BL3 needs a Legendary difficulty for maxed out players

why? it cant get worse than mayhem 2.0

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I think the problem is you’re viewing difficulty and rewards as something everyone should be able to achieve no matter what. I’ve never understood that outlook! What’s wrong with having parts of a game that only the most well specced players can achieve, it’s really not like people are missing out on anything by having such a tiny slice of a tiny slice only doable by those that dare to go for it.

But even if that is a bridge too far, and there’s people who get upset that they miss out on something (sigh), OK how about just a harder difficulty but leave the rewards ? Simple things like manually editing the levels of the enemies, say, a difficulty tier that doesn’t change the loot, just the enemies. Having level 70 or 75 enemies, with the damage and health that entails, feels like an easy fix, but they don’t need to drop any other loot ?

Although not gonna lie it kinda feels like someone would complain about that too “I killed high level enemies I want higher level guns even though I can’t use em!”. I don’t wanna be negative or owt but this community is definitely one of the more…vocal…in its complaining.

Also Einstein never said that

As long as it’s free of awful modifiers I would be up for it.

I think that was done in the past and was too popular so it was replaced with M2.0 scaling.

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the only thing people were complaining about, were the modifiers


I know :rofl: was a satire post :slight_smile:

dont trigger me :<

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I think an easy way to make the game more difficult is to add more crystals and platforms. Remove all the save points except the one at the beginning of campaign for the main story and the one at the beginning of takedown. I guess just take out all the save points.

Wait, did I just described GTD? I mean this time for the whole game :grinning:

The good thing about this we don’t have to worry about scaling. Every Mayhem level you choose will have the same difficult platforms and tedious crystals to charge. You’ll be proud to claim to finish the campaign without using save points. Regardless if that’s Normal or M11, I’m pretty sure that will be an impressive feat.

Remember that unkillable soldier with 1 hp in Maliwan Takedown? Just add more of those. GBX doesn’t need to buff enemy hp. 1 hp can do the trick!

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I’m not talking about difficulty and rewards as something everyone should achieve. I say well done if you can beat any game on the hardest difficulty. I’m a slow learner and just about managed to crack M10 compared to those that managed the feat from day 1.

My original point is the amount viable gear reduces drastically the harder the mayhem level. I don’t want a loop of new harder mayhem level, dev’s buff gear to help players out, new mayhem level so on. Plus there’s no guarantee your top build can even survive a harder mayhem level and if it doesn’t then what other gear can you use since you’re already using the best?

I agree the gaming community is too loud. Probably where everything is soo easy now. Gone were the days during the 90’s where you had to work everything out yourself, there was no walkthrough and no YouTube tutorial back then.

Not all gear needs to be viable for all situations. A high tier difficulty would be designed around working only for specific and perfectly specced loadouts, because the way it currently is, those builds are so crazy overpowered that the hardest difficulty is a joke. I shouldn’t be able to kill bosses in 5 seconds!

If you don’t want a new loop of harder mayhem then you have the option of staying on the mayhem you’re on, you have your difficulty. You can always lower a hard difficulty, I can’t turn up past maximum. The stance of “I don’t want a harder difficulty as I like it how it is” comes off kinda selfish, it’s like, instead of accepting a point you’re at and letting others have another difficulty, you don’t want that option to become available because you’ll feel like you’re missing out on something even though it’s not something you’d want to play, as as you’ve said, you’re happy with the difficulty!

The mindset around this is incredibly selfish of people.


or like challenge maps from old school Doom modders, I ll do a ‘Nuts’ map originally this was something like 100 cyberdemons one doom guy in a small circle. In borderlands we could do 100 anointed militants, one circle. Oh wait game will probably crash😂 Fancy graphics and effects ruined the challenge😆



Adding more Mayhem levels or another kind of difficulty setting layer is not a viable solution with current system and scaling.

Increase enemy health or resistance without increasing action skill, melee, and grenade damage, and you’re left only with guns. Similar issue for shield scaling - it’s not fun to get repeatedly one-shot.

Now, how to fix that ?

I don’t have a simple solution. Maybe you get hints from Diablo 3. I’m not saying Diablo 3 has perfect system or scaling, but people are still playing it, and it has a deep scaling system:

  • no direct player health or damage scaling from difficulty
  • 13M % enemy health and 64k % enemy damage at Torment 16
  • player gains uncapped linear bonus health and damage from XP
  • player can reroll gear stats and improve gear through farming efforts
  • Maximum difficulty is totally unplayable for new player, you have to gather enough xp to raise your stats to keep up at that level, on top of consistent gear

So, enemy scaling is somewhat comparable, but player stat scaling took an opposite path in BL3.

  • Guardian ranks bonuses are capped about 15%
  • Gear has to be re-farmed and found with same stats to keep build
  • Maximum difficulty is playable with some action skills and few gear

Guardian rank, Mayhem scaling, and damage system full rework is required if you expect more difficulty.

There are two ways this could play out.

  1. GBX adds M11/M12/… or some legendary difficulty and at the same time continues weapon scaling and buffing certain gear/skills. Sooner or later players find this new “difficulty cap” easy again, and the circle of adding new Mayhem levels and buffing stuff starts again. This could go on for eternity and provides nothing but a constant need of refarming your crap every few months (like it was the whole year 1 of BL3’s life).

  2. GBX adds M11/M12/… or some legendary difficulty and does no longer buff stuff (max scaling stays at M10). Again sooner or later some players will find the new difficulty cap relatively easy, but this might go on only to a certain level. After that we have the same problem as Commander Lilith and OP10 introduced in BL2 (i.e. scaling of enemy health actually breaks players damage capabilities and even less gear and playstyles than before are viable at max level).

Both of these options sound exactly like something GBX would really do. I’d place my bet on number 1 though, not because GBX learned from their past mistakes but because it fits perfectly with their agenda to lure players into their vicious cirle of farming the same stuff till the end of days.

There is one problem with trying to apply concepts to increase the difficulty of Borderlands or a game very similar to Borderlands.
One thing we should realize is Borderlands gameplay is extremely simple. No meme no joke here. We use a set of 3 to 5 simple tools tools kill enemies. Guns, melee, action skills, grenades, and environmental hazards.

The factors that go in to difficulty in Borderlands are also fairly simple. Can you survive enemies attacks and how long can enemies survive yours. In most cases in Borderlands the longer it takes to kill something the more danger you happen to find yourself in beacuse of the former and ammo.

There is no issue with giving enemies different or new attacks, strengths, weaknesses but these challanges are designed with the limited tools all 4 characters have at there disposal at all times.
Unless we see more tools added to the basic gameplay we are unlikely to see anything beyond gimmicky modifiers/modes or simple Health and damage increases.

Even the Guardian Takedown the games most demanding area boils down to how fast can you kill swarms of enemies and can you survive these two aggressive bosses.

I would love to see Borderlands adopt more difficult options and add a wider range of challange but as it stands Borderlands the core gameplay would need to be changed drastically to provide a more tailored and meaningful challange.

Edit: (that is not to diminish the accomplishment of anyone. This is simply to point out how difficult it would be to adopt more detailed difficulty changes to a game that has fairly basic but enjoyable gameplay)


Bl3 needs no mayhem and damage reduction slider for difficulty and some needed need spree

I think people are misunderstanding my intentions with this post - I’m not talking about another gear tier. I’m talking about a difficulty so we can use the gear we have.

Calling it mayhem might just confuse people, so post-mayhem or whatever I’m not creative lol, but ya there’s no gear rewards for it. Maybe higher loot drop rates, maybe more eridium, maybe some custom cosmetics/trinkets for the difficulty it’s not about the gear it’s about a reason to play.

The game has too many melee enemies that simply aren’t a threat and those that have guns die too quick. Need a difficulty that makes the melee enemies more of a threat and include more gun based enemies, with better health, and just include…well, more enemies.

Maybe a roving Crawmerax the Invincible?

if they did like some people (me included) said and didn’t scale weapons…

voila… somewhat decent difficulty scaling…

atm, go into M10, farm fabricator/vendors untill you get some decent weapons and then farm the easiest bosses for some even better gear and voila… m1-9 is useless now :roll_eyes:

it’s not that this game is hard… it’s not hard ENOUGH!

inb4 somebody says what about us newbs? you made it to UVHM/M1 didn’t you? so nothing changes… the better your gear gets the higher you can climb in mayhem (pair that with optional mods)

GBX however is pretty slow on the uptake… just look at how long we had to wait for them actualy creating a non mod mayhem level (and it’s only M10, wich most people are steamrolling allready)

they keep shooting themselves in the foot… and do it again and again…


What I don’t get is people feeling like if they don’t have M10 gear they’re losing out. It’s not unique pieces, it’s the exact same gear with just slightly better stats.