the game crashes still A LOT to desktop, in singleplayer HW1R mission 11 and on skirmish with AI!!!

7 of 10 Games i crash to desktop, thats bad!

What’s with the 300 mb patch issued today on steam?

More mod tools:

Can we get some sort of direct answer about strike group formations?

Specifically;

Is this being looked at and on the docket for a fix?

I can’t even play it because the ships go bananas, I honestly don’t know how this made it to retail not working at all.

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Does formations and tactics work like they did in HW1?

No

Does this break the game and make it unplayable?

Also no.

But I will support any and all efforts to improve the game from both modders and GBX. Just because I feel that the way it currently works is sufficient doesn’t mean I do not want to see this game become for greater than its component parts.

But it’s not sufficient and the biggest problems between the races in Multiplayer is the HW1 races can’t form strike groups while the HW2 races are in delta and hold it by default.

It’s broken clearly.

The engine can do it, the code is already being used by default when popping out squadrons using HW2 races, having it be broken for half the races is not ā€œsufficientā€ by any definition.

There can never be balance if HW1 ships are attacking solo and HW2 ships are attacking in formations – Especially when HW1 is supposed to support formations.

Change all the numbers you want, it’ll never work – ever. You absolutely must fix the behavior problem, they aren’t working right and that’s clearly obvious.

It does break the game and make it unplayable – you can sludge through the HW1 campaign – but it’s hardly any fun when the units don’t even follow the orders you gave them, but in skirmish or MP HW1 races will lose every time to HW2 races because of this bug. That makes it unplayable.

That’s like saying pawns can move sideways, yes it would break the game, yes you could still theoretically play it that way, but pretty much every chess player on earth would say it’s ā€œunplayableā€ as in the integrity of the game is ruined.

Like it or not, the game is designed around strike group formations being used to keep your groups together and create the alpha needed to blow up bigger class ships. The game design is still identical and now you can’t use these essential formations because they don’t work and so your fighters go bananas and attack targets of opportunity instead of the targets you’re selecting.

What’s happening is when you give an attack order, the unit is getting a move order to the target and when it goes into firing range it’s behavior changes to idle aggressive and it starts auto attacking. you can try to issue it a command and it’ll follow it for one attack and then it’ll go back to idle aggressive and start auto attacking it’s own targets of opportunity again.

When they go into idle aggressive, they are thinking as a single unit and that’s why they break formation. As soon as combat ends and they exit attack mode they go right back to being a group and idle in formation.

Idle aggressive defined, is when units are idle and an enemy comes within firing range. The units will auto attack if set to aggressive.

It’s a bug, defending the bug does not make a better game.

The new tactics is what’s probably breaking it – the aggressive tactic now functions like HW2. HW2’s tactics were changed to Passive, Aggressive, Neutral. Neutral ships wouldn’t attack unless fired upon, Aggressive, they’d fire upon any ships in their range and passive would set them to not fire at all.

When you set this behavior to a unit in HW2, it’s actually a squadron so all of them follow it, but when you set this behavior in HW1, it sets it for a single ship, so each ship starts making it’s own decisions which differ from the other ships in the formation and so their pathing represents this.

Once you put a set of units into a formation, they should be treated as a single unit in terms of A.I. and how tactics apply. Instead their being applied to each individual ship instead of the strike group.

More over, they added formations to the HW2 races, so you can take a group of squadrons and put them in a sphere formation. It doesn’t work exactly like HW1, because the Squadrons stay squadrons, but the squadrons then form the formation. The reason this was added was for balance in MP, so HW2 races could use the sphere tactic also. The end result is it doesn’t work in HW2 either for the same reason, the individual squads will break formation as soon as combat starts.

That’s like the definition of broken – the scope of this bug destroys any hope or possibility of balance between HW1 and HW2 races – you can change numbers until you’re blue in the face, but uh, until they work as a unit they aren’t working.

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Do you guys honestly think they are NOT going to try to fix it?

We just don’t know. What I think we are really wanting is a official reply saying one way or the other as to are they going to do anything further to bring back formations that behave in the manner we all grew up playing in hw1. The silence is the enemy I think. We also know they are very busy trying to fix bugs and fix small things first which is fine and great. Maybe we will get a official response/stance on the subject when they are settling down abit after a few patches to sort the vital stuff first. Well its my firm hope they might.

In my experience, fixes like that aren’t announced prior to a patch hitting. They don’t want to get peopleā€˜s hopes up if something goes wrong. So: patience is the key.

5 Likes

They are aware of it, no doubt. I’m also certain that it made it to their issue tracking system, but beyond that I have no idea. It may be still in the ā€œto doā€ list waiting for more immediate bugs to be corrected (game crashes, unfinishable missions and so on), it may be in the works right now. Or they may have decided that it’s not economically feasibile for them to fix it as it would require too much time (and thus money) to fix.
Same with fuel, resource collector behavior, healing behavior and all the rest.

Honestly I don’t expect any of these things to be fixed until the game version number rolls from 1.2x to 1.3 at the very least. That may take a few months, depending on the amount of development effort that is being poured in the game right now.

Slightly off topic, my question is: I remember watching an interview where it was said that Gearbox would love to do a remaster of Cataclysm as well (provided that the source code is found). Assuming that is correct (and that they don’t just want to fix compatibility issues in the original game), how can we expect them to properly implement mimics, ship combining, infection, defensive fields, superweapons and all the rest if they can’t even get some of the most fundamental HW1 features working?

Andrea.

Am I the only one that liked the new weapon sounds? Seriously, I understand being purist for the sake of the overall integrity of the product but that’s why they included the classic versions. Fix the bugs but leave the changes. Frak, people. It’s a remaster. If you wanted the same exact, bloody product then you should just play the classic versions.

Gearbox, please fix the bugs so things function as intented but for minor crap like this, leave it alone. I don’t agree with fleet intel voice actor change between HW2C and HW2R but just leave it alone.

I think it was good to demonstrate that they are willing to listen to the whole community and make changes where possible. I’m also pretty sure that this particular change didn’t take up too much developer time for critical bug fixes and stuff. I didn’t mind the sounds but I don’t mind the changes either :wink:

I hate to break it to either of you, but that fix was there before retail, but held back from integration for some reason. Paul Ruskay wanted the sounds you hear now, after the patch… Simple as that.

We do indeed have plenty to do, and ongoing work to lock down, bugs/features large and small to tackle :smile:

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Fair enough :+1:

This is why we can’t have nice things, BitVenom.

LOL, well, if that’s what he wanted, fine. But I actually liked them.

Honestly, I was suspecting that. The same sound was everywhere.

ā€œCompletely unprofessionalā€ is insulting hyperbole.

To follow your complaint with a specific example:
What would you suggest instead of ā€œVarious audio fixesā€?

There’s enough audio in this game that specifying the exact location of each change (in the audio files or the backend code) would be incomprehensible noise. They felt it was helpful to know that the audio was improved but that the details were unhelpful.

So you get on your box and tell them they’re unprofessional for making a reasonable trade-off in their communications. In doing so you come off as insulting and unconvincing. If you want to persuade someone to your way of thinking it is counterproductive to insult them.

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Too many words.

This was the issue I had with the them. There was no variety, which was a clear step down from the original versions. There are still some sounds that are different from the originals (see the Vaygr Lance Fighters), so I guess I’ll have to mod those in myself.

No offence BitVenom but you are wrong… As a game developer & with my experience with OTHER RTS games, including ones from Relic… You are wrong:

If they could address EVERY SINGLE LITTLE BALANCE TWEAK, you could too… It’s more work. Yes. But it’s not impossible, or not feasible. You are simply: Wrong. I really mean no offense with this, but i’m guessing you are a forum moderator and not a coder. Understandable in such a case: You are merely putting out words another person said to you. But…

When people say things: You have a choice. You either believe them(blindly) or you take into account the environment, previous phenomena and your own view of things: Then you make a decision to believe it or not. I think you chose the first one…

But simply put: No, it’s not impossible. And yes, it is feasible. ALL others do it. It is more work: But the customer is always right, at least in principle. It is the customers who buy the product and well… I’d prefer honesty from the developers of a product i’m paying for.

So at least be honest with us: You didn’t explain the changes because your team isn’t large enough and they needed to get the patch out fast: That is why there are no descriptions.

Solution: Hire more people to patch the game: There is a SINGLE person patching a previous Relic game, Dawn of War 2. His work is slower because of that yes… But he DOES actually bring up EVERY SINGLE SMALL CHANGE with patch notes. That’s ONE guy responsible for the patching of a Relic game… One with more complex engine.

So… I am not satisfied with your explanation. It might be like how you think things are, but it is not true reality. Take into account all things, and you will realize this.

Sorry for sounding patronizing. It’s hard to tell a person they’re wrong on ALL accounts without expalining exactly how…