[Guide] How to shotgun

Hey Sljm,

Get over with Iwa, man. It is old story…
What your build need is a long, nailbiting show of Holodome Badass Round. I am sure, It would be a blast to watch.

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Although I think Iwajira is a great benchmark to test the lethality of combos/gear, I can’t help but agree: a badass round run would be a great show indeed.

@Sljm : Of course, glad to be included. And I think you’re right about the Torguemada. I may try it and see if I can do it in one clip.

@akdere1: Agree that beating up on Iwajira’s old news. My main goal was to make Chuck edit his comments about the Flakker. :wink:

Re: Holodome Badass Round. For fun, maybe I’ll try an all-shotgun round to test out the ratings in this thread. I’ll leave using the Flakker for it to someone else, though, as I find it painful for normal mobbing a pain. Definitely prefer Torguemada for that.

Oh, one last thing: @Chuck80 What about splitters? (i.e. Laser shotguns!)

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Iwajira is still one of the fastest ways to get random drops, grinder materials, and moonstones. He’s the Pyro Pete of TPS.

In my mind, there are (at least) 4 good runs at the moment for various things:

  • Iwajira
  • Tests your short-term burst damage potential on an easily farmable boss
    • Drops lots of blues/purples, moonstones, with the chance for Thingy or Hail
  • Invincible Sentinel
  • Tests your long-term sustained damage potential and survivability
    • Is the only “Raid Boss” at the moment, but not worth farming for loot compared to Iwajira
  • Felicity Run
  • Quick mobbing route with a few badasses, has a boss at the end, and a few nice chests, including a moonstone chest
    • Alternative to Iwajira for farming blues/purples due to the chests, and a nice test for mobbing and basic boss potential for a build, also Quasar
  • Badass Round
  • Endurance Mobbing, with badass drops and a random Holodome item at the end
    • Really shows a build’s mobbing chops, but isn’t as fast or lucrative as the Felicity Run (in my opinion) as a farming route.

That being said, what video showcase can be complete without all of these?

A felicity run has 2 moonstone chests, if you’re willing to sidetrack to the part where you get Felicity’s legs.

I keep meaning to include them fully into the OP, but i’m lacking time and motivation right now. They are in my top 5 though… I also have a Nisha build totally dedicated to them :smile:

Just to make sure I’m reading this right: So, for a Pounder (9 pellets), if I had more than +125% Type A Crit Damage from other sources (e.g. skills), then the Vertical Grip would be better. If I have less than that, Critical Accessory is better? (i.e. So, realistically, for most 6+ pellet guns, you’re better off with Crit Accessory?)

…Assuming you can hit all crits, yes.

realistically, there are other important factors to consider, like your base accuracy, what you intend to do with the gun (is it a maelstrom stacker, a shield-striper, an explosive finisher ? ) and whether or not improved crits would increase your DPS as much (Torgue shotguns for example, are nearly half splash, and splash doesn’t crit)

On torgue shotguns, the Crit accessory is not a really good choice IMO.
Rule of thumbs: if it has 6 pellets or less, vertical grip, otherwise, either Crit accessory or side-loader, depending on brand.

On a pounder, I would personally prefer a side-loader above most other prefix, though a vertical grip might be a nice second-best… It might not be the best choice theoretical-DPS -wise, but in practice it works great.

In my opinion: Always Vertical Grip on Torgue shotguns. Except Jack-o’-Cannon (Who should be Sinewy or sold).

Not only because of the extra pellets, but because it also gives the most Fire Rate. However, it does eat a good bit of accuracy. Chuck likes to hit stuff. I think it’s weird, but he’s his own guy. I don’t care for the Sinewy prefix (which is the one he refers to with “side-loader”), personally. I find it to be the Triple Barrel of Shotgun prefixes, if you know what I mean. It’s a compromise between the two extremes (Vertical Grip and Critical), but it isn’t really that great. It’s the least poop among the other options though, so I guess that makes it third place by definition.

Chuck, do you know if TOG finished the prefixes for Shotguns? If not, I’d like to make a table for your thread. I feel like all this talk about prefixes is really arcane if most people don’t know what the accessories even are or what prefix they give on which manufacture.

I dont know, but if I’m not mistaken, the sinewy prefix is the general boost. The side loader is the one that’s called Texas on Jakobs. I believe it’s impetuous on Torgue. It boosts fire rate, mag size and reload speed at the cost of a bit of damage (which Torgue shotties can totally live with) so it does something similar to the vertical grip, but without the accuracy penalty. On triple and quad Torgue shotties, I would go with this instead of vertical grip. Unless the increase in mag size is not enough to give it one extra shot.

@Sljm what would be the difference in DPS between those 2 prefix on a pounder or ravager ?

About the prefix table. I don’t know, but I would be grateful to have one :slight_smile:

All this time, I thought you were pushing the general boost, and you were talking about the reload speed prefix. I like that one even less.

I’ve got a bit of time off, and I need to update my dps sheet for level 60 anyway.

A lot of people refer to it as the “reload speed” prefix, but considering what it does, it should really be called the “sustained fire” prefix. It’s also got a fire rate boost like the vertical grip. I think it’s pretty underrated. It might not stack up to the vertical grip DPD-wise, but for usability, it’s right up there. To me, for guns that dont really benefit from a vertical grip or crit acc. ( like big Torgue shotties) it’s a pretty sensible choice…

Well its title is Tech3_Reload

So…

Also, the forum thinks I post in this thread too much. I think it needs to mind its own business. :expressionless:

EDIT:
@Chuck80, here you go:

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Forum told me the same thing about your coldsplosion build :stuck_out_tongue:

[quote=“Chuck80, post:46, topic:2072”]
On torgue shotguns, the Crit accessory is not a really good choice IMO.

On a pounder, I would personally prefer a side-loader above most other prefix, though a vertical grip might be a nice second-best…[/quote]

[quote=“Sljm, post:47, topic:2072”]
In my opinion: Always Vertical Grip on Torgue shotguns. Except Jack-o’-Cannon (Who should be Sinewy or sold).

Not only because of the extra pellets, but because it also gives the most Fire Rate.[/quote]

So, if I were to say, “Right, that makes sense, but Showdown + Tombstone + Trick Shot + Unforgiven?”

Then all your posts would translate to

…Right? :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

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No, because the Freeze status gives 200% Type A, and Bona Fide Grit gives 35%.

You’d need 14 pellets (2.45/.25+4 = 13.8) with the Critical Accessory to outdo Vertical Grip against a Frozen enemy. 16 if your Class Mod is a Crapshooter (2.89/.25+4 = 15.56). Only 4-Barrels and some 3-Barrels (not Torgue) have that many pellets without the Vertical Grip.

And, you’d have lower Fire Rate.

That being said, you should still keep that Pounder because it’s hilarious.

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Dreamcrusher, Sljm. That’s what you are. :wink:

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I’m gonna retract a few things I said

But first, a small reminder of something I said that explains it.

Sooo… I played around with the old gear calc (hoping the non-damage values are still good) and I just looked at the few shotguns, checking specifically for that, and in almost all cases, the increase in mag size is either too small to actually add anything (it starts to add 1 at a mag size of 9) or if there is one, it doesn’t actually translate to an extra shot. This was mostly checked against Torgue shotguns.

Scav shotguns could actually benefit from the reload accessory, since their fire rate is just high enough to get the increase, and their mag size IS big enough for the bonus to translate to an extra shot. They also have slow reload and horrendous accuracy. However, on them, the crit accessory is STILL better… so make that a second best in their case.

I’m gonna edit the OP to remove my praises for that accessory in MOST cases :frowning:

However, I still think it’s the best on a Ravager… the vertical grip’s payoff is too small for the negative aspect. it’s an increase of 12.5% in damage (compared to a 40% increase on a bangstick, and a whopping 67% on the 'Mada) that totally destroys your aim.

As for the increase in fire rate it actually has a smaller impact (from 0.8 to 0.9) than what the reload accessory shaves off on the reload (from 3.2 to 2.6). So the reload speed accessory actually makes the ravager shoots faster overall (that is, as long as you shoot more than twice)

So on the ravager, the fire rate boost is moot.
That means the only important part here is accuracy VS damage, which recalls the main point of the OP.

Sure, the reload acc. has slightly lower damage, but that’s considering you hit with all the pellets, which is hard to do with Torgue bullet speed and the lowered accuracy from the vertical grip. Most things would die from a single shot that hits with all pellets anyway, no matter the accessory, so getting as many pellets to hit as possible is the key to efficiency with the Ravager.

I don’t miss with the Ravager because I use it at point-it-directly-down-enemies-throats range.

:thumbsup: