Build without kill skills/Leadership?

I’m kind of curious about how this would work. I’ve seen a few of these types of builds in the old forums, and there are even one or two here. I was having a conversation with someone on Youtube where we were discussing the design of borderlands characters. They felt that Jack was badly designed because he is overly dependent on leadership, which works due to questionable mechanics (this is paraphrasing, so I’m missing some of their vital points here) and that without that skill, Jack falls apart.

It got me thinking. Even though Leadership does activate all of Jack’s kill skills, which are potent bonuses on their own, he actually has very good skills that are not kill skills but still rely on the clones dying. Collaborate, Teamwork, and commitment (ugh) aren’t kill skills, and they are staples in most builds. So I threw this together to see what it would look like.

At least on paper it doesn’t seem too bad. Not having synergy and Believe sucks, but the crit bonus on the CD, long with the extra points in collaborate, just about makes up the difference. No winning also sucks. However, the combination of 9/5 teamwork, delegation, and persistence should go some ways towards improving survivability. AA is irreplaceable, and its loss is a huge knock on this. Still, it doesn’t seem like it would be totally pointless.

Anyone ever dabble with it? Any thoughts? I can’t really test this myself since my controller is busted, so if anyone wants to try it out tell me how it goes.

First off I’ll start with… This is Borderlands, to an extent you can do whatever the hell you want with enough knowledge and experience. For example I recently killed Eclipse & EOS with purely green gear, at a pace (2:41) most people can’t even kill them with their try hard pants on. I don’t condone running Jack without Leadership. But is it possible? Yeah it is and it even looks decent.

Very few things get me worked up about video games like people that do nothing but bitch how the boss is too strong, characters are OP, without X this character sucks, ect…

  • “ARs suck”
  • “OP levels are impossible w/out the Bee”
  • “TPS has too many skill points”
  • “Axton is useless in UVHM”
  • Threads like these when I can kill them in less than 40 seconds
    Eclipse seems impossible to beat on UVHM

Most of this is me venting from mud that has just been endlessly flung at Galilea to the point where one of her skills was reduced by 75% and half of another skill was cut out entirely, ect… I just wan’t people to get their heads out of their asses before they speak and actually try to solve the problem they’re having, intead of running to daddy and asking for a hand out. Because to me it just sounds like they’re gargling their own ■■■■.

The first idea that popped into my head, but I think it came out pretty good.

Sorry for the rant. And the dude said Leadership reliance only. Why did you add in the no kill skill condition?

6 Likes Here’s abetter build without leadership fire rate, health regen and I mean super health regen and crit build with the COE

Honestly, I just wanted to really push the idea to the limits. Not having leadership is one thing, but missing Synergy, believe, Winning, or AA at all is pretty massive.

Awesome vid BTW. I swear, you make everything look awesome. It honestly looked pretty effective. Your health didn’t go down that much, you did fine with ammo, and your damage was still great. Thanks a lot Khim!

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Show off! :innocent:

Nice vid, per usual.


Its sorta my job (kinda?) :stuck_out_tongue: Plus it better emphasizes how I’m not just a hypocrite, and that I actually “practice what I preach”.


Touche! :smile:

Never thought so. And I appreciate all you do in here.

I stop and read what you post, if that holds any water with you. :grin: In a sea of text, I stop when I run across this name @khimerakiller and read what is written.


*Jumps aboard the @khimerakiller train

Lord knows that there isn’t anyone else on this forum who will test weapons and builds and record gameplay footage of it just to sate someone else’s curiosity like you’ve done on several occasions for my, and other’s, threads.

You’re awesome man!


I don’t say that, do I? :blconfused:

Anyway, to echo the others: You da man!



I can’t tell if that’s an honest question, or if you’re just up holding your new title. :stuck_out_tongue:



I have to give my thanks to. You’ve helped me out a lot.

@gulfwulf stealing my pictures I see.

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Oh btw your the one that convinced me to even buy tps. :clap:

Aww yes, join “The Dark Side… of the Moon”. Magma, Wally, and Fair appreciate your patronage.

I mean you go there to kill them, but… you know… references. (shrugs)

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