“SHIELDS UP, MR. KRIEG!”
I finally got around to moving this over to the new forum and updated it. It’s even longer than before so grab a sandwich and a soda.
Commentary and Build
Why? : My alternative to Hellborn/Firehawk headaches and mostly melee Bloodlust/Mania.
What is it? : Gun/grenade primary, melee secondary suicide psycho with a normally functioning shield for solo questing/mobbing in normal UVHM/OP0.
What is it not? : Raiding, Digi-Peak, OP levels or better than Hellborn/Firehawk or melee Bloodlust/Mania.
Shields?! With Krieg…are you stupid or something? : Nope. I like shields.
What about OP play : Yeah, it works, I guess. More on that later.
BfG 5/5 BTw 5/5 EtR 5/5 PtP 1/1 FtM 0/5 BBB 0/5 FtF 5/5 ToB 5/5 BR 0/5 BO 1/5 EtP 0/5 FtR 4/5 BB 5/5 BaB 1/1 FtB 5/5 TotK 1/5 LtF 1/1 StF 5/5 BT 0/5 BlB 3/5 RtS 1/1 StW 2/5 NB 5/5 StV 5/5 BXPLO 1/1 RtB 1/1
Lots of points spent in the Bloodlust tree. Customize it to your liking as long as you max Bloodbath and get Buzz Axe Bombardier.
It’s your character, and I expect you to do whatever the hell you want with it. However, for the purpose of this build, please keep this in mind :
Any skills that increase our shield recharge delay are off the table : Feed the meat, Embrace the Pain, or self-ignition (most of Hellborn).
You have to throw away five skill points to get down the Mania tree without taking skills that increase your shield recharge delay, then you need to burn two more to reach Silence the Voices. This is why I think of this build as “Garbage Can”.
Fuel the Rampage is the only choice we have to get down the Mania tree. Unfortunately, this ruins the build for co-op play. You can go all five in this, or you can drop one point in Pull the Pin for giggles. Points spent in FtR are not totally condemned to rot in an oubliette (look it up). If you ever fail a RtB, FtR will fill up your action skill quickly…yeah it sucks.
Salt the Wound does not play well with shields. I don’t think it is worth the full 5/5, but it is a candidate for the 2 points needed to get down the Mania tree to Silence the Voices. The other option is 2 more into Thrill of the Kill.
Feed the Meat : Adds health, costs shield recharge delay. No thanks.
Embrace the Pain has no effect on you in BXR, adds a full second per point to shield recharge delay outside of BXR. NOPE!
Fuel the Fire is used for boosting your chance to slag. This skill can ignite you if you use fire weapons. Either minimize or eliminate the fire weapons (go explosive!) or use an inflammable shield. I really like this skill but you can skip it if you wish (especially at level 61).
You could move some points to Burn Baby, Burn, for increased fire DOT damage, but without being on fire the bonus in much lower. Not recommended but it could be used to get down to EE instead of PiP if you want to avoid the -% crit of PiP. Don’t forget the inflammable shield if you use fire weapons with this.
I don’t like Pain is Power (with its -% crit), but you do get some benefit from it while not on fire. Regardless, PiP is not worth it unless you want to get down to EE
Elemental Elation is a great fit for this build (filling in the lost fire rate from EtP). If you are not on fire, your stacks decay quickly. The huge radius and duration of the Stormfront counters this, and it is the key to making this version of the build function properly.
The rest of Hellborn is unusable.
Lite the Fuse, the suicide in a suicide psycho. This is my favorite skill for Krieg. It is a true game changer, totally altering FFYL. Instead of the horrid interruption of going down, you get to move, build bloodlust and deal damage for free. Getting a second wind adds a speed buff and you proc Bloodbath every time you second wind from the dynamite or detonation. Occasionally you will enter FFYL as the last enemy in an area dies. With LtF you now have a chance to move to the next area and get a second wind. The other suckers…er…vault hunters are doomed to respawn.
Lite the Fuse is not perfect. You need to boost it with at least 5/5 in Strip the Flesh and an explosive relic. A point in Redeem the Soul helps to insure you can get up as often as possible. It is terrible on the Peak and it looses more and more effectiveness with each OP level. There are certain enemies you have no chance to get up against (Crystlisks stand out here). Flyers require a great deal of luck. Others like UBAs and rabids require them to be slagged or significantly damaged. With the Flesh Crunch COM equipped, you can second wind off of unslagged, full-health UBAs and rabids if you have most or all of your FFYL timer left and a point in RtS.
I love the chaotic mayhem of this build. When I play it, I am chucking grenades constantly, rampaging with melee charges, spamming explosive guns, and spraying slag everywhere with a Slag Topneaa. I consider Lite the Fuse an integral part of that. I truly don’t care if I’m slagged, melting with corrosion, smashing my own face in, or have single digit health. Rampage kills or Thrill of the Kill will fill me up, or I’ll second wind out of Lite the Fuse… usually. Yeah I’ve hit the respawn station plenty of times after getting myself surrounded and put into LtF so many times I insta-explode (though I have had some sweet strings of second winds off of insta-explodes). If that doesn’t sound like fun, go play zero.
While Lite the Fuse is my favorite, Bloodbath is the backbone. We are missing the big boosts to fire rate that a Hellborn Krieg has. Procing Bloodbath consistently and using a COM that boosts kill skill duration and Bloodbath is the best away to to recoup that DPS. I always carry at least one AOE explosive gun that procs Bloodbath 100% of the time. The next best way (which is really fun) is to equip a Flesh Crunch COM and let’em have it with explosive grenades, moping up with explosive gunfire. The EE variant gains some of that ROF back but it locks you into using only the Stormfront as your grenade.
In the original post, I mentioned that I though Taste of Blood was good enough at 6/5 with a COM boost, and that if I was building around the Blister com I’d skill this to 5/5. Now I recommend just skilling it to 5. It’s a better use for the points and you can also switch between the three recommended types of COM without respecing.
Blood Overdrive is a skill I only ever put one point into, and only if my main +kill skill COM provides it a bonus. You may want to invest points here regardless of COM if your grenade mods have long fuse times.
Class Optimization Modules
Maximum stats listed below are based on level 72 COMs.
Legendary Reaper : up to +99% team kill skill duration. +5 to Taste of Blood, Blood Overdrive, Bloodbath, Thrill of the Kill, and Fuel the Fire.
Blue Flesh Crunch : up to +49% explosive damage. +6 to Strip the Flesh, +5 to Taste of Blood.
I alternate between these two. I use the L.Reaper the majority of the time, and switch to the F.Crunch when I want to focus on explosive grenade damage.
Purple Blood Blister : up to +66% kill skill duration and +6 grenade capacity. +5 to Bloodbath, +4 to Fuel the Blood and Blood Overdrive.
Blue Blood Blister : up to +66% kill skill duration and +6 grenade capacity. +6 to Bloodbath, +5 to Fuel the Blood or Blood Overdrive.
Either of these is a good replacement for the L.Reaper if you don’t have one. Some players might like the B.Blister better. I use the purple version occasionally to mass spam grenades.
Bargain Basement : The Crunch and Blister COMS listed above are pretty common. They are found in vending machines, item chests, the Golden Key chest, and as a world drop. If you haven’t found one yet (or never bothered to keep any), any Crunch, Blister or Reaper COM can be used (Reaper has kill skill duration).
Whatever you want/have, outside of the Rough Rider or the Love Thumper (both of which defeat the purpose of this build).
Inflammable shields will block your self DOT chance from FtF, allowing the use of fire weapons without hurting your shield recharge delay.
Obvious standouts are the Blockade, Antagonist and Sham. The Antagonist is my overall favorite. Solid defense and it slags for you whether you are shooting or rampaging.
For more melee damage an inflammable Hide of Terra, Order, or Pun-chee. At melee range your enemies will keep these down for you most of the time.
Others that I enjoy on this build are the Black Hole, Deadly Bloom, inflammable Big Boom Blaster, or an inflammable Whiskey Tango Foxtrot (yeah the WTF! It’s not very good but it adds to the chaos when I feel like chucking MIRV grenades everywhere). Sometimes I’ll use an inflammable Bee for bosses I can get some cover from.
Note on the BBB. All Maliwan parts on this is not so good for Krieg. That carries an over 4 second recharge delay. A Maliwan capacitor with 2 Hyperion parts still has solid stats and brings the delay down 2 seconds.
Bargain Basement : The Antagonist can be bought with crystals in DLC 4. The Pun-Chee can be bought with crystals in DLC 2. The Order, Deadly Bloom, and Aequitas are all quest items, otherwise something inflammable or roid.
I use a purple explosive elemental relic 99% of the time.
I carry a Bone of the Ancients in each element to match with elemental weapons for occasional threats (like a Badass Buzzard).
Bargain Basement : Elemental relics of any quality.
With Bloodbath providing infinite grenades, I prefer to deal damage with grenades, and not to use them for slagging. I like longbow on all of these where available. I’d choose a lower fuse over higher damage or area-of-effect on the same grenade. Points in Blood Overdrive help with non 0.0 fuse grenades.
The Quasar is the overall best in my opinion. Builds stacks, strips shields, powerful final explosion, and converges enemies for AOE explosive gunfire.
An explosive Fastball is a close second. These produce Bloodsplosion chains better than anything else. The Flesh Crunch COM gives these a huge boost.
Other grenade mods I like with this build are the Stormfront, Bonus Package, Meteor Shower, Pandemic, Fire Bee, Fire Storm and the Breath of Terramorphous (it is a fun and reasonably effective grenade to use in flesh enemy areas). Remember to equip an inflammable shield with the fire grenades.
I also occasionally use a Magic Missile x 4. Yeah, after ranting about no slag grenades, I list this. The fact that they slag is incidental. These big homing bombs hit hard, and they regenerate on their own. I equip a Blister COM when I use these so I can just fill the air with them. Good fun.
Bargain Basement : If you have the Torgue DLC, the Bonus Package can be bought from the Torgue vending machines. Farm the tokens in normal, easy. Otherwise, explosive MIRV, Tesla, or singularity.
Slot 1 : Slag!
My current favorite is a slag Pimpernel.
The Florentine, Slagga, Grognozzle, slag Rubi, slag Slow Hand, slag e-tech Splat shotguns, and Maliwan slag sniper rifles and SMGs are all quality.
A slag Pitchfork is an excellent option, but it can consume allot of ammo very quickly.
A slag Topneaa works great, but its ammo pool is very small.
A slag Kitten isn’t the greatest, but it has Moxxi healing, and once Fuel the Fire procs, it’s spread of three bullets for one ammo make it viable.
Slot 2 : AOE weapon with 100% chance to proc Bloodbath.
A powerful launcher like an explosive Badaboom is the best, but with a very small amount of ammo.
A casual Carnage is the overall most effective.
The Kerblaster is the next best, with the added ability to rain child grenades on top of enemies behind cover if there is a roof, ledge or wall nearby.
In the original post I totally missed a really powerful option : Tediore reloads. Specifically the Baby Maker. You can match elemental weakness or just use a non-elemental one (counts as explosive on throw, so it’s buffed by StF, explosive relic, and the Crunch COM). Keep track of your ammo though, as Krieg can pack over a hundred rounds into one throw at high stacks.
The Seeker is an interesting choice. It does less damage but it fires homing rockets so it can be used at much greater ranges. Better I think as a utility weapon, but it does have the 100% Bloodbath chance.
Other choices are a single rocket Carnage, a purple Torgue Torpedo assault rifle, or a Bearcat.
Slots 3 and 4 : Utility
Anything you want, including anything listed for slots 1 and 2 if you want to double up. Guns listed in the Bloodbath resource guide with at least a chance to proc bloodbath are a natural choice here, but I don’t limit myself to those.
Top Gear for Krieg has most of the heavy hitters.
I usually equip a slag Topneaa and something relevant to the area I am in, or something I just feel like using. Some guns I commonly employ in the fourth slot are the Flakker, Swordsplosion, Pimpernel, Seeker, Butcher, Sloth, Ogre, Lady Fist and Baby Maker.
The Unkempt Harold is great of course, but I used it so much leveling up my characters that I don’t use it much anymore.
Another gun I like is a purple Torgue Root assault rifle (It’s the Dahl barrel Torgue AR). It’s accuracy and low recoil allow for a farther range then the Ogre for firing explosive pellets. Buttstallion poops out a gemstone version of this.
A good replacement for the Ogre is a purple Torgue Spitter assault rifle.
You should always have in your backpack at least one gun of each element, and at least one Moxxi weapon, for dealing with the occasional spawn of something nasty like a Badass Buzzard or Badass Pyre Thresher. You should also have a Lady Fist in your backpack for dealing with Cystalisks (have the Lady Fist in hand, and throw explosive grenades at them, Fastballs with Flesh Crunch can one shot them).
Bargain Basement : The Torgue vending machines from DLC2 are an excellent source of explosive weapons (Kerblaster, Flakker, Unkempt Harold, and purple rarity Torgue weapons). Farm the tokens in normal, easy. The Seeker and Florentine can be bought with Crystals in DLC 4. The Grognozzle, Slow Hand, Kitten, Rubi, Sloth, Pimpernel, Swordsplosion, Lady Fist and many others are quest items. Otherwise use the best you can find from the vending machines, item chests, the Golden Key chest, and the world drops. Bloodbath makes it all good.
The build and OP8
After I dragged Krieg to OP8, I spent a little time experimenting with various builds, but then went right back to level 72/OP0, permanently, with Krieg. Why? No Lite the Fuse. For me, without it Krieg is just NO FUN to play.
As for the build, it works, but the spirit of the build :
Gun/grenade primary, melee secondary suicide psycho with a normally functioning shield
that is right out the window, across the street, around the corner, down the block and headed outta town gone forever.
Lite the fuse doesn’t work so the suicide psycho is gone right out of the gate. The less than half strength melee secondary (no Sickle com, FtM, Blood relic, Rough Rider) is underwhelming at best. You can still do alright against basic bandits, but loaders, badasses or rabids will rip ya a new one.
So you’re left with a Gun/grenade/normally functioning shield build with melee to kill scrubs but is better used to save you from going into FFYL to often, or to save you from re-spawning to a DOT once everything is dead.
Point moved from LtF to StW because reasons. 2 points moved from ToB to BlB. Boiling is much more important now. Maintaining high stacks for when you do proc BB and Bxplo is key. The EE link is just an un-tested theory craft.
I did not play this too much, but I came up with three styles that did fine.
For the first two, shield choices : Sham (bullets), Blockade (critters), Big Boom Blaster (DOT heavy), Bee (Bosses and un-slaggable pain in the ass health sinks you can engage from cover or long range)
First : L.Reaper, Explosive relic or Bone, Quasar, Grog + DPUH + Badaboom matched to the relic, with the last being something hard hitting or healing like the Casual Carnage, Kerblaster, Pimpernel, Sloth, Kitten, Hail, Slow Hand, Baby Maker, Lady Fist, etc. Play methodically. Start with the Grog and throw Quasars. Slag and build Bloodlust. You can do a few quick switches to you other guns for a few shots then back to the Grog. When you judge then time is right, splatter something with the Badaboom. Now you’ve got high stacks with Bloodbath and maybe a Bloodsplosion chain. Let’em have it with your guns. If you don’t re-proc bloodbath, kill something with a 100% BB chance weapon before it runs out. Keep chucking Quasars. Once everything is dead, grab some grenades and move to the next mob as quickly as you can to maintain as much Bloodlust as you can. If you run into a constructor, proc BB on anything else and hit it with the DPUH or Badaboom, or back way off and equip the Bee + Pimp or Lady Fist and crit kill it. Crystalisks are the worst. Back off and Bee + Lady Fist. You can rampage on scrubs or to “cheese-it” for cover to avoid FFYL.
Second : Flesh Crunch, Explosive relic, Explosive Fastball, Grog + DPUH + Explosive Bababoom or matched elemental weakness to area Norfleet, with a non-elemental Baby Maker, casual Carnage, Kerblaster, Kitten, Hail… Same as above, something hard hitting or healing. You can play faster with this. Slag and Fastball something. Slag and kill something with your guns. Repeat. Move as fast as you safely can to build up your Bloodlust, which is harder to do with this loadout. Same techniques as above for dealing with pains in the ass.
Third : Drop all pretense of fair play and equip the Sham + low-level Logan’s gun and a stack of launchers and face roll everything. Stupid crystalisks still need the long range Bee + Lady Fist combo.
Well if you’ve made it this far, thanks for reading! Once I started writing, I found I was enjoying myself, so I just kept adding stuff until this post ballooned to its current size. I love playing this build, I hope at least a few of you will as well. Cheers!
Old, low quality videos from the old forum post.