I do not think some of the shield aspects of the trapper tree are bad, however there are too many “defensive” perks. They overlap and are redundant.
Something along the lines of debuffs and/or interactions for increased damage that involves the pet. Enemies trapped by gravity snare take % more damage from pets/Fl4k. Or add on to the existing perks, adding more damage from Fl4k to enemies targeting the pet.
There are definitely options. Though if they are going to take a look at the trapper tree, Moze and Zane also have skill trees that can use some rework.
Ill give you an easy build. Get a clairvoyance masher, a stackbot, and a pearl. It doesnt really matter after that but if you wanna take it a step further get a cryo old god with rad or cryo ase and a mitosis hunter seeker with rad or cryo ase=as long as the ase elements are not matching. Also look for jacobs assault rifle rolls on the stackbot. Dude it gets to the point where that assault rifle 1 taps every enemy if your getting consecutive crits. You actually have to retrain your brain to take it slow and line up shots lol. Its my favorite build right now and has been for about 9 months. Oh btw this is a three shot fade away build. Also throw the hunter seekers when you go into fade away.
How has he been bullied? The last real nerf is over a year ago I believe? (crit-damage changes on guerrillas in the mist). Bugs that were holding him back like cooldown-reset-issues have been resolved.
And Fl4k is in all the solo speedrun videos these days… He has so much damage that it breaks the game. Why would he need buffs?!
See, this is nice… because I don’t even agree with this build, but apparently they both work!
I think Fl4k will always have a thing where damage trades of being squishy. With all the builds people name, there is always some give and take, which is awesome.
My buddy who plays Zane was actually genuinely surprised that his health-bar was moving last time we played… With his bubble-shield and all the shield-boosting he has he was basically not used to his health bar taking hits… let alone going in fight-for-your-life. But if he tries to solo Wotan in true-takedown on M11, he is running around for 5+ minutes.
As fl4k I might go down once or even twice… but the fight is over in a minute. If I start ‘fixing’ the going-down, I will - automatically - be reducing my damage. Which is as it should be.
I can go ‘last stand otto idol’ artifact, and/or equip a shield with ‘5 seconds invulnerable after shield depletes’ with the annoint ‘after skill end trigger shield-deplete-effect’. But all those changes eat in my damage.
I’ve played a while with ‘all the elements’ mode (corrosive gun with ASE bonus shock, shield with ASE bonus fire, grenade with ASE bonus ice as an example). Take the pearl as artifact for more damage, take the otto-idol for survivability, or take a snowdrift to keep up with my speed-boosting zane + amara buddies. Pro’s and con’s in each.
But if I would go down in fight-for-my-live, I couldn’t trigger my skill so I would have the issue that all my bonus damage was gone and suddenly I don’t do sh*t. Made it fun to play because you could feel real powerful, but little mistakes - like not watching your skill cooldown - could mess it all up.
Switch to front-loader shield + a gun with urad annoint, and suddenly I always have my bonus damage, even when in fight-for-my-live. But the payoff is I’m even squishier than before. So I die more, but it’s way easier to get out of FFML.
All these pro’s and cons to changes make it nice.
Lucky-seven with urad-annoint + front-loader shield with ‘with terror get ammo regen’ + stackbot + grenade with ‘After Skill End get terror’… that’s just broken. You get infinite crits in a good lucky-seven reload, thanks to the ammo regen you don’t have to reload so you always keep the effect, the stackbot builds up with every crit (and you always, infinitely crit now so stackbot is always maxed out) and with a pearl or Jakob’s company man you get even more damage-stacking.
This is just broken so it’s no fun anymore. Badasses die in one maybe two shots, normal enemies die in one shot, when an enemy dies the bullet ricochets and kills nearby enemies and you never have ammo issues in boss fights. In the meantime, your pet runs around taunting enemies so you often have the freedom to aim and shoot how you want. And your pet revives you if you might go down in solo play.
The weekly challenge to beat 7 raid bosses took around 30 minutes… because you can kill Hemivorous within 5 minutes solo. If that’s not broken I don’t know what is.
Zane’s the fastest/easiest iirc, but every class can easily kill Wotan in under 1 minute and Hemo in well under 5. Fl4k has excellent DPS obviously, but they’re not unusual in that aspect (only Amara really lacks DPS comparatively).
It has also been empirically proven that Moze and Zane deal way, way more damage than Fl4k if you know how to/situation allows for it, although their mobbing DPS doesn’t significantly differ and there really isn’t any enemy in the game that requires that much firepower.
I would say generally speaking, Fl4k and Amara are balanced- M10 is respectably challenging with Fl4k having the DPS and Amara having the crowd control and survivability. It’s Moze and Zane that are problematic because they have both godlike DPS, CC and survivability without any difficulty/caveats. Strictly speaking the ‘weaker’ duo don’t need to get stronger to handle M10/11 well in the hands of a good player, although I maintain that ‘un-nerfing’ GiTM/LnT would be a nice way to throw Fl4ks a bone without risking breaking the game like all the mayhem scaling nonsense and increase their versatility in meaningful fashion without resorting to another niche gimmick COM.
The god-roll Lucky 7 build is ungodly, but that’s really more due to the gun than the character- it’s sorta like shamfleeting tbph it’s dumb on everyone so long as you have means of mag refill.
(Davin Dittrich - the one and only Narf)
I would call Fl4k a “vault hunter of knowledge” as they can make most gear work even on Mayhem 10 (unless said gear is just terrible on M10), but you will need to know what to do with your skill points. They have a very strong mass of different sources and formula placements of damage and can build up most weapons and even most grenades and shields to mayhem 10-worthy performance. But if you don’t know anything about the formula you can easily miss out on over half of Fl4ks damage potential.
But if you got the formula down or have even just a basic understanding of the levels of impact of various skills you will see that Fl4k can work with more different items than anyone else in the game. It’s really refreshing to see new equipment and almost always have the option to build around it or just integrate it into my existing builds.
And sure, Moze can work with anything that has splash or large magazines and Zane likes everything that doesn’t consume too much ammo or is too slow to keep his action skills up, but you will see that Fl4k can play with all of that and be fine and even competitive, or at least as competitive as the item in question allows you to be. The only thing Fl4k can’t work with too great in my experience are weapons that eat up ammo like nobodies business, like the ION Cannon for example. But even those have above average sustainability on Fl4k and profit from the great damage bonuses.
As weirdly poetic as it sounds, but playing Fl4k basically means playing what the ■■■■ you want. Fl4k is freedom in vault hunter form.
luck7-with-multiple-pellets-and-always-crits and then building your character to never have to reload is godlike on everyone, agree. But with fl4k and a stackbot it reaches the ‘broken’ qualifier in my mind :).
I probably enjoy playing flak the most. Been having a great time recently with the stone thrower, one pump chump, monocle and the kings/queens call. I think the only thing maybe missing is some sort of lifesteal but I usually only run urad so that’s not a problem for me.
With the recent introduction of Re-Volter shield, the Reflux buff (Fl4k’s signature mobbing gun), and the existence of Urad, I honestly don’t see how anyone can complain about Guerilla anymore. Damage wise, it’s still behind the 3 shot cycling fade + ASE and Re-Volter uptime I think, but Guerilla became fairly strong again, even if it lasts 5 seconds.
@derwitte I have seen you make a couple comments lately about Guerillas being strong again. I haven’t been playing a lot lately although I have been posting here - did something change with GITM other than the fixes to Head Count and ETI?
I feel like GITM has always been really, really strong for single-target damage, but it has just never been that useful for heavy mobbing because of the cooldown. Now that HC is better and there is the ASS Re-Volter, is that what you are thinking makes GITM so much stronger now? I haven’t really messed around with it, legitimately just curious. It’s not a build I normally even mess around with (I do run 3-shot FA sometimes), so I do not know.
That and Company Man are pretty much it. With Company Man you can get the mag size to sustain a gun for the entire duration of GITM without reloading, and ASS Revolter gives you enough damage outside of GITM (and a ton of damage in it) to make the build less spiky damage wise.
Gotcha, that’s what I was thinking, I was just wanting to know if I somehow missed a change the devs had made. Yeah the extra damage, mag, and crit damage from the Company Man combined with an ASS Re-Volter, I feel certain is probably really strong with Go-rill-lill-lill-lill-ahhhhz (even though I have not tried it, it’s clear to me that it would be good).
That’s right, I just made a Grape Ape joke - for anyone who is old enough to get it LOL
This doesn’t have anything to do with Fl4k but I am trying a Zane Deathless build right now with a Re-Volter and MNTIS and I am pretty sure it will be insane too. Point is that the Re-Volter is pretty silly.
I want a Vladof company man with ideal rolls to compliment my GITM FL4k. lucians calls for mobbing.period. it whoops the monarch in mobbing. The other vladof guns are single target and are great at that but nothing vladof compares with the mobbing ability of a lucians.