This was the worst nerf ever. Let’s not lie, it is in your capability to make it work. Please do.
Massive unwrranted nerf yeah. Since it’s only a problem of performance, they should have made it optional
It’s a handy and convenient justification actually. Nerf X, because performance. Reduce damage of Y, because performance. Remove Z entirely, because performance.
It’s funny, I never ever had a crash because if it and im on xbox. Plus I don’t remember any complaints on here saying to nerf it for that reason. Makes you wonder if they just couldn’t adjust it at all.
Personally I have no problem with the changes to elemental projectile multiplication in a vacuum. I have a problem with it being removed suddenly and without warning with no thought given to how it has shaped and dominated the meta (which is overwhelmingly strong in this game).
If they were working on removing this after 10 months of skill and gear balancing around it then they needed to do it in concert with buffs all round.
I have had numerous crashes from Recursion and Brainstormer. Not to mention the joy of having my game pause for 3-5 seconds and wonder whether or not my console will make it through. I don’t miss it lol
Where I do feel like needs attention is the Jakob’s stuff. If a weapon can naturally produce more than 4 ricochets, it should still be allowed to do so. I don’t think the extra ricochets with elements need reinstated, but if I hit 25 crits with a Stagecoach, I should get 25 ricochets. Not 4
It’s funny how this whole mechanic was once considered “a perhaps unintended interaction” and how people wanted it to go as it rendered a lot of weapons much less powerful with relevant anoints…
From Amaras Top Gear thread:
Note on Anointments that add bonus elemental damage:
“If a weapon that has an innate ricochet effect is used while one of these anointments (or Amara’s abilities to add bonus elemental damage) is activated, extra projectiles will be produced when the ricochet is triggered. Given the likely unintended nature of this, I have decided to list this anointment separately from the weapons. The weapons that tend to gain benefit from this effect (in this list) are most Jakobs weaponry, the Carrier, Lucian’s Call, Redistributor, and the Projectile Recursion.”
I also don’t see the need for it to come Back for the health of the game.
Lucian’s Call working just fine on the same Mayhem level (4) as previous (on my Zane). I think this is only affecting the “meta” weapons everybody uses to facemelt missions, which uh suggests problems not related to the projectiles themselves. And perhaps Amara, but her damage is skyhigh anyway.
Has this been tested? I thought the ricochets were limited per-projectile, not per-click. So if you have 25 pellets, or however they’re classes, they should all ricochet at least once.
Fair enough tho im not saying it wasnt happening just my experience was fine. Hate others did have an issue but i still dont remember it being specifically called out before. Now all of a sudden since the change its been a big issue fixed. IDK…
I’m going off of feel there with the Dakota, I was only running 1 extra element of my shield(OGT on grenade) and it would obliterate a group of enemies. Now I don’t even see the ricochets and never see it kill other enemies than the one I shoot.
I have had mixed feelings ever since the patch made the multiple projectiles changes, but this pretty well crystalizes how I feel about the matter. Agree with this
The biggest issue is that re-ricochets were taken out of the game, at least as far as I understand it. I’m pretty sure weapons like the Wedding Invitation could ricochet, crit on another enemy, and then re-ricochet with the same special effect again (3 more ricochets). This is what caused whole rooms to explode. Or at least that is how I perceived the mechanic to be working. Now, when you crit an enemy, the re-ricochet (if that makes sense) potential has been curbed. Or at least that is how I read what I saw in the patch notes, combined withe the changes I have seen in-game.
I agree that these changes are positive from a performance perspective (even though I loved it, the Recursion was annoying), but would like to see GBX restore some of the “cool” to Jakobs especially.
There has to be a middle ground. Eliminate the extra projectiles caused by the elements, but don’t limit the naturally occurring ricochets.
There is no denying that Recursion was OP and needed to be toned down. If the extra projectiles were causing a performance problem for a good portion of the player base, that’s fine, remove the extra projectiles. My issue is the sudden, drastic drop in power for so many weapons that certainly did not need a nerf.
Specifically on the Dakota, I was using it as one of my main weapons until this change and it should be powerful as a Unique and the reward for beating DLC3. This change gutted it along with most Jakobs weapons. I am trying to remain optimistic that Gearbox will provide a buff to base damage or increase the ricochet cap a lot higher than 4. Something needs to be done in compensation for such a heavy-handed and widespread nerf.
Then I look at 99% of the other legendaries in the game and how useless they are at level cap and it’s hard to remain optimistic that a compensatory buff will come to these weapons. In the meantime, it’s all DLC3 weapons until DLC4 comes out and we see the nerf bat hit DLC3.
Yeah, I haven’t tried DLC3 yet (only just got back online after moving house), so can’t comment there. Maybe Jakobs performance in general (outside of some outliers) was being hidden by the multi-element-projectile issue and we’ll see more of a bump to them in the future. I don’t know.
I haven’t seen much change in my gameplay, but I’m not near M10, which is where scaling problems will be at their worst.
Don’t get me wrong - absolutely fine with weapons needing buffed. But I think this thing needed to be patched.
this was a great fix all they need to do is buff effected weapons to be m10 viable.
Thanks to everyone who responded. It was my birthday yesterday so I was pretty buzzed when I wrote the post. My main gripe is the fun factor with the viable M10 guns. I loved the ricochet effect, and hope they restore it. For me on ps4 the game crashes just as much as it did when I was using the recursion. If they reduced particle effects maybe it would help. Alas I’m not a programmer so this is just conjecture.
Again, this was NEVER a problem prior to MH 2.0
If performance is the issue, which it is, the first thing addressed should be the visually intrusive modifiers, which is where the performance issues are stemming from.
I hope you’re being sarcastic. i wouldn’t have to ask if many ppl weren’t
It isn’t that they fixed an unintended mechanism. I think player expectations were that you would only ricochet a single shot but that shot would have several elements so the “nerf” matches expectations.
The problem is that when they removed all this potential damage from these weapons they shrunk even further the existing pool of really viable M10 weapons. They should have at least done a 25% base damage buff as a start for these guns which were other than highly specific uses were already struggling for relevance other than the Recursion.
It really feels like this was a debuff for the Recursion and the rest of the guns were just collateral damage because they couldn’t just drop the Recursion damage since it was the additional projectiles causing issues.
I never used the recursion prior to m2.0 because I didn’t need to. I used it cause I had to with m2.0 until new power creep guns were available. It’s funny how with amara I could produce many more times projectiles with a wagon wheel and never stutter my Xbox. The only other gun I could make it stutter with was the license when I crit spammed. They should have fixed their m2.0 mess.