Fl4k pet build unplayable

Im going to try and hit the points here to the best of my ability of why I think the fl4k pet build is unplayable. Quick mention to that i’m not even sure that doing a pet build is even supposed to be an option in this game, but if it is i think it needs some attention. I understand that the pets are supposed to be a “utility” the problem with that is the skill tree includes raw pet damage as a skill and yet and i would only assume that we would be able to spec it out in that direction, and once you do it is completely ineffective. Maybe you’ve had a different experience but ive tested quite a few builds and i just cant find a way to make it effective. Flak’s pet doesn’t do nearly enough damage, not to mention if someone decides to go on mayhem 4 they literally stand no chance. Im on mayhem 2 right now and i’m managing but its kind of a slog and not very fun. Im not sure its just me but compared to the deputy fl4k build that Joltzude created , the pet build does not even come close to being effective. Honestly i would hope that a pet build would even be viable on M4 through some added annoints or just some skill buffs, but as of right now its just not cutting it. Maybe other people have a different opinion and if you have a build that works i would love to try it.

P.S. there seems to also be a problem when the aura burst skill is ended and you have racked up kills that contribute to its cooldown. When the skill ends, even though its show the bar for aura burst halfway full, it just resets the cooldown again. I dont think that should be a feature because it would be so effective for radiation annoints to keep chaining the cooldown especialy for pet builds.

-The attack command does not do anywhere near enough damage as it should, i really think the attack command is what should sell the build. Like really good anoints for it and just better damage or more effect, like the great horned skags attack command… what is that even for? Sniping someone? it does like no damage and they just fly up in the air for a second and back down, not even falling down. It should at least knock them down or something.

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I can agree that the FL4K’s pet need some more attention from the Devs, but I strongly oppose giving even more damage anoints in this game. Damage anoints are the worst mechanic in this game. The anoints should have only been utility, instead of becoming the sole focus of any builds viability.

On another note of your topic, my opinion on one particular skill in FL4K’s tree that would address some issues with action command would be Sic Em. I’d propose that points in this skill would also act like a debuff on the enemy, and when the pet has successfully used its attack command on the enemy they take increased damage from all other sources. Could also be a way of addressing Dominance in a similar way.

Yes, i really think the pet should have a good debuff system, especially in the attack command. After all, that will be the best way to combat M4.

My pet just carried me through the Maliwan Slaughter at MM2 (and I was using the Tr4iner COM, Gamma Burst, Eridian Skag, and manual Domination of enemies… maybe I’m missing something, but all those broken/terrible items seemed to work fine? My only issue is that Dominate sometimes needs more than one hit to fire.) I was pleasantly surprised at how well the pet did this far up the Mayhem options.

Is there an expectation that the pet wreck face at MM4? I’ll bring him there next and see how he does… should be able to kill some enemies with my help.

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They scale horribly and do little to no damage in M4 best use of pets are as meat shields with red fang w/ GB or Fade Away NMC.

There is some gamma burst builds that are viable but nothing wrecks better than red & green tree atm. And using the pets as main dps source won’t work at all I mean at least at the moment.

Tho i must say i dont want my pets to do all the work but i want them to at least be viable.

I think no build can compare to Rakk attack builds at the moment especially with the right anoints and weapons u can manage to have very high dps outputs. I managed to hit 9 M on Mayhem 4.

And i must say its quite sad that leave no trace in combination with guerrillas the mist isn’t a viable option anymore but maybe the consecutive hits anointment could be a game changer, well maybe but therefor i need to pray for very nice rng.

You sound like a pretty good player, i have my flak pet build specced out to be radiation and cooldown oriented, so i can keep chaining the aura burst. ill have to give that a try though to see how i do.

i agree with this somewhat, we don’t need more damage anoints.

I completely disagree with this. pets are somewhat like auto-bear in they can functions as an extension of the action skill. In their case with gammaburst.

Pet damage is bad, but if you understand how it works you can build them up to be of use. And at the least an effective agro pull 1 v 1 in the cases you can get enough distance between you and your target they’ll focus on the attacking pet.

If built well they will be very hardy.

I recommend you check out the fl4k critter lab for how to improve your pet.
https://forums.gearboxsoftware.com/t/fl4k-critter-lab/4307149/92

And my scorcher ant does pretty well on m4. the only problem is badass or heavy fire enemies as for some reason she isn’t immune to fire.

Thanks for the ping Vulcan.

OP, let me start by saying that what you’re feeling is what I feel too, and what just about all of us who want to play pet builds feel. You can make it work, but I’ll warn you right now that even I haven’t cracked the tougher areas of the game on M4, and there are very few of us trying. I’m hopeful that we’ll get some pet buffs before Mayhem 2.0, but we’ll see.

Firstly.

I understand that feeling and agree completely. There wouldn’t be so many people frustrated with FL4K’s pets if we didn’t feel like we are supposed to be able to do it.

While pet builds need work, you can’t reasonably expect them to be on the same level as something like deputy FL4K. They just aren’t on that level of damage. If you played TPS, FL4K’s pets are way closer to Wolf than DT in terms of damage. Your pet isn’t going to solo Tyreen on its own.

Now, as for the build, I would suggest taking a look at this.


Some of the pet’s attack commands scale with splash. Using the 125% splash ASE anointment and rolls on your gear, you can 200% bonus damage to attack commands. Combine that with a Deadeye class mod for 35% extra damage against high health enemies, and you can one shot mobs and badasses (with some preparation) on M4.

Not gonna lie though, COV maps are a challenge. Anointed are difficult for the pets to handle, and since you skip megavore for the Power Inside you are losing a lot of damage. I would suggest waiting until Thursday to see if there are any pet changes this week, then try again. You can do M4 as they are right now, but you can’t do everything smoothly, and it can get frustrating at times.

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heh - I just took my pet-focused FL4K to the Trial of Survival at MM4, and let him do the work (I’d help with manual Dominations for critters I found at a quarter health, grouping with a Quasar, and softening up the armored Saurians and Jabbers). We did fine until the last boss. Survival wasn’t an issue, but he did not have the damage output to kill the boss on its own before the timer ran out.

That said, I don’t think the Skag should be able to do that on his own? Like just getting through that map with support from me at MM4 seems like he’s fine. If I were to actually include my own damage, we could totally do it.

For people who want the pets to be stronger, what’s a damage mark that you think they should be able to do? I don’t think anyone thinks they should be buffed to the point they’re breaking records with their own speed runs through the Takedown, but (at MM4), what do you want the pets to do? One-shot chumps? Drop a badass through one duration of Rift? Two-shot an anointed?


This. Literally just this. I know for a fact the pet can’t do this because I have several videos of the pet in M4 not doing this. Look at this moment in particular, notice how Wolf’s attack nearly killed the badass on its own? That was with a 3X exposive/cryo multiplier and 200% increased damage from skills.

FL4K’s pet, with 300% increased damage from skills, 75% radiation damage from Gamma Burst, and 75% damage from Go for the Eyes, can take out the shield of a trash mob in M4.

I don’t know what you consider to be a good place for the pets. I can respect that we more than likey have vastly different standards on what that means. All I can say is that I have more than 50 videos up, more than a dozen of which are pet builds in M4, and no one who has seen them has been satisfied with where pets are. I’m glad I figured out a build to at least get them in the door to M4, but I also wouldn’t in a million years consider pets that are less responsive, do less damage, and die easier than almost every other pet we’ve had to be in a good place.

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I can’t see the health bar once that guy lands (otherwise Wolf just took out a quarter of its shield, but I’ll take your word for it that the rocket salvo tore him up before you critted him).

I certainly wouldn’t want them weaker than they are, am just trying to find the general expectation for requested damage output. Like the equivalent of that shot in your video would be, for example (5 Rolling Thunder stacks, Laser Guided, Level 70, carry the 1, divide by pi…) the Jabber’s launcher attack (all three shots, backed with a decent build in the Master tree, kill skills active, and a few notches in Endurance with Gamma Burst up) would take a Maliwan Heavy down from full health to half a health bar (so full shield wipe too)? Something like that at MM4?

More than that.

You’ve gotta remember, the attack command is on a 20 second cool down at base, and you need to kill enemies with it to reset its cool down. It also takes a second or two in combat just to give the command if enemies stay still. It can miss, hit obstacles, or be ignored and not activate at all. Worse yet, it can hit an enemy without killing it, leaving you unable to use the attack for another 20 seconds.

Also, the Jabber is such an outlier since it starts out doing 6x the attack command damage of most other pet. With all bonuses rolling and no debuffs, Gunslinger can hit for over 900k while the next best pet Countess can only hit that on armor, and Scorcher struggles to break even 100k. It’s the closest pet we have to doing the damage they all should be doing.

Grunt enemies don’t matter, and should be easy to kill with attack commands and even base melee provided you have the right build with Gamma Burst. Badasses should take a more specialized build and some micromanagement, but Gunslinger and Countess should be able to one shot them consistently with attack commands, and the other pets should be able to take off a significant chunk (25%). I don’t expect pets to contribute a ton vs bosses, but it should make easy work of mobs at the very least. It’s what every pet before these did.

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Now we’re talking, thanks. (This is at MM4, correct?)

Go you tube Abbyhour she has a load of fl4k builds including pet based ones all m4 viable she doesn’t really snipe with fl4k though

Yes, M4. Hopefully they’ll still be effective in M10

Not to mention the spiderants will burn up attack command trying to get to me if I’m on a different elevation, or there’s an obstacle, or if there happens to be barrel and they want to kill me for taking them away from their brood. So if I survive, I get to wait for that to reset, without breaking LOS of the pet, before I can command it to attack again.

It’s only the Spiderant that seems to do that… smells like a bug?

I am mainly talking about gamma burst in this because it is most associative to the pet build. Also, “unplayable” is kind of an overstatement, i think a better word is disadvantageous.

I would really like to see a video or your build to see how it works for your build. I think if they gave the pet a debuff system so that, the pet would not do all the damage, but still be able to cause some damage. The problem right now with the pet is its very inconsistent. Go try mayhem 2 on the COV slaughter shaft. Maybe your build is different but i cant even get past the first wave. I am a decent player i feel to.

Also, if you dont want your pet to do all the work then dont spec it into a pet build. However, those of us who are not as good with understanding the skill system and need more accessibility, this is where the pets come in a lot of handy. I would like the pet to do a good portion of the work so i can relax a little, this is completely inviable on mayhem 4 though. Maybe implement a system where the pet has does decreasing amounts of damage until enemies low health and flak can finish them off.

This is just my opinion and maybe other people have a different idea.

No. It’s a movement skill for the ant, doesn’t seem to be a bug.