Asking for advice on my Krieg build

actually screw that
did a test with BAR off
Win-Win Lady Fist with Hyperion Grip, non-elemental

PiP+no fire
non-crit: 89249
crit: 1285K

non-crit: 124K
crit: 1285K

no PiP
non-crit: 71399
crit: 1285K

so crit damage still remains the same
which does go along with what Wingsday have tested

but it seems that with BAR(I have 12.5% crit damage for BAR)
the result is affected

I see. Did you tested criticals?

PiP buffs weapon damage, but nerf critical damage which may hurt the Lady Fist especially.

oh woops
the first number is non-crit
second is crit

OK, looks like the lady fist isn’t affected by PiP
weird weird weirdd

I can confirm this


no pip, no com, nothing


100 x (1 + 50%) x 2 x (1 + 800%)/(1 +25%) = 2160
that’s the actual math, made by derch btw


Torgue guns either can’t crit or throw out so many projectiles, criting doesn’t really make that much of a difference. There are exceptions, like pistols, but I wouldn’t worry too much about losing crits with Torgue weaponry.

Oh, so with a few exceptions, Torgue doesn’t get PiP penalizations. Nice.
Yeah, I’m still learning gulf :smiley:

I have forum DID. Looks like I’ll start referring to me as “we” xD

Even with the crit penalty I’d say it’s worth it on most torgue guns, becaue all you lose is the PiP damage anyway. To rephrase, the crit penalty will exactly cancel out the damage you get from the gun damage, and not effect anything else. So I don’t think there’s really a situation where PiP is bad, but there are situations where other skills are more important.

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Just about anything that shoots a rocket or has splash can’t crit: Carnage, Flakker, Torpedo, and Kerblaster being the main ones. Everything else can crit, but given how many projectiles they shoot out, it doesn’t really matter. The Harold can crit and can do it nicely if you can get all of the pellets on target, but given its firing pattern, that’s easier said than done a lot of times. Shotguns can crit, but given how many pellets they spew out and their firing pattern, it’s next to impossible to get the majority of them to do so. I generally don’t worry about criting with Torgue unless I’m using a Ogre against spiderants given their large crit boxes.

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Got it. Always learning something new :smiley:

I haven’t tested them all, but the ones I mentioned cannot crit. I forgot the Swordsplosion, which can’t crit either.

The Swordsplosion can crit, but only the initial sword(s) and even then I think PiP is a good choice there becasue it also boosts the damage of the child nades and you can still crit the bloodbath damage with it

This PiP stuff is worth of its own thread xD

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So i actually did the math and not taking PiP is a bit stronger for the SS:

According to this chart:

the differance between the main projectile damage crits is 4.71 times the base damage, and PiP will make up 0.525 on the primary splash and 2.25 total on all three child nades, amounting to 2.775. This yeilds a total loss of 1.935 times the base damage. However, bodyshots will be 1.275 times the base damage stronger with PiP ignoring the child nades.

This analysis assumes no sources of damage other than PiP and BB and only functions for non-casual versions/only one projectile from casual versions.

It can crit? I didn’t know that. Still, given how difficult it can be to aim, especially a Casual version, I wouldn’t worry about criting. To me, Maya and Zer0 need those crits, Krieg doesn’t.

Mm I see
But since situations where I aim for a crit with the Swordsplosion is mostly when I dont have Blood Bath active, I’ll keep PiP

Also decided to go for the first build
(3 point EElation 3 point Flame Flare 3 point EEmpathy)

8 sec is the same duration as a corrrosive proc
Which I find good enough

Also the longer I’m on fire the more Raving Retribution which means I’ll be getting EElation stacks…