Do you feel the Battleborn health/shield pools are balanced? (Graphs and data within!)

Let’s have a discussion about Battleborn health, shields, and whether we think there are any obvious outliers!

To prompt some thoughts, here’s a handy visual representation of the base health and shields of the Battleborn cast. (Green for health, blue for shields.) This obviously doesn’t factor in any helixes for +health or +shield (of which there are many).

Here’s some more numbers to prompt discussion:

The median health+shield pool in Battleborn is 1436 - Caldarius, as it happens!

To give a proportional sense of Battleborn health+shield pools, I’ve listed the percentage of the median that each BB possesses. Boldur’s position, which may raise eyebrows, is partly the result of his recent health nerf, partly the consequence of having no shield. (His actual survivability is, of course, heavily influenced by his toggle-shield, overshield, and Rage +DR.)

Mellka: 69.08%
Alani: 72.08%
Miko: 72.84%
Orendi: 78.69%
Thorn: 78.69%
Marquis: 83.29%
Ambra: 84.96%
Kid Ultra: 84.96%
Pendles: 84.96%
El Dragon: 86.14%
Benedict: 89.35%
Reyna: 91.23%
Oscar Mike: 96.87%
Whiskey Foxtrot: 96.87%
Caldarius: 100%
Rath: 103.27%
Ernest: 104.39%
Deande: 106.75%
Ghalt: 117.55%
Toby: 117.55%
Boldur: 118.59%
Phoebe: 122.70%
Galilea: 130.92%
Kleese: 133.77%
ISIC: 135.10%
Kelvin: 141.57%
Shayne & Aurox: 161.42%
Montana: 173.47%
Attikus: 190.74%

Not being intimately familiar with the entire cast, I’d like to solicit advice on which Battleborn have shield and health helixes - for example, Mellka can get up to 10 stacks of 30 health with Eldrid Rhythm (level 5), which are lost at death. (This would increase her slightly to 89.97% of the median, and obviously she can’t access this health until mid-game.)

Kelvin’ Chomp mechanic is obviously impossible to factor in here.

Health and shield can be treated as two parts of an overall resource pool, and I’ve done that here, but obviously they also behave differently in key respects. In one respect, shield is superior (being so quickly replenishable), but a large health pool also has its merits (there are more abilities in-game that can replenish health.) I’d be interested to know what you all think about shield vs. health and whether Eldrid are disadvantaged (especially when the lowest three in this list are Eldrid.)

Damage reduction is a key feature of survivability that can’t be taken into account here.

You all know what my feelings are regarding the most extreme outlier in this data, so I’ll resist from commenting on her straight away. Over to you!

13 Likes

Eldrid
Alani: -
Boldur: lvl1 225 Oshield 8s, lvl9 114 hp x5
Kelvin:lvl1 360hp
Melka:lvl5 30hp x10
Miko:-

Jennerit
Ambra: passive 300shield
Attikus: lvl7 360hp
Caldarius:-
Deande:-
Rath:-

LLC
El dragón:-
Isic: lvl3 240shield
Kid ultra: drones 250 hp x2-4
Kleese: 15 shield x lvl, lvl8 150 shield
Marquis:-
Phoebe: lvl3 240 shield

Peace keepers
Benedict:-
Ernest:-
Galilea:-
Galth: lvl3 240 shield,
Montana: lvl3 360 hp, lvl6 240 shield
OM: -

Rogue
Orendi:-
Pendles:-
Reyna: shield booster 225 Oshield, lvl6 112 Oshield
S&A: lvl1 225 Oshield, lvl7 240 shield
Toby: lvl3 240 shield
Wft:-

Edited: @EdenSophia

3 Likes

I honestly think Mellka’s health is fine. I only die once a match with her, if at all.

Of course, I always play her with health regen+health regen, max health+max health, and Blissbeast, so my opinion might be biased.

Tbh, if anyone, I think Caldarius needs a health buff. He has lots of mobility, but despite this he is still easy to hit and kill.

1 Like

I knew the 3 Eldrid would be low on the list but didn’t realize how low

What!?! Caldarius needs MORE health? He’s already the most mobile, has great CC, already good health, he has everything going for him
Also eden this makes me sad
I’m surprised to see how much Attikus has. Why are the Eldrid still lower class citizens or broken though? Are they that hard to balance?

1 Like

I can say the same thing… but I rarely get more than 2 deaths a game with any character. I can just as easily go zero deaths with Caldy, for example. So I’m not sure it’s so much a distinctive feature of Mell, but more that playing Mell regularly encourages good survival technique (not to downplay how good Air Stall and Lunge are, of course.)

4 Likes

The fact that like 80% of melka players run regen or health gear means something dont you think?

Pre melka nerf i played with skill dmg, attack/speed power, reload and recoil gear now i go with regen and hp, i dont feel like i can go something else without risk.

I constantly see what gear ppl use to get an idea of what they are aiming for.

Gear for me usually is to boost a trait not cover a weakness.

5 Likes

In terms of Eldrid health regen vs not having a shield, I think that each Eldrid should have their own specific regen rate. Gearbox kind of tried a little bit with this because Boldur used to have a base regen of 4 not 7. Each Eldrid plays differently and survives differently.

I don’t want to give numbers because I would just be pulling them out of thin air but Boldur and Kelvin should have low regen (compared to the others) since they have plenty of survival with out it. Thorn and Mellka should have a high base since they have low health pools and little self sustain, it would support their mobile playstyles by rewarding evasive play. Miko and Alani… I have no clue where you would their regen at. It’s difficult to say because they can both heal themselves quite effectively. Especially Miko, I’m not surprised Miko has the third lowest health because Biosynthesis is amazing.

1 Like

All four non-tank Eldrid are in bottom-5.

I’ve realized symbiotic gauntlet can replace my vest, as long as I also take skill damage with health

For Phoebe (Helix 3):

Shield Stabilizers
Increases Phoebe’s maximum shield strength and shield recharge rate.
+240 Shield Strength
+105 Shield Recharge per second.

1 Like

I agree. With Mellka, what would be a crazy “health stacking” load-out on another character is a basic, “staying competitive” load-out for her. Sometimes, when I’m doing serious work on a Ghalt or Phoebe yet their health bar just won’t budge, I’ll check their gear and see they’re three-stacking purple Eldrid items. I’ll smile in realization, announce on mic that so-and-so is stacking health and that’s why they’re damn hard to kill…

…then I remember that I’m running a similar loadout, and I feel sad. hahaha

4 Likes

Anytime I use the bottom 3 I run +max health/ +max health gear otherwise I just feel too squishy

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Just my personal experience. Even very mobile Caldarius players go down very quickly, and don’t dish out very much damage.

I’ve never had to say, “everybody watch out, it’s Caldarius!” since he is so easily dealt with

2 Likes

Frankly, I do not run a single character without at least one health item. 2 gear pieces on most, but even 3 on some.
Stacking health is the only thing that helps against being stuck in a cheesy combo where you die with no chance of retaliation. (And sometimes not even then)

As for the original question, I feel like it is a bit hard to answer, since so much depends on other factors.
But my final answer would probably be "No, it is not balanced."
With a lot of hard CCs around, most of the cast die with no chance of retaliation.
On the other hand, on a team without hard CC, it could be hard to get many kills if health was buffed. Then again, if it is hard to kill people, more focus might be on pushing, which is a good thing!

I could give a longer, detailed and more opinionated answer, but this is the short version. ^^

1 Like

Have you played Kelvin? (This is a serious question by the way. Not sarcastic or offensively meant. Idk how else to put the question. ;p)

Kelvin has 1 skill that let’s him escape. Other than that, he is not survivable at all. All he survivability comes from HP regen. Yeah, Kelvin may start with 141% health and he can get it to 4K… But he has to chomp the entire game for that, and focus less on everything else while he is trying to get HP. If you target him early game, he is never, ever going to get survivable or be a threat to anyone. I’d say, give Kelvin MORE HP regen so he is an option to chose in PvP. Now, any good team can destroy him with ease.

Also… Holy, I didn’t notice Miko’s health was so low! It’s weird because usually I don’t die when playing Miko…

3 Likes

Oh yes, I play a mean Kelvin. This is what he has for survival:

  • Massive, constantly growing health pool

  • Shields upon activating skills and damage reduction to go with it

  • Arguably the single best escape in the game (remove collision with anything that has a health bar and stun them while gaining increased movement speed for potentially 6 seconds? Yes please!)

  • And the versatile as all hell Ice Wall

  • (this one is a little situational) The life steal on chomp takes advantage of new stronger minions late game health pools and can actually heal Kelvin for around 200 points per chomp with how high their health gets in addition to adding more health.

I acknowledge his weak points of having an easy hitbox and crit spot but Kelvin has a lot going for him right now.

Dude, Kelvin is a god damn beast in PvP right now. You just have to play him right.

Edit: Health regen also benefits characters with smaller health pools the most while ones with mid sized get the most out of increased max health and characters with massive health pools get the most out of damage reduction. Increased HP regen doesn’t do to much when you are missing 2,000 points of health. This is in my experience.

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I can play him right. But in high level play, I think he is going to be one of the worst characters.
I can also kill him right. It’s extremely easy to make sure that Kelvin is not going to get his late game.Yeah, he can escapce. But that means you’ve chased him away and now he can’t chomp. If he can’t chomp he can’t gain his HP. Players who know how to deal with Kelvin just make Kelvin useless IMO.

Never seena beast Kelvin in PVP. I’ve seen people do very good with him, but in those cases the enemy team clearly didn’t know how to stop him. Even if a Kelvin gets like 20 kills in a match like that, I wouldn’t call him a beast just because the enemy team couldn’t deal with him.

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I don’t know what to say. I’ve done well with him against good players. He’s countered pretty hard by characters like OM Whiskey and Ghalt because they can easily take advantage of him being an easy target. Sublimate is great at securing kills for your teammates and whenever I play him I usually have most minion kills. Provided there isn’t an Orendi or Ernest on my team.

I’m not saying he’ll lead in kills but he’s definitely a solid choice.

Agree to disagree then. ;p