Concerns regarding competitive Battleborn and its future

Although I am not competing at Choctaw, I would like it to be a success; one that paves the way for competitive Battleborn and future Battleborn tournaments.

However, I have significant concerns regarding its format. The most important one being the game modes. With the format being Meltdown, Incursion, Meltdown, the tournament is essentially a Meltdown tournament.

If a team is strong enough at Meltdown to not lose a game of Meltdown, they are guaranteed to win the tournament even if they forfeit every single Incursion match.

One may say that this situation doesn’t seem very likely, but it is much more likely (domination at Meltdown) when the majority of players especially from Xbox and PS4 play almost exclusively Incursion for competitive play. The population of Battleborn players on Xbox alone is significantly larger than the PC population. Needless to say that the PC population (of Battleborn players) is but a small minority when compared to both the Xbox and PS4 players combined.

Yet the PC players who play Meltdown as their main competitive mode have been given a massive advantage over the Xbox and PS4 players and this is excluding other factors such as skill level, etc.

The reason why this is important is because instead of bringing the competitive community together, this format is turning away the majority of such players. If Meltdown is to become the standard game mode played in tournament, then the majority of the competitive players should be playing it.


So what is the purpose of having Incursion in such a tournament? It’s the “tiebreaker,” but if Incursion is considered to be the inferior mode to Meltdown (competitively speaking), then why have a weak competitive game mode played in a competitive setting? Is it worth having Incursion just for the sake of variety?

If the answer to this question is yes, then it must also have sound competitive viability, otherwise it would not make sense to be played in a competitive setting. If it does have sound competitive viability to the point where Incursion only tournaments were previously played, then why must this change now? If Meltdown is also a solid competitive game mode by itself, then why aren’t there Meltdown only tournaments?

I do not believe it is a good idea to have multiple modes being played unequally. I think it would be best to have it be all Incursion or all Meltdown.


One way to appease both Incursion and Meltdown players is to have both of the tournaments run side by side (similar to how Smash tournaments would run both a “Singles” and “Doubles” tournament at the same event). Much like how the HGL tournament ran previously, it could be a best of 1, with finals (winners, losers, grand) being a best of 3 (double elimination). The only difference is that finals should be run on a separate day.

If such a change were to take place then players could end up participating in both tournaments, but not be forced to partake in the mode that they don’t play competitively. This could also increase the chance for Meltdown to become more popular since players would be able to play Incursion as their main tournament and try out Meltdown on the side (or vice versa).

Another benefit of this is how much more time efficient it would be. In the current format, playing against 2 teams in a best of 3 could lead up to 6 matches. In the proposed format players would be able to play 3 teams (as opposed to just 2) in both tournaments within the same time span. However, by having double elimination and both tournaments, teams would still have plenty of chances to do well (they would have to lose 4 times to be eliminated in both completely).


My second concern is specifically in regards to the available gear in the Choctaw tournament. There aren’t any sprint speed gear options available. This includes commonly used speed gear such as the High-Tailing “Boilermakers,” the High-Tailing “Greyhound,” and the Sketchy “White Lightning.” I do not agree with this decision and would like to know what the reasoning behind this is.


I really want Battleborn to succeed in every way that it deserves to. I don’t think the decision to make the tournament standard a Meltdown tournament was a good idea at this point in time. Please discuss.

@JoeKGBX @wintersjordan0

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I can say we at HGL know of the advantages of running 2 matches of a certain game mode in a BO3 series. We never attend to give a team or group of players an advantage in our tournaments and that is why we have been thinking of adding Face Off or Capture to our Circuit for the third game. We have hesitated on this announcement because a lack of knowledge on what the community prefers, and a future revamp of HGL itself. Now to Answer why not just have it all one game mode like before. I honestly belive that having players play in a variety of game modes is key to honing a great competitive scene not only for the players, but for the viewers as well. Now some people may ask why does the viewers matter, you should just focus on the people playing the game. Viewers matter a lot to a Esport Scene this is where Sponsorships and so forth come through. If you can prove you can pull 1,000 + viewers for a online tournament you will be able to negotiate with potential sponsorships a lot easier, which will give more to the players playing.

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Just wondering but if you are “competitive” in a game doesn’t that mean you are competitive in all modes because it’s part of the game? Being good in 1 mode is never a good idea if you really want to “competitively” compete in a game.

Since you mentioned smash, I’ve been a part of the very first smash scene and tournaments that lifting it off the ground. I know many of the comp players and they are good in all modes. The reason smash has different mode tournaments is because of the population not because one mode is more famous than the other.

Besides that, you mentioned some great points. I wish we could have mode only tournaments. That would be so much fun but I don’t think we will have enough people to sign up that would play. :frowning: until then…

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I will be first to say I prefer Face Off, but it and capture suffer the Spawn Camping issues. Instead, why not put Supercharge as 3rd when it comes around? Could be an interesting tie breaker, sending in your top 3 to compete…

Hello Everyone!

I thank you for expressing your interest in the Choctaw Festival of Gaming!

In regards to the format of the Tournament we have been thinking about switching it to where it rotates rounds, as in Meltdown/Incursion/Meltdown and then the next round be Incursion/Meltdown/Incursion, that way you do not have to be good in just one game mode in order to win the whole event!

Having just one game mode throughout the event, where as the game can feature multiple different types of game modes can be extremely boring and dull to viewers at home.

As for running 2 different tournaments, though I understand how that could be ideal, that would just split the community in two, and would make it extremely hard for Gearbox to really run sanctioned events if they chose to do so. Comparing it to Smash brothers isn’t a good comparison as it is a Fighting Game and this isn’t. I would rather closely compare it to Call of Duty whereas they have the rotation as Hardpoint/Search and Destroy/Uplink/Hardpoint/Search and Destroy.

The Gear list was decided by a team at Gearbox!

If you have any more questions feel free to ask me. I am excited and glad that you really want Battleborn to succeed at this event.

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We have thought about this, but with No ETA, we don’t want to wait for it.

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Could you possibly elaborate on how the gear was chosen? No health regen pieces…? The most common pieces of gear are shard generators, and there is one, and it has negative reload speed attached to it. So any character that needs to reload, which is 2/5 of the cast, can’t get a shard generator without crippling themselves which is a big issue to me.

There is a common 0 activation Shard generator that negatively effects Healing Power.

the choctaw gear list I’m looking at only has the -reload speed piece.

There’s a limit to what gear is available for the Choctaw tournament. Apparently the -heal power shard collector isn’t available.

Fair point, but imho there are other things that bother me competing in an tournament:

if the tournament is online, or at least the play offs, how will the latency issue beeing solved? let’s say there’s an european team fights an japanese team, one of them will have an disadvantage…
right now, if you as a european team of 5, faces an asian team of 5, the asian team gets ALWAYS the latency advantage, means europeans will play with red bars, asians with green, always, as soon as there are at least 5/10 asian, you will loose, no matter how skilled you are, you need huge luck, like one of them leaves (why should they? it’s an guaranteed win?)… you literally shoot into the void, even if you see a hitmarker, theres no damage registered, on the other hand, you get pulled by ghalt or shayne even if you’re meters around the corner… playing sniper characters is useless, adding CC’s on enemys becomes a gamble…
playing in a private match, with a broadcaster and optimal region for both (optimal means both teams with yellow bars) maybe more fair, but even with yellow bars things like upper stated happen… that’s, if you ask me, not the environment a tournament should offer…

point 2: since many players are using mouse and keyboard on their console (biggest BS ever if you ask me… should be restricted and punished by sony, but they even sell their own hardware for this…), giving them a huge advantage against gamepad players, tell me what you want, if someone got used from pc gaming to aim with a mouse, you will have always an advantage, if 2 marquis do a sniper battle, and one is using a pad and the other a M+KB, the gamepad marquis will loose, no matter how skilled he is, it’s an anatomic disadvantage that you cant compensate with skill, your thumb will never be as accurate as your wrist, and your reflexes are more targeted because you just need to move your wrist and shoot, it’s way harder with thumb and stick…
yes I know, “everyone can buy themselves M+KB”, yes I could, and because I still play much PC, I wouldn’t have to struggle like someone who’s not used to it because they usually only use gamepads, but thats not why I prefer console competitives, on PC it’s much relying on hardware, everyone has different hardware so creating an fair environment for everyone is nearly impossible, so a long time it was 100% fair on consoles, everyone had the same hardware, everyone had the same console and the same gamepad, right now, there are 2 types (classic and pro) of consoles for every brand (I don’t know if so and how much of a advantage the one to the other has, but one has updatet hardware, the other don’t…), and everyone can choose his input type, except from the classic gamepad, you can buy M+KB or these “Elite Gamepads” (I forgot the exact name right now, it’s 3am over here…),

@wintersjordan0 : how’s this issue is “solved” in HGL? do you allow the use of M+KB? if not, how are you supposed to control that? if yes, do you know how many people would like to compete in HGL, but they don’t because they know they will have an disadvantage at some point?

Oh does that depict the ones that are allowed?

Good Questions, We do have a rule in the works for Latency that is similar to the one we used in our Pro and Amature Evolve tournaments. Now if there was a way for us to detect if a player was using mouse and keyboard we would not allow it, unfortunately that is not the case :frowning: . We also have no way to detect if players are using pro controllers either or controllers that feature rear buttons etc. We know this is a problem with the console competitive scenes, but as of now there is no way to stop it from being used online because of no global hardware detection programs. We can say we restrict themy but we would have no way of detecting if they were used or not. Now I think the game developers can make their game not support mouse and keyboards on console, but I could be wrong.

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and that’s the point, there’s will be always this unfair advantage you neither can control nor compeletly ban, don’t get me wrong, I think you guys do a great job and I really appreciate your efforts in creating and competitive environment for BB, but this is the most common reason many many good players I know who tell me that they won’t participate in HGL, it’s not like they don’t want to join HGL, but they see no sense in joining a league where they know they will have an disadvantage at some point, something you cannot guarantee, it’s really frustrating to loose against such enemys in public queue, but noone would play a serious season if they know at some point there will be an enemy team with M+KB who will crit them into oblivion…

Wow that’s a pretty benign gear set there.

For them going for pure stat sticking during the tournament they really toned down all the GG rolls you can put on stuff. The good news is though that that gear set actually controls at least Orendi. Benny’s gonna be strooooooooooooooong same with Ernie. Most tanks are not going to reach the GG Hp/shield stack. You can’t get the GG stack heal rolls for Miko or Alani either. Some characters will be borderline un-pickable.

I am unhappy about their being no health regen gears and would like to know the reason they are excluded. Also why their are no healing received as well.

Do you know if the gear will be given to the people playing or are they just expected to have it?

Overall the characters are really going to be banking hard on the innate strength of the actual BB. It’s cool to do it that way but also devalues the point of gear in the game.

I’m hoping for a lot of reyna play this tourney cause she is set up to be pretty dang strong with the over all lack of GG rolls on heals.

Where can I find the Gear list?

That reminds me of a movie called “the wizard” about an autistic kid who is a wiz at video games and goes to a big tournament. At the end, the final three competitors have too play a brand new game that no one had ever played before! It was super Mario 3! Because it was also 1989.

It would be awesome if they revealed supercharge mode this way. There would be no denying that the playing field would be even. And people would watch the compitition just to find out about the new mode.

I am not trying to be sarcastic, but it really looks like the ones who decided the format and rules for this tournament are not people that play the game at a high level in any way shape or form. They seem entirely unfamiliar with the game. I enjoy a good meltdown game as much as the next guy, but it isn’t really a competitive mode in a moba. It is essentially team death match in the presence of a few minions. There is little penalty for death, worst case scenario being maybe a few minions get in a team wipe.

Make a huge mistake like a team wipe in incursion and you will lose your sentry, if not half the second as well.

I didn’t get to look at the gear list, but that was the easiest decision they had to make. The most obvious choice would be no lore gear whatsoever. The second most obvious choice would be purple and below so there are no passives on gear. Passives change helix, which changes characters, which undermines the integrity and foundation of the game itself.

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It has a free shard and wrench that don’t hurt orendi, and a blue skill damage piece as well as max health skill damage piece. She’ll be more than fine.