Just don’t bring back the tech pool, because that was dumb.
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Agreed, replacing with the % chance to proc definitely was/is better.
[quote=“0takuMetalhead, post:20, topic:463059, full:true”]
Give us S&S again and I’ll be happy.
[/quote]Yeah kinda, I just hope Bandit/Scav/Whatever stills exists just cause it makes sense the bandits would mod their guns and stuff. Hmm… maybe have the loot have a % chance of being “banditfied” since in essence that’s really what the bandits would be doing as opposed to mass producing them on a scale comparable to a real manufacturing company unless they found an abandoned factory or something (supposedly some of the bandits were scientists so the potential for a person who know/knew how to fix/use the machinery is possible if unlikely)
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I mean not all bandits are brain mush psycho’s most of them were former employees working on pandora.
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Nononononono
Tech may have been overly complicated (and horrendously explained in-game) but it was so much better than the abysmal excuse for elemental procs in Bl2.
First of all elements should be an accesory, so white damage guns are still favourable sometimes (EG, do I want fire element or +50% firerate?), EXCEPT on Maliwan who should have elemental as a seperate part as to make them unique.
Bl1s system allowed for guns to have multiple levels of elemental damage, and it wasn’t just DOTs, when guns Proced they made speaker destroying explosions (thanks Orion) and did splash damage.
All bl2s system did was give a chance for a DOT, and dots wernt exactly powerful in that game, especially endgame.
With a bl1-like system each part can alter how it behaves elementally.
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No Jakobs AR’s, I couldn’t read past that.
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Nah, personally like how BL2’s accesoire system worked. It’s a personal pet peeve that elemental accesoire always had a chance of spawning, replacing other accesoires in the first game.
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Nice idea on paper, but I can see ruin it otherwise good/amazing items.
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I was debating whether or not to include them.
I really disliked how they worked in Bl2 (mostly due to Bl2s godawful hip fire accuracy) but I think I could like them if it was a different game and different mechanics.
They shouldn’t have magazines (no Jakobs gun in bl1 had a external mag and having them in Bl2 was a personal insult).
I’d have the load with a revolver style cylinder, or manually putting each bullet in, like a real Wild West rifle depending on which mag it spawned with.
Yeah it’s annoying, but that’s the point. Otherwise there’s almost no reason to use non elemental. The aim is to make all accesorys as appealing as an elemental gun, so you want to find as many varients as you can.
Maliwan should have elemental capacitor as a seperate part though, because their unique.
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That’s all I wanted, replace the weird Tech Pool’s chance to proc system w/BL2’s (DoT could stay at BL1 levels for all I care, I just would like to have a usable number for comparison besides Tech Level is 3 instead of 4 but it’s on a xyz gun so it’s something close to a 10% chance assuming the tech pool has recharged fully) so you can put a usable number on the item card. I’m tired of Tech 3’s being only being a marginally better Tech 2 because you got the right part which bumped it up barely into the Tech 3 level so while it’s a “Tech 3” level gun it’s more or less crap since it lowered all other stats like damage, accuracy and the hidden reload stat as well as others in favor of boosting the Tech level just enough to make it look worthwhile on paper but all it was/is good for is sell fodder since while it procs more/“better” the other stats killed the usefulness of the gun.
[quote=“Mr_Sandman, post:24, topic:463059”]
All bl2s system did was give a chance for a DOT, and dots weren’t exactly powerful in that game, especially endgame.
[/quote]Irrelevant since this isn’t about the damage of DoT’s but the visible percent chance number being added/stay with future BL games. That’s all I meant really and was not saying we should copy+paste all of BL2/TPS’s elemental system but rather what info was/is shown on the item card so it’s a bit more useful IMO.[quote=“Mr_Sandman, post:24, topic:463059”]
With a bl1-like system each part can alter how it behaves elementally.
[/quote]IIRC each part can/does actually raise/lower the chance and/or damage of DoT in BL2 and TPS same as BL1 (but in a different way) so I don’t see what the issue is here, care to explain what you mean? If you mean the elemental damage was crap then that’s a different issue than what I was agreeing with since all you’d need to do to fix it is have a different base elemental damage and have more parts effect it and in greater variety and/or tie it to the base damage of the gun.
[quote=“0takuMetalhead, post:27, topic:463059, full:true”]
Nice idea on paper, but I can see ruin it otherwise good/amazing items.
[/quote]It’d be like luneshine really IMO but with cons as well as pros (just an afterthought bonus and has a few that it can randomly choose from like increased mag size at cost of reload speed, more damage at cost of accuracy, etc.)
[quote=“Mr_Sandman, post:28, topic:463059”]
Maliwan should have elemental capacitor as a seperate part though, because their unique.
[/quote]My biggest grief of BL1 Maliwan weapons, no access to the cool accuracies like Double or Vector but I do agree that it’d be tough to balance it out so both guns with and without elemental effects seem viable/usable when compared against the other type of gun.
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You seem to be missing the point, DOT was only a small part of elemental guns in Bl1. The explosions of elemental damage were the main benifit.
DOT wasn’t even affected by Tech levels or pool iirc. It was it’s own unique (and mysterious) system that worked off many variable including player level.
Do you seriously only want Damage Per Second and chance to DOT? That’s pretty boring IMO, I want multiple levels of elemental bonus damage, skills alerting recharge rate for Tech etc…
Just because Bl1s system was not explained AT ALL in game, and required a good 1000 word essay doesn’t mean it’s bad from a gameplay point of view.
Outside of a few very rare exceptions DOT chance/damage didn’t mean anything in Bl2, all you wanted was the damage modifier because it increased DPS by 75% against correct health bar colour.
Ideally I’d like to see elements not just be different damage types, but have them all do unique stuff.
Fire should stay as good vs flesh and medium length DOT
Corrosive should be good against armour, but instead of being just the opposite of fire it should sit in globs where the Proc billet hits and eat away at that area. Make it do damage, but also physically destroy armour. So if Crimson Lance guy gets hit with a Proced corrosive bullet in the chest that area with start to fall apart and further damage to that section will not incur the reduction from armour.
So it works like Slag, but only on the section covered in acid, they don’t insta get covered in purple. It would work while it’s active on enemies, but permanently destroy metal armour enemies may be wearing.
Shock short high damage dots that work super well against shields. It should also interfere with other electronics, such as if a Surveyor is making repairs a shock DOT will interrupt it.
Or if Borderlands ever gets better AI systems, shock could fry communications between enemies, so they can’t call for backup.
Ice for immobilising stuff, not much else to say.
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There are only a handfull of items that had their DOT increased from Red text effects however. And the fact that player level influences DOT damage is the reason why Maliwan was/is so broken. It’s not like I don’t like the whole aspect of Tech pools and levels (I really hope that this will return in 3), but the DOT itself needs a new formula.
This. I’d love this.
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If you know the parts this should be something of a non-issue honestly. Though having the tech level and pool shown on the card would be helpfull. Instead of just a multiplier that only shows tech level.
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But they are amazing and the only non red text AR’s really worth using.
You seem to be missing that all I want is a better system than the tech pool system in terms of what is shown. In BL1 it tells you squat pretty much, sure you have a “tech 3” or whatever gun but it doesn’t say what the chance is that it’ll proc nor the damage it’ll do or anything actually useful.
[quote=“0takuMetalhead, post:32, topic:463059”]
If you know the parts this should be something of a non-issue honestly. Though having the tech level and pool shown on the card would be helpfull. Instead of just a multiplier that only shows tech level.
[/quote]Exactly, even showing what the total tech points are and drain per shot would be good. Just give some useful data instead of a vague unhelpful multiplier that is given if the tech pool level is between X and Y.
The thing is, elemental weaponry are only appealing in the first game if the unique or legendary item had its effect derived from elemental accesoire (Draco and Serpens aside, they are the odd bunch out). Otherwise you have to deal with a absurdly large damage penalty.
Dahl Miniguns would like to have a word with you.
I’d include most Torgue ARs too (not including the Torpedo)
The only thing i’d like to see implemented from BL1’s gun system is that enemies drop the guns they actually wield.
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How about we don’t bring back the gun system from Bl1 or Bl2, Built an even more ambitious and better one? Why on earth isn’t this the expectation instead?
The new consoles have 16 times more RAM. BL3 should have a bigger budget, put some engineers to work, stop bringing back old ■■■■.
Screw the old system…Stop living in the past. 
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DOT needs a completly new system, both Bl1 and Bl2’s are terrible. There needs to be more varibles affecting it (and those varibles should come from Gear and Skills, not player level).
If certain parts increased DOT damage, DOT chance, DOT duration etc…
I think Tech should still be a stat (that gives a tech pool, and allows different “levels” of procs), but there also needs to be % boosts/negatives for specific stats as well, including Proc damage, radius and chance and cost.
For example MaliwanSniperBody_3 gives + 5 Tech, +30% DOT duration, +50% Proc radius.
I think for the Gun card you need a simple icon, maybe not the x1-x4 system, but something equally as easy to read at a glance. But looking at the gun in your inventory should show all stats and proc costs and everything the game actually uses to calculate stuff.
A problem with Borderlands is the stats are often altered to “make more sense” for the reader, which makes them seem like they arnt working as intended. I wish GBX would just put the actual numbers and stat names and have a detailed “HELP” section for people to understand it if they need to.
Gun Cards on ground should be clean and easy to compare base stats, but zooming in on the gun model should show every single number the gun uses for calculation. (with the exception of Red Text guns who’s bonuses are meant to be a secret).
Having a small bar above the ammo counter that shows Tech pool would be great, that way you could visuiise how fast it regens and how much each proc costs. Wouldnt need numbers, just a thing bar along the ammo counter.
I know they’re good, but I just hated them.
They (along with most BL2 guns) felt “off” to me, the recoil and handling didnt match what was coming out of the barrel. I dont know what it is, but all the guns seemed really lightweight, but the recoil, especially hipfire, was as if it was a ultra powerful high calibre cannon.
Recoil can be fixed with a decent stock and skills, but nothing “felt” powerful, which is a feeling I got (and still get) from lots of guns in BL1.
Thats not true, you’re confusing appealing with “the very best”. Unfortunetly in Bl1 Elemental Accesory legendaries made non unique Elemental Accesories redundant, but they still worked very well, especially whilst leveling.
Incindiary guns wrecked Bandits, Corrosive was always useful for mini-Slag and made Crimson Lance areas 1000x easier. Shock and Explosive were pretty useless because their benifits were so circumstansional, but if oyu had a Shock Lilith/Roland or Explosive Brick build they were incredibly good.
Yes, that defiently needs to be reintroduced.
I dont think anyone is asking for Bl1s to be copy-pasted, people just want the Series to return to a Bl1 style system which was based on parts instead of guns being locked down by manufactorer gimmicks.
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Great minds…