takedown weapons(make them really rare)!
I’ve been very lucky with drops at the beginning but after a few weeks it almost felt like a closet nerf on dedicated chests. Also I get the damn Res so often, once 3 times in a row from boss, once twice in one chest. Super annoying. Plasma coil is great! But watch them nerf it.
I’m sick of the not as intended excuse.
Something tells me the mixed review of Godfall might have again hampered any more viable end game we might receive from BL3. And if that’s the case that is incredibly sad. Raid bosses GB!!!

I really hope they add some endgame to use these new trees and weapons on. Otherwise the game is truly dying a slow death.

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Doubt it, but i sure hope so. it has 1 digit to many on the damage card. Would be a christmas miracle.

You think so? I dunno, i’m not sure what godfall has to do with borderlands honestly. It’s not made by gearbox, it’s not the same studio. It’s just published by gearbox.

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I’ll admit at first I didn’t like Arms Race at all. After playing through a few times I get it now. Once you’ve hit the max level the game becomes focused on finding a few pieces of optimized gear. The bazillion guns the game touts as its specialty get reduced down to a double digit number that are viable. Arms race brings the bazillion back into play. For instance, I had no idea what the different flavors of Atlas pistols were until I played arms race. All I knew was Linc = bad, Multi-tap = good. Now I know the differences between the AX-7, AX-19, and AX-88. Same goes for Tediore, there are some explosive effects better than others. That was never in play prior to Arms Race…as you approached higher levels of the game the rarity diversity of your gear went down. Perhaps you could simulate this in the main game, but Arms Race makes it easy to go back to the beginning when getting a legendary drop was still exciting.

I still think Gearbox needs to address the fact that there is no reason to prefer one vault hunter to another in Arms Race. Other than a few unique voice tracks there is zero difference between which character you play as. Offering some unique perk would add replay value.

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I hear ya, but as publishers they must be taking a hit money wise. Look at how dead the GB talk box has been recently. No planned anything

Plus Cyberpunk

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@unius13 I am kind of with you on your assessment. There’s something fun buried in there under Arms Race, but they haven’t polished it up yet.

What they really should have done is give the VHs some sort of limited leveling system inside Arms Race only, where you can prestige up certain ranks and whatnot that only apply while playing Arms Race, kind of like old-school 2007 COD multiplayer (I don’t know what the COD system is like these days).

Maybe like a separate Guardian Rank-like system, except the perks you unlock are skills that can only be used in Arms Race? I don’t know, and won’t claim to have the solution, but I do feel that there should be some sort of progression system in Arms Race. Just IMO.

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Yeah, i agree. This is what i thought of aswell. A guardian system specifically made for arms race. Though, the way i imagined it, it would reset each run and with 1 choice per row, with a focus on utility over damage.

Things like reload speed, fire rate, mag size, shield recharge delay/rate/capacity, FFYL time and so on.

Perhaps not as beneficial as many would want, but to me it would add another layer and some immediate decision making depending on what i find.

I don’t think arms race needs a progression system that grant permanent benefits because you’ll eventually reach a point where you got everything unlocked and can ignore it entirely. Doesn’t seem like a good fit for arms race.

But yeah, i dunno. Needs something though.

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@Mahtyo I was actually thinking that the skills could be literally like, crazy and not in the general vein of BL skills. Like have one of the initial perks that you get after killing (x) number of enemies, you get +30% movement speed and jump height, which allows you to avoid the Murdercane and get to more chests. And then there could be one that functionally adds 500% chance to find (x) legendary in a chest as a designated drop?

I am down with your suggestion. So you would get EXP for each Arms Race run, and the more enemies you kill (rather than running straight to the boss or simply running past enemies), the more chance to get all the perks in the skill tree.

I was proposing persistent skills, you were proposing skills that reset each time - but frankly, adding either of these would be an improvement. They just need some sort of progression system, otherwise it is not a Borderlands game.

A Borderlands game with no skill tree is just Halo, and a bad version of Halo, honestly. The two things that make Borderlands, Borderlands, are the weapons and the skill trees. Removing 50% of the Borderlands “identity” is just not a great idea. If you do that, then Borderlands just becomes a ■■■■■■ COD/Halo clone.

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This is soooo good. Make it a true mode with its own progression. It’s not a mode at the moment. It’s a “limited map” in the same sense that the only place you can float and could slam (apart from the Guardian Rank ability) was in the single space map. If they made it a true mode with limited, and challenging, progression, I think it’d have a lot more of a draw.

First thing I’d put on the list: action skills at all, but I’m excited about implementation as I layout below as a modifiable idea.

If we could go “full zane” or “full amara” or any VH, what if the only (or first three) unlocks were the three different action skills? You get all four! (And in Zane’s case, you also retain grenades.)

I don’t know how that would work buttonwise for consoles and keyboards, but if, after, say 10 “levels” whatever levels means in this mode… you got to do all four action skills with quick buttons…so you could really get in to the feel of each character…but only after having earned the feel of it being “no” character (i.e. they are all the same).

e.g. lvl 0-9 is standard arms race. lvl 10-19 is you get grenades plus a skill. lvl 20-29 grenades plus 2 skills… and so on up to all at lvl 50 where you have 5 buttons that do nades and 4 action skills, each on their own cooldown.


EDIT: I liked this idea enough to make it a thread of its own here:

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@kenziesilk OK, while that sounds fun, let’s be honest - what you are talking about seems like it would be way, way, WAY beyond the scope of what could be done to Arms Race with the supported life of BL3. Unless some significant portion of those changes already have been made and not yet patched in LOL.

Just trying to be realistic, not pour cold water. :man_shrugging:t2:

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We’re cool, man.

I mean, it’d not be much harder than the original m1-3and4…or the change from m10 to m11.

Combine that with an xp system like guardian ranks (which are shut off in arms race, so they needn’t even worry about interactions) and you could get a pretty easy dual slide of abilities and difficulties.

The hardest part would be making a few new maps if they went in that direction (which they should…one map for a “mode” is pathetic).

In any case, I’ll answer you here, but if you want to go into more detail on this idea, we should probably hop off this thread to the new one I created so as not to threadsteal.

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I kind of felt like what we have been talking about is in the general vein of the thread, but maybe not. Still, I will check out the other thread. :+1:

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Honeslty, I’m personally OK either way…just trying to be respectful.

TBH, most of the suggestions I’m reading are basically “make Arms Race like regular Borderlands, not Arms Race.”

It’s clear that, whatever else they may have had in mind, they wanted this mode to be a 100% equal playing field no matter what VH you’re playing. I doubt they’d backtrack that and put action skills & skill trees in.

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Honestly, I am pretty sure Arms Race is going to end Borderlands 3 for me. The only reason I am even playing is to farm good Dark Armies and their drop rate is so low and it’s so easy to die by some random event and loose them the rare time you actual get a drop. They should rename it “In your face race”

Opened another 45 chest of dark army: 3 dark army all crap anoint

6 air drop glitch(chest run): to many vendor machine and white chest completly stupid i don’t do this again it’s a waste of time

Boss only drop crap like hot spring, holy grail, teddy and useless other gear.

I turned PC now and download save game from streamer. no more wasting time after over 1100 runs i’m done.

Air drop glitch: go to a cliff(dark army zone) wait 4:16, jump down and die. Next game you get 6 air drop chest… I do dark army chest before if i got good weapon

Enjoy!

I agree with most of what you said except this.

From my PoV one of GBX’s strength as a game developer is character development. For me vault hunters are more than their action skill and skill trees. They have personality. For example, when the game first launched I played about 30 minutes with each character and the primary reason I’m a Zane main from launch is because he gets really winded after running/sprinting. There was something so perfectly human and hilarious about that little detail in his character that I decided then and there that I’m a Zane main.

To summarize, for me, in the Borderlands universe the characters have strong enough personalities that players can identify with that you pick your character based on your connection to them and not just because of their abilities.

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I would agree with you if we were just talking normal game. I love that Borderlands 3 introduced unique dialog for each character during the game play. However, in Arms Race the only time we get this is when a match begins. And that dialog is often cancelled out by Axton or Salvador saying something. Past that point, there is no way to tell who you are playing as during the remainder of an Arms Race match. There is no further dialog. No action skill. I guess a melee or slam attack reveals the identity. I need more than my slam, melee, or my imagination to identify with the character I’m playing. I need more cues from the game to remind me.

That’s why I like arms race. We get to use the rest of the guns and world drop legendaries feel strong (well, most of them). I wish there was something else to it like more maps or dlc versions so we could use their lower tier oranges too.

I realize it’s not for everyone, and weirdly combined with the new skill tree release, but it’s one of the better pieces of content imo. I definitely enjoy it more than guardian takedown. Speaking of takedowns… we need more.

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Ugh, I realize I am not contributing to the conversation in any way here, but Arms Race has frozen and crashed for me now 5 times today. This is the kind of ■■■■ that makes you want to throw the controller through the screen, and the reason why people are so angry about the poor performance of BL3. It’s insane that this is an issue we are discussing in 2019 (edit: yikes, 2020, sorry).

At minimum, players have a reasonable expectation that a game purchased should be playable. It’s not cool to release a game on a console for which the game is so poorly optimized that you have to wait 5 minutes just to get to the main menu.

/rant

Sorry for the venting here.

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Don’t apologize, you’re not alone in your frustration. A vast majority of us got this game expecting to at least get the same quality as we did with the first three entries, meaning our games didn’t crash or power off or consoles.

Not to worry though, GBX is aware of it… or was it they were looking into it? Its been so long now I forgot.

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