Everything wrong with Battleborn (and how to fix them!)

nah, it’s facts. there’s no reason to pick 100 percent slow over a one sec stun, three sec silence, or 15+ attack speed

[quote=“LinkZeppeloyd, post:36, topic:1556411”]
Honestly not usually- you could avoid them by rounding the corner for example. While yes Bene is very deadly, i also find him a very easy BB to kill. [/quote]

I also personally find Mellka very easy to kill, but I know that’s not the experience of the majority of players. I put that down to my experience with the way she moves. Though I play on PS4, I have no issue knocking her out of the sky with Blade Launcher, landing a clip or canister on her, etc. Air Stall and Spike are both not too hard to keep up with, when you know how they affect her trajectory. It’s only when she Lunges that you lose a bead on her. Her hitbox is tricky, but no worse than Thorn or Alani.

As I mentioned earlier, venom was the vast majority of her wave damage. Two reasons:

Parting Gift. A Parting Gift pool re-applies venom every second somebody is standing in it. This means that minion waves took nine seconds of venom damage (five seconds + four seconds thereafter.)

Here’s what her wave clear damage looked like pre-hotfix, at level one, over nine seconds:

208 damage Spike
388 damage venom
108 damage parting gift
= 704 damage to a wave

Here’s what it looks like now, over nine seconds:

208 damage spike
54 damage venom
108 damage parting gift
= 370 damage

Now you could argue that 704 wave damage at level 2 was OP (and I wouldn’t necssarily disagree, although this was a perfect scenario that required a minion wave to stand still for 9 seconds.) Cutting it half, however, was too much, especially as these numbers don’t t scale terribly well. Also, the Parting Gift pool is very small until level 6, and minions tend to walk around it, so it needed to be damaging to be effective. Also, Mellka’s wave clear was riskier than most, as it had to be initiated from melee range (w/Spike).

Secondly: her canisters did AE damage, and that splash made it very useful in lane and against waves. It gave Mellka the flexibility to focus on harassment if the team was trapped behind a choke, for example, or if a Gali was locking down the line. Realistically, no single player target is going to die to that venom bombardment, but it keeps the healer busy - and that gives her a window to strike. It also softens the wave if she can’t realistically get in for a Spike.

With her wave clear so weakened, Mell now levels more slowly and is at more threat from the minions themselves; with her venom no longer any kind of threat, players can simply ignore it, costing her those moments of confusion and opportunity she use to capitalize on.

That’s not counting the huge DPS decrease to Refined Canisters, the fact that venom now does negligible damage yet remains equally necessary to core skills like Eldrid Rhythm and her Wound mechanic, etc. It weakened many of her helixes, removed one of her most valid playstyles, and did nothing to address the issues people actually have with the character.

In other words, if they needed to nerf her, they nerfed the wrong thing. She’s not that much fun to play now, at least to me, because her wave clear was a bouncy, joyous thing; but she will still dive you and kill you at the sentry, because all she needs is Spike or Blade Launcher off-cooldown to do it.

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Again, those are your opinions, not facts. I’m going to do myself a favor, and leave this thread rather than waste my time. Have a nice day, and I hope you find someone receptive to your opinions.

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lel how is it an opinion? No sane person would pick 100% slow over those options, it wouldn’t make sense tactically and right now without the stun or silence, if you wanted have max damage output you’d go with the attack speed buff. therefore it’s a fact

Except health regeneration, unlike shield capacity, doesn’t improve offensive damage at the same time as defensive capabilities through a helix.

Which isn’t really the point, I was pointing out the fact your dismissive attitude of game mechanics when someone brings them up to counter your arguments does not allow you to state your opinions as facts.

Going to agree with shortlivedflame, you don’t put forward arguments constructively and I’m out of this thread.

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shaurox isn’t necessarily best with max damage output though… the ability to chain both hard and soft CCs while still dishing out great damage is what they excel at. considering they’re not classified as attackers, that’s obvious enough to know that damage isn’t necessarily a priority of theirs.

and yeah same, I’m gone too.

i (and most of this forum) don’t appreciate your claims of what a “sane” person would or wouldn’t do, especially when it’s to denounce choices that you don’t make.

so peace :sweat:

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I feel the same way RE: Orendi. Sorry they took that from you Eden… =(

So you’re saying that she’s not as much fun to play because her waveclear is weaker, and she therefore levels slower? You may be right but she was not the only one to loose aoe waveclear power. Thorn, Oscar also did, just earlier than Mellka. Caldy’s triple nade was also pushed much deeper in the helix, making his waveclear come much later and making leveling harder. In other words, I think they nerfed quite a few aoe/waveclear abilities, not just Mellka’s.

It may just be because people aren’t picking her now, but it to me it seems that while she can still dive, she can’t DoT people to death in the process anymore, at least not with the crazy efficiency she did before.

But what is the solution? How to un-nerf her without making her OP again?

I could probably have lived with it, if not for the lag thing. :disappointed:

It used to be that, whenever we got shoved onto a west coast US server and I was rubberbanding/reload-glitching all the over place, I could just say, “Okay, no big deal, I’ll handle wave clear this match.”

Now that option isn’t viable, leaving me with nothing but awful-laggy-assassin in those situations. And because the game doesn’t properly show connection until the game starts (and characters are picked), you always have to assume the worst - which is why @Ginger_greninja, who loves Phoebe, was never able to pick her.

It’s a completely personal detail, but as I said above, as an Australian player, having that wave-clear playstyle as an option was very important for me. To me it’s as profound a change as if Alani lost her ability to heal, and Torrent instead only did damage. I loved playing assassin Mell, and I embraced it when I wasn’t on an EU or West server, but on those servers, I played wave clear.

I feel like my character is gone.

Mellka’s wave-clear was a combo, rather than just a single WC power, though. That’s Spike and venom and a helix option (Parting Gift) all stacked together. Now she can stack those three things and still not do viable wave clear. To my mind, it wasn’t intentional, but was a knock-on effect that Gearbox didn’t factor for… but seemingly are not troubled by.

Unwind the venom hotfix, revert her to launch health, and either increase the cooldown on Claw Lunge or reduce its altitude. And that would be done and dusted, imho.

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I think you’re probably right about the unintended effect of the stacked abilities. I think one reason we love BB is the depth of really learing a character, which skills to chain, how they move, etc. I also think it is entirely possible that some players have gotten to know the BB better than the devs themselves.

The aussie server issue absolutely sucks, but I also think it wouldn’t make sense to balance characters based on the effects lag have on them.

On the unintended consequences thing, I’ll say this: currently my favorite BB is Alani. I destroy with her. I usually outdamage everyone on the server and often have the most kills. She got a rather massive (unintended?) buff when the minion waves were buffed. Ever since that minion-wave buff, it is just very easy to have full torrent stacks 24/7. Was that meant to happen? Was the Mellka skill/venom stack nerf intended? Its hard to say. If it wasn’t intentional it could well be reverted.

Oh, I agree - that’s why it’s just a personal note. Although I do think there’s still a serious issue when a character goes from having a great wave-clear role (not top tier, but great) to no longer being a wave-clear character at all. Now that venom is 6 DPS over 8 seconds, no minion wave in existence is going to care.

That also said, I do think it doesn’t hurt to have characters that are viable in red bar, because frankly, we all know the red bar issue is never going away. Not until they put region locking on consoles (and every indication is that they can’t.) Having viable DOT characters on the rosters helps give options for players with all kinds of connections - and it’s kinda cruel in the tenth month to take away one of the few, if not only, DOT-centric characters this game had.

Ah well. I have the memories.

Yeah I see what you mean. I guess the pain of loss is the proof of the joy that preceded it. Now I feel sad. And here in Portland, where West Coast full-green bar servers are aplenty, it’s past midnight and I need to count my blessings and get some rest. Good night to all.

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Well I started a write up on a way to go with Mellka’s design that would be fun, offer play style choice, and keep room for Venom…

But finally I just went “You know what, screw that!”

Would this new design be a fun Battleborn to play? Yes.

But would it be Mellka? No!

And that’s the point!

So much of what defines these characters comes from how we play them, over hundreds of matches, and the way we learn to move WITH them, rather than just controlling them. They start to feel alive in our hands, and changing the fundamental WAY they play changes the very essence of that experience. It turns that character in to something wholly unfamiliar, and that’s very unsettling!

So rather than post some set of suggestions, I’m going with “Just bring the old Mellka back! And also Orendi!”

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He won’t. He’s had three or four of these posts, and has yet to have a single person agree with him. The last post he made got him suspended for a week.

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I was gonna try argue with this person but he’s banned again…

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Yep. This guy just keeps creating the same topics about the same things. Glad he’s banned. Once again.

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Hey folks, there’s really no need to discuss what happens to other forum users here.

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Just stating facts like the OP was.

Aaaaaaaand it’s time to get back on topic. Thanks.

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What was the topic?

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