Digistruct Peak enemy typing issue and why your fire guns suck there


#1

I’m sure I’m not the only player who’s had nightmares about Digistruct Peak. Slag skags, centurions, the assassins, Dukino’s Mom… These enemies just refuse to die. Even worse, tactics that work in the main game don’t always work in Digistruct Peak.

Let’s use Dukino’s Mom for our example, as she illustrates my point (and the fundamental problem) perfectly. Using Axton, and expert grenadier com, a 39% corrosive bone and a corrosive Fastball I am able to 100-0 Lynchwood’s Dukino with 20 grenades. Digistruct Peak’s version of Dukino? Not even close. So what’s happening? Why does my tactic work in Lynchwood but not Digistruct Peak? Let’s look at some screenshots.

The same spec was used through all tests. BAR was disabled. Kill Skills and Battlefront were inactive in all tests, unless stated otherwise. All Baby Makers, Topneaas and Fastballs are identical to one another except for their element. Fastball tests were done with a genadier COM, the rest of them with a L. Soldier COM.

Our lynchwood fastball is hitting a lot harder than our Digistruct fastball. How much harder, exactly?

48879 / 27930 = 1.75x

Immediately recognizable as the multiplier corrosive damage receives when used on armored targets. Dukino’s Mom in the Peak is taking normal (1.00x) damage from our corrosive fastball. So then, what if we used a shock fastball? Explosive?

All good here! An incendiary fastball?

11172 / 27930 = 0.4.

Lynchwood Dukino takes the appropriate amount of damage when hit with the incendiary fastball. The Digistruct Dukino has taken neutral damage from all fastballs. She has no typing – she is simply “normal” and is neither vulnerable nor resistant to any of the above damage types.

Further tests with guns:

This problem is not limited to Dukino’s Mom. In fact, it applies to every single flesh enemy in Digistruct Peak. All skags and bandits are like Digistruct Dukino: pure “normal” with no typing. They take equal damage from all elements unless they have an explicit resistance (Oney and explosive, Wot and shock). They also take equal damage from pure splash weapons.

Spiderants are a bit tricky in that they take neutral damage from all elements when shot in their crit spots (unless they explicitly resist like Scorch vs. fire), but have some multiplier when shot with a pure splash weapon. I don’t know why this is but if I had to guess I’d think that since they are a collection of different damage modifiers, one of them probably still reads elemental modifiers but it only makes up a fraction of the spiderant’s total health pool. But that’s a guess.

Loaders are largely unchanged from their regular game counterparts. Their damage formula works as it should, body and dismember-able limb shots receive the appropriate bonuses, while the eye is a neutral crit. However, the eye being neutral and receiving equal damage from fire, shock and corrosive isn’t unique to Digistruct Peak.

Body shot + joint crit:

Eye crit:

Constructors’ eyes are also neutral both in and out of Digistruct Peak. Here are some screens from opportunity:

Overall, this has a pretty massive impact on Digistruct Peak runs. All incendiary weapons operate at only 57% their efficiency because flesh enemies aren’t actually coded as flesh there. I haven’t found any Loader type enemies with neutral typing or crits that aren’t also neutral in normal play.


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Elements on the Peak
(Jac856) #2

That’s really interesting, thank you for the information. Must have taken some time.


(Business Casual) #3

They aren’t coded as flesh because they are Digistructed Biological Entities. You can easily digistruct a robot or loot chest from the right materials, mostly metals, plastics, and composites.

Human flesh, however, is a bit trickier, and Tannis is way too spun out to calibrate the Synthetic Recombination Grid right now, OK?

It was all she could do to get the spiderant chitin to remain tangible, especially with the mucous shortage that followed the patenting and subsequent licensing of her seismograph design…


(I ate the skag that ate my homework) #4

Enemies in the Peak have a higher damage resistance than normal. That’s why you deal less damage. Dunno how much, though.


(lalala) #5

I have known this issue with the flesh enemies in the Peak, and how Centurion Slag Spiderants bow to nothing but my SWORDSPLOSION!!! (because of the splash, I guess). But about the Constructor, Loader eye crits, and Dukino’s Mom… those are new to me.

Great chunk of info!


(King Ged) #6

Bumping this. Everyone should know this. Good stuff.


(Johnrr6) #7

So…for flesh type enemies at the Peak…A Non elemental weapon is best???

Non elementals base damage is always higher then the elemental version. It’s the elemental multiplier that gives the elemental the advantage.

If that multiplier is neutral…would not it always be best to use a non elemental versaion or whatever version you have with the highest base damage??

for instance…instead of a shock Sandhawk on Scorch…a non-elemental Sandhawk??


#8

We had the same problem on another thread.

Basically, traditional flesh targets are element neutral : all elements do the same damage.

Spiderants however have various weird elemental resistances on their heads but are least resistant to shock. Their crit zones (thorax) are neutral however - all elements equal.

Robots are weak to corrosion as usual.

Dukino is neutral.

The Assassins have their traditional resistances.

The only enemies that I would entertain non-elemental would be spiderants ( including Scorch and the Black Queen ) but shock works extremely well.

Otherwise the “corrosion rule” rules. Fun huh?
Edit : to specifically answer your non-e question: Relics will boost elemental above non-e in all cases ( except perhaps spiderants)


(Johnrr6) #9

Can you bring me up to speed on this rule?

Are you saying at the Peak you can’t go wrong with Corrosion??

And how does Explosive count in all of this?

The game treats it like an element sometimes…and sometimes not.

How does the Peak do with Explosive??


#10

Yes : corrosion is the most consistent as flesh doesn’t matter and robots are very weak to it. Again the spiderants though : shock is most consistent.

Explosive seems to be the same as outside the Peak. I had no idea how to test it so I didn’t. Everyone brings a DPUH there so it must be ok.

I started a post called “Elements on the Peak”. There’s some interesting posts various people have made.


(Johnrr6) #11

Thank you and I read the other threads too.!!

A friend told me to wait till Level 78 to get my Sandhawk off my New Zer0 Charecter.

Told me to get Corrosive and nothing else.

Good advice for the Peak…

If you can keep the Bee up and stay alive…it just blows everything away but I RARELY use this combo because the Bee is just like tissue paper for defense…too risky.

And then there are the Assassins…where a Bee is absolutely useless…at least to me.


#12

Some people somehow manage to keep their Bee up in that arena. I can’t - Blockade in there for me.


(Johnrr6) #13

I was Farming Marcus at level 78 for anything to help in there and I got a Grounded Turtle shield…very nice stats

At OP6 Level 78…you get two damned surveyors at the same time as two Assasins with a bunch of loaders and spider ants.

The Damned surveyors keep knocking out my Blockade and I eventually go down.

Do you think that would be more effective then a reasonably good level 78 Blockade with it’s built in resistances?


#14

I’m a bad one to ask about Turtles - I very rarely use them ; but that particular one (grounded) sounds ideal for that.


(Johnrr6) #15

Thanks…went down 4 times in a row last night…frustrating…

But I’m stubborn as hell so I will get there…LOL


#16

Using Quasars was the tipping point for me. I’d just keep throwing them every 8-10 seconds to keep them off my back.


(Johnrr6) #17

That is a heck of a good idea…will give it a try. Thanks!

Mine is only a level 72 but it should at least semi keep them away.


#18

The level won’t make a difference to the singularity effect and it will still do a damn good job of stripping their shields - so you are set to conquer! (Also , a lower level one won’t do as much damage to you if you get caught in the blast!)


(Johnrr6) #19

I suck…LOL

Got the first one down…and all the rabble and the second pair spawned before I had a chance to kill the original awsecond one…

Three on one and I ran out of grenades…

And Oney did one of his quick charges and blocked my shooting path to the one I almost had down and was at least counting on a second wind from.

Oh well…

I was breezing through till I hit this level…must be my weaponry or style of play or…

I just suck…LOL


(Johnrr6) #20

Finally…Made it through OP6…9 tries all told…LOL

Strange what got me over the hump.

An OP6 Blockade I got off my main Commando with a low delay and GREAT recharge rate. Not the highest cap…but that delay and recharge saved my bacon.

Ran out of DPUH ammo because with a Chaotic Neutral Rogue and Sheriffs Badge and TwoFang at 11/5…it’s a HOSE but it did the trick…got three of the four of them down.

Oney I took down with a Caustic Bone Shredder I had just picked up earlier.

That Bone Shredder impressed me a lot…had never used one before…with all the FR buffs from TwoFang and the Chaotic Neutral Rogue…it to was like a HOSE!

Oh and this topic is SPOT ON…

I have yet to use a Fire Gun at the Peak!!