[Guide] FL4K's Predetermined Skills/Effects

Hello! Here i will share how some of FL4K’s skills/effects draw from a predetermined/fixed proc pool for their effects.

Confirmed FL4K skills/effects affected by this: Leave No Trace, Head Count, Two F4ng and Bounty Hunter’s kill skill trigger effect.

Credits to u/ertdfgcvb123 on BL3 Reddit for the original Two F4ng discovery. I just expanded the testing.

Thank you to @plenipotence for our discussions and doing the first LNT testing.

Thank you to @Prismatic for the assistance with formatting!

HOW IS IT TESTED?

Testing method:

  1. Go to Sanctuary. Pick a weapon in which you can easily discern a skill’s proc (single pellet is easier). Exit to main menu with that weapon in hand;
  2. Go back in game and fire at the dummy while keeping track of procs in your preferred way;
  3. For Two F4ng, do not switch weapons at all unless you account for it in the proc chain;
  4. For Leave No Trace you must be mindful of the 0.3s internal cooldown and not fire too quickly.

How the proc pools work:

  • Their order is always the same, so it doesn’t change between game restarts or save/quitting to main menu, just resets;
  • Fast Traveling and respawning do not reset the order;
  • Swapping weapon modes/fire modes doesn’t seem to affect anything;
  • Two F4ng: swapping to another weapon counts as one shot fired.

1. LEAVE NO TRACE

LNT’S PREDETERMINED PROC POOL

  • Leave No Trace has an internal cooldown of 0.3 seconds. Crits during this cooldown will advance the proc pool and effectively make you skip what would be a proc.
  • Leave No Trace is checked on hit, and it requires that hit to be a crit. This means that non-crits/misses won’t advance the pool.

108 Crit shots with LNT

1 = LNT Proc, 0 = No Proc

6/3 (72%):
1010.1111.1011.1101.1110.1111.1111.0010.1001.1011.1111.1010.1001.1010.1111.1110.1110.1111.1011.1011.1110.1011.1101.0011.1111.1110.0011
5/3 (60%):
1010.1111.1010.1101.1110.1111.1110.0010.1001.0001.1111.0010.1001.1010.1011.1110.1110.1111.1011.0001.1110.1001.1001.0011.1111.1110.0011
4/3 (48%):
1010.1110.0010.1001.1110.1111.1100.0010.1001.0001.1111.0000.1001.1010.1001.1110.0100.0111.1011.0001.1110.1001.1001.0010.1110.1100.0001
3/3 (36%):
1010.1010.0010.1001.1110.1111.1000.0000.0001.0000.1111.0000.1001.1010.1000.1000.0100.0110.1011.0001.1010.1001.1000.0000.1010.1000.0001
2/3 (30%):
1010.0000.0010.1001.0100.1011.1000.0000.0001.0000.1011.0000.1000.1010.0000.1000.0100.0100.1011.0000.1000.1001.1000.0000.1000.0000.0001
1/3 (25%):
0010.0000.0000.0000.0100.1001.1000.0000.0000.0000.0010.0000.0000.1010.0000.0000.0000.0000.1000.0000.1000.0001.1000.0000.1000.0000.0001

100 Crit Shots : Number of procs with LNT

Chance: Number of procs

6/3 (72%): 79
5/3 (60%): 69
4/3 (48%): 56
3/3 (36%): 42
2/3 (24%): 29
1/3 (12%): 14

2. TWO F4NG

WHAT TWO F4NG DOES

It adds a “listed” projectile to the shot where it procs. That means:

  • A x25 weapon is effectively x26 on that shot.
  • A weapon without extra projectiles becomes a x2 weapon.
  • Unlisted/splitting projectile weapons like Craps, Bekah and Lyuda get a lot of benefit from the extra main projectile, causing it to also split/have the special effect.
  • A notable interaction is that this can be either beneficial or harmful when Overkill stacking: check @DocStrangelove’s Overkill Explained thread for more information.
  • It’s boosted up to 10/5 for 50% chance (?) to proc by the DE4DEYE Class Mod.

WHAT TWO F4NG DOESN’T DO

  • It is not a new/same instance full shot or trigger pull, just a new projectile.
  • It doesn’t work at all with some weapons like the Laser-Sploder, and possibly most other lasers.

TWO F4NG’S PREDETERMINED PROC POOL

100 Shots with Two F4ng

1 = Two F4ng Proc, 0 = No Proc

10/5 (50%):
1010.1110.0010.1101.1110.1111.1100.0010.1001.0001.1111.0000.1001.1010.1001.1110.1100.0111.1011.0001.1110.1001.1001.0010.1110
9/5 (45%):
1010.1010.0010.1001.1110.1111.1100.0010.1001.0001.1111.0000.1001.1010.1001.1100.0100.0111.1011.0001.1010.1001.1000.0000.1110
8/5 (40%):
1010.1010.0010.1001.1110.1111.1100.0010.0001.0000.1111.0000.1001.1010.1000.1000.0100.0110.1011.0001.1010.1001.1000.0000.1110
7/5 (35%):
1010.1010.0010.1001.1110.1111.1000.0000.0001.0000.1011.0000.1001.1010.1000.1000.0100.0110.1011.0001.1010.1001.1000.0000.1010
6/5 (30%):
1010.1000.0010.1001.1100.1011.1000.0000.0001.0000.1011.0000.1001.1010.1000.1000.0100.0100.1011.0000.1010.1001.1000.0000.1000
5/5 (25%):
1010.0000.0010.1001.0100.1011.1000.0000.0001.0000.1011.0000.1000.1010.0000.1000.0100.0100.1011.0000.1010.1001.1000.0000.1000

Values lower than 5/5

4/5 (20%):
1010.0000.0010.0000.0100.1011.1000.0000.0000.0000.0011.0000.1000.1010.0000.1000.0100.0100

3/5 (15%):
010.0000.0000.0000.0100.10?1.1000.0000.0000.0000.001?.0000.?000.1010.0000.?000.0?00.0?00

2/5 (10%):
0000.0000.0000.0000.0100.1001.1000.0000.0000.0000.0010.0000.0000.1010.0000.0000.0000.0000

1/5 (5%):
0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0001.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.1000.0000.0000.0000.0000

100 Shots : Number of procs with Two F4ng

Chance: Number of procs

10/5 (50%): 55
9/5 (45%): 49
8/5 (40%): 44
7/5 (35%): 40
6/5 (30%): 34
5/5 (25%): 31

3. HEAD COUNT

Crit Shots with Head Count

1 = Head Count Proc, 0 = No Proc

Didn’t go for a specific number of shots because i actually just grabbed the values from the other pools, seeing as they’re all shared.

6/3 (60%):
1010.1111.1010.1101.1110.1111.1110.0010.1001.0001.1111.0010.1001.1010.1011.1110.1110.1111.1011.0001.1110.1001.1001.0011.1111.1110.0011
5/3 (50%):
1010.1110.0010.1101.1110.1111.1100.0010.1001.0001.1111.0000.1001.1010.1001.1110.1100.0111.1011.0001.1110.1001.1001.0010.1110
4/3 (40%):
1010.1010.0010.1001.1110.1111.1100.0010.0001.0000.1111.0000.1001.1010.1000.1000.0100.0110.1011.0001.1010.1001.1000.0000.1110
3/3 (30%):
1010.1000.0010.1001.1100.1011.1000.0000.0001.0000.1011.0000.1001.1010.1000.1000.0100.0100.1011.0000.1010.1001.1000.0000.1000
2/3 (20%):
1010.0000.0010.0000.0100.1011.1000.0000.0000.0000.0011.0000.1000.1010.0000.1000.0100.0100
1/3 (10%):
0000.0000.0000.0000.0100.1001.1000.0000.0000.0000.0010.0000.0000.1010.0000.0000.0000.0000

4. BOUNTY HUNTER

The world is made up of two classes - the seed and the predetermined.

FL4K has a 3% chance to activate any purchased Hunt Kill Skill when dealing gun damage.

3 Test Runs with Bounty Hunter. Single projectile weapon, each number is a shot that hit.

1 = Proc 0 = No Proc
0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0001.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.10
0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0001.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.10
0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0001.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.0000.10

5. SHARED SEED

All the predetermined skills (including the non-FL4K ones) share the same seed for their proc pools. It’s better that i simply visually show this:

100 Shots with both LNT and Two F4ng

35% Two F4ng (7/5)
1010.1010.0010.1001.1110.1111.1000.0000.0001.0000.1011.0000.1001.1010.1000.1000.0100.0110.1011.0001.1010.1001.1000.0000.1010

36% Leave No Trace (3/3)
1010.1010.0010.1001.1110.1111.1000.0000.0001.0000.1111.0000.1001.1010.1000.1000.0100.0110.1011.0001.1010.1001.1000.0000.1010

You’ll notice there’s a single extra proc on Leave No Trace, and only that. The rest are exact occurrences at the same location in the pool, and so they line up exactly.

Any sucessful proc at the lowest chance (in this case 7/5 Two F4ng at 35% chance) will always be a sucessful proc when on a higher chance (in this case 3/3 Leave No Trace at 36% chance). Any unsuccessful proc at a higher chance is also an unsuccessful proc at any lower chance.

Example between Moze and FL4K skills/effects

OTHER CHARACTERS

The only other character with known Predetermined Skills is Moze. You can check a thread on that by @Prismatic: [Guide] Moze’s Predetermined Skills

18 Likes

So hypothetically you could min-max this by timing your 3rd FA shot with a 2fang proc, but that is way too much work 99.9% of the time unless at 7/5 at least.

Seeing that getting 2 procs in a row is impossible until the 23rd and 24th shot, even at 5/5, does seem to devalue the skill a bit in my eyes. It isn’t bad, but considering that many of FL4K’s best guns are high pellet shotties, it seems like Second Intention or Ambush Predator may compete more seriously with it now.

2 Likes

Yeah, i’ve been skipping it for a while too in most builds, but the Fade Away shenanigans has been used to great effect. It’s “fun” but also weird because it works like this.

Honestly the massive point dump that is going for something like a +5 DE4DEYE seems not really worth it when looking at this, even for the weapons that do benefit from it. I didn’t do further than 100 shots of testing, maybe i will sometime. There’s a chance the pattern starts repeating itself, which could make it… “consistent” i guess?

I gotta say though two fang really brings the most of of guns like the redistributor, woodblocker and the call weapons for starters. Some of the best guns for extended Fadeaway love two fang imo.

1 Like

Oh it’s certainly a pick for such weapons, it’s simply weird.

1 Like

Thx for the hard work this is really useful. If laser-sploder doesn’t proc it gotta wonder if it also the same for ion laser and its special mechanic? If any1 has any ideas love to know.

1 Like

Yeah I remember seeing something like this on reddit a few months back. It kinda really took my enthusiasm away from the skill and one of the main reasons I don’t think the DE4DEYE is that good of a COM, especially for bossing.

1 Like

You’ll notice the thread’s title and content has changed. That’s because i was holding onto testing other skills because this could get cursed pretty quickly and… well. @plenipotence had more courage than me and tested 3/3 LNT procs and those are also a fixed proc pool. I added 1/3 and 2/3 into the mix and now we need to expand the testing. Big thanks to Pleni for the testing.

3 Likes

After reading the overkill thread I decided against two fang for a build based around sniping and carrying overkill to other weapons. I just started thinking about how these mechanics interact the other night since it uses the scourge.
I’m wondering if you know how it splits the overkill between the scourge child rockets when it triggers two fang?

1 Like

Well, initially Two F4ng should interact with Overkill in the way the thread explains. Then, because the spawned split rockets are unlisted and have their damage based on the main projectile, it should increase the damage of all split rockets from both main projectiles (based on the Overkill and overall damage of the main rockets). I don’t say this with 100% certainty though.

Ok thanks, atleast I know what to look for tonight when testing.
I’ll shoot you a DM when I figure it out, with video link for reference.

1 Like

@Ratore

Does fast-travelling and mode switch count towards the proc pool of Two Fang?

1 Like

Fast travelling does not. Mode switch i don’t know.

I also confirmed Head count to be properly “random”.

3 Likes

From my limited testing, mode switch does not seem to reset the bonus.

While Two Fang having a rigidly determined proc pool does work against having insane chains, its predictability can also work to the player’s advantage in reliably pulling off certain boss kills.

3 Likes

Added in a lot of Leave No Trace testing, made some minor changes to the thread overall. Also included a picture in each skill’s section that you can open in a new tab to have a more easily comparable environment for the procs.

Added a new section showing the shared seed between the skills. Those also seem to be shared with Moze’s Means Of Destruction. Thank you to @Prismatic for accompanying the tests and making this even more cursed

3 Likes

Blaming me for making things more cursed is unfair.

I only compiled everything neatly…

3 Likes

My eyes hurt…

3 Likes

Thanks, everyoned hate it. I’m sure i’ll see that whenever i close my eyes to sleep.

In a more serious note about everything related to predetermined skills… why?

1 Like

Why is weapon scaling for mayhem tied to a hidden anointment?

Who knows. This game is weird.

1 Like

Ummmmmmm, what? Is this a joke or did I miss something?