Damage reduction taken away?

Hey,

Could someone clarify whether this is really a mod that makes the character take 7% more damage because it takes away 7% damage reduction?

Or am I misunderstanding this

Thanks for answering, I’m guessing perhaps the minus damage reduction is put there because the other stats are supposedly higher/stronger so it balances itself, since +3 on a max 3 points skill (as in the pic) is pretty strong. I just wasn’t sure, thanks for confirming

Has anyone actually tested this though to make sure they didn’t actually just screw up the symbol like they did with some of the guardian rank bonuses? Because some of them show negative when they actually show positive on passive stats in skill trees and both work as increases even though one of them states negative.

Actually I’m not sure anymore.


I found a mod that has only dmg reduction on it, and it’s -16%. Maybe they ■■■■■■ it up again, and put minus instead of plus, because they were reading it being damage reduction, thus it should be minus. While Resistances are all plus, and any other damage reduction within other effects or in skills are plus.
So I can only guess that who ever made that mistake is not a gamer and took things literally, -100% damage reduction aka I take 100% less damage.

If I had -100% of damage reduction aka my damage reduction effect is 100% weaker, I would take 100% more damage, like +100% more damage taken.
Or by the off chance it really is -16% damage reduction aka I take 16% more dmg, no ■■■■■■■ idea why though.

Or someone made a mistake somehow and put a minus instead of plus, no idea why didn’t they check if it’s okay and consistent with all the other damage reduction stats.

I tested somewhat with it, by shooting with a physical rocket launcher at my feet, used also a shield that makes me immune to shock dmg, so I don’t kill myself when I shock myself.
Tested it by using no artifact (only used artifact to heal myself instantly to full health by equipping and unequipping the item, because it has that -75% health factor).
Anyways used no mod and the -16% damage reduction mod with 2600 shield and 3500 health. Without the mod I dropped my health around to 2200 at most or min 0 shield only, average was 2500-3000 health. Then with the mod at most it took my health to 2500, mostly it took only the shield down almost. Very rarely with the minus dmg reduction mod I took health damage.
Considering the damage most likely has min-max range of damage.

So guess it’s safe to say the minus damage reduction works like plus damage reduction.

1 Like

I think that the stat is to reduce damage taken

On gear where the fire rate is increased, it says ‘increased by X%’ unless it’s written in the tool tip to at the bottom… Then it is rewritten as ‘+X% fire rate’

Damage reduction - 16% would make sense in the list above… But moving that information to the tool tip at the bottom without recognizing the wording difference was likely an oversight.

It wouldn’t make sense, it’s worded as damage reduction. If you add more of it, you take less damage, if you take it away you take more damage.

There are plenty of other damage reduction stats that use +% infront of the damage reduction in mid sentence. This is the only time it tells -% and both of them are in the bottom stat list.

It’s “-16% damage reduction” if it’s in the above or below list, the wording stays the same in the same order, it’s a minus not a slash.
It doesn’t matter if it’s in the above or bottom list, they are the same, it’s just bottom or above.

Anyways this instance of - dmg reduction is the same as all the other + dmg reductions, it increases your damage reduction.

1 Like

I think you’re taking + and - too literally…

Damage reduction - 16% should be translated as: Damage reduction, take 16% less damage.

Putting the stat in front does make it confusing in the bottom tool tip, but if you always keep the word minus in mind when reading it then it’ll be confusing no matter what. Stats increase and lower effects, the translation from effects in game to English is just the hurdle.

Dude 16% damage reduction is take 16% less damage, if you add more of it, aka 32% you have even more damage reduction.
-16% should be +16% like every other ■■■■■■■ damage reduction stat, or like weapon damage, or resistance.
This isn’t a delay stat, if you have less of it, then it’s better.

If you have -100% damage reduction, then literally it means you take more damage.
If you have +100% damage reduction, then literally it means you take less damage.

3 Likes

Damage resistance +X% would help you take less damage
Damage reduction - X% would help you take less damage

Perhaps try thinking of it that way instead… If that doesn’t work I can’t help you. Happy hunting

Edit - although honestly damage reduction makes it sound more like how much damage you deal rather than take as long as we’re being picky… As far as translation goes it’s just broken all around.

Your first sentence is +%.
Your second sentence is hyphen %.
The game does not use hyphens, it uses minus before %. The opposite of plus.
There is no point of the hyphen to be there, and it’s wrong to have a minus. Aka it should be plus like all the other +% damage reductions.
If you have more damage reduction you take less damage.
If you have less of it, you take more damage.

The stat at least does reduce your damage taken, but it uses a wrong punctuation.

1 Like

Borderlands has been inconsistent in signage and terms. This is how it usually works:

1 - Reduction = 1/(1 + Resistance)

Let’s say you have a shield that offers 17% damage resistance (0.17) against corrosion.

1 - Reduction = 1/(1 + 0.17)
1 - Reduction = 0.855
Reduction = 0.145 or 14.5%

So a resistance of 17% results in a reduction of 14.5%. 100 points of raw damage is converted to 85.5 points.

A resistance of 100%, therefore, does not make your vault hunter immune.

1 - Reduction = 1/(1 + 1.0)
1 - Reduction = 0.5
Reduction = 0.5

100 points of raw damage is cut in half, applying 50 points to your vault hunter.

Some “resistance” relics in BL2 were actually reduction relics mathematically. A 29% reduction is significantly better than a 29% resistance.

Double negative values in English become positives. A -10% reduction literally means an increase. However, Gearbox is trying to emphasize that the stat decreases something undesirable, despite the confusion caused by a double negative.

Let’s say you have 10 dollars. If you reduce your money by 10%, you would have 9 dollars. If you “reduce” your money by -10% instead, you would then have 11 dollars. Of course we would simply say “increase” (rather than reduce by a negative rate).

1 Like

English is obviously the problem here, reading it like a sentence is why you’re struggling at all. There’s a stat, and a value. You get damage reduction, the effect is -X% out of base damage.

No one says to reduce your money by -10%, so why folks are actively trying to read it this way in game is baffling. There are serious problems with the game, I have no problem with the syntax of it being changed but can’t y’all just let it go and have them focus on actual issues instead of insisting there’s problems where most people don’t have them?

Damage reduction is better than max health then I assume?

Damage reduction affects the damage your health takes, and the damage your shield takes as well. Increasing your health only prevents one of those bars from going down…

So unless your build is focused on one of those fancy 0 point shields then damage reduction will always be the better stat if the option if available.

Pretty sure damage reduction also stacks additively. I set up a build that had 96% damage reduction (if it is additive, there was a 24%, a 16%, and a 56%) and took almost no damage from attacks from anything.

In most other games, resistance is multiplicative and reduction is additive (but there are far more restrictions on what grants that).

I’m not struggling.

Let’s say a cursed item had a penalty. How would you display that on the item card using the common stats?

-10% damage reduction? Right?

That would boost 100 points to 110 points. Ouch. Of course Gearbox could create a new stat called “damage increase” for a relic or shield, but that would require a new string that adjusts to the hidden data value . (A value of -0.1 would cause reduction to be overwritten with increase and print the absolute value of the float as a percentage value, displaying “10% damage increase”.)

A beneficial item has, as we expect:

10% damage reduction

Treating -10 as equivalent to +10 is absurd and cavalier. Positive and negative operators matter. Yes, we can assume Gearbox meant that 100 damage is processed as 90 damage. But that is an assumption, one which may be incorrect in a game with wild statistics as nerfs and buffs.

Because if you get -10% max health you’re getting less health, if you get -10% weapon damage you get less damage.
Why the heck do you think that the english language is the problem in here? It’s not.
You are the problem.
There is no double negative. Damage Reduction is just Damage Reduction, if you have -50% of it, it doesn’t reduce damage anymore, it starts to increase the damage.
If I have 50% or +50% Max Health I gain that much, if I have -50% I loose that much.
If I have 50% or +50% Damage Reduction I gain that much, if I have -50% I loose that much.
How hard is it to understand that? Stop making it into a double negative. - isn’t a plus, it’s minus. Also it’s not a hyphen.
Othererwise you’re all idiots who think that (minus, not ■■■■■■■ hyphen)-50% = (plus)+50%. If it would be using a hyphen it would be “sentence - -50% or sentence - +50%”.
“-% damage reduction should be + as it gives you damage reduction, it doesn’t decrease your damage reduction”
It’s the only stat in the game that has minus while it’s increasing the plus value. While every other stat minus value decreases your plus value.

So please for the ■■■■■ sake stop thinking it’s a double negative and turning a minus into a plus. It’s mistake and should be plus, plus(dr)+plus(dr) is plus, minus(dr)+plus(dr)=less of a plus(dr) or minus(dr). If you have a stat like delay, then you want the minus, the more minus you have the better.

If you have problems of understanding any of this, think of it this way, how do you decrease “damage reduction”, with a damn minus.

2 Likes

I was wondering about this and did some testing( respeced didn’t spec anything)and my class mod offers -18 reduction. With a rocket launcher doing 4177 to handsome jack cutout. Shot myself with and without mod with without I took 2089 with it I took 1770. After messing with all these numbers I figured 1770 x 18%= 318.6 which rounded up is the difference between 2089 and 1770. Not sure why it’s like that but whatever. In summery - reduction is good lol

The people that created this portion of the game either have a very poor grasp of the English language or couldn’t fix how item cards are displayed in time for launch so yes, in the english language it literally means a 7% penalty to your damage reduction.

Practically speaking that’s not what’s happening. Your damage reduction is already a negative value so subtracting more from it just makes it a bigger negative and therefore more effective.

No need to panic.

Based on the wording throughout the game it makes sence in its context; if it was “+” it would act as additive to eachother; this way its in line with damage reductions on roughrider and skills so that there is no true 100% as they diminish with each boost to it;
there were parts in bl2 that looked the same aswell; but with bl math things get funky and we end up with what we’ve got
Take fl4ks skills for example; on paper it seems you can get 75% reduction, but really its only 37.5% - 25% = 12.5% as its 75% of damage is shared with your pet