[Guide] Top Gear for Athena

(Resident DoT fanatic) #462

Believe me, I used to game at 720p 15fps. I know the pain.

Yes, it has a ceiling, and it seems like it’s about 400 stacks without any boosts from swapping or kill skills. But when I’m shooting at the testing dummy, that’s about how far the hyperion shotguns go too. If you see just how quickly I stacked in that CC/Fatale video by getting smite, aspis, kill buffs, and swapping, you can only imagine how quickly I can stack with the Hellfire.

not to mention the huge ammo pool on SMGs. Sometimes we can’t use all shotguns (as much as I want to, honestly)

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I vary up my weapon loadout but this is my go-to set: Shock Taser, Fatale, Shock Thinking, Torgue Rifle. Closers only play when the big boys are in the room.

(Resident DoT fanatic) #464

Cool setup. Btw I forgot to mention that we are not comparing across different weapon types so we shouldn’t compare hellfire to Hyperion shottys for stacking.

I really like the versatility of lasers, huge ammo pool and the +60% I get from Eddie and bulwark so I run with shock tediore splitter, thunder fire, absolute zero and laser disker.


It wasn’t a comparison across weapon types. I just don’t use a SMG with the purpose of stacking.

(Resident DoT fanatic) #466

Ohh, then you’ll see how effective it is for stacking. I just did a hellfire vs. Robot Plant run and I stacked to 400 against felicity faster than 10 Storm Fronts could using mainly hellfire + swap.

edit: here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZ-4iLqyKiw

To those who are still doubtful of Hellfire’s ability - this video clearly shows the stacking ability, the power, how powerful the DoTs are with hellfire, how the DoTs allow you to be really, really sloppy, how quickly it even melts through armored enemies, and how quickly it can stack to 400 even faster than storm fronts.

(President of Jellybeans) #467

@ItsmeJamesAJ My notes:

Torrent: I noticed you primarily hipfired the Torrent, even when the aspis is down, no wonder why It felt average to you. The fire rate spikes up drastically when you ads, I would suggest trying it again on your own time (no need to film if you don’t want to), as you are kinda missing most of the point of using it.

Meat Grinder: You want the Kwikner, bullet speed is vital, you also had a Scav stock , which while you could get away with it on most guns,a Dahl stock is almost mandatory for the Meat Grinder…

CC: Somewhat missed the point of why this is used, (of course its not going to stack well it has a base 8 FR and a 10% Proc Chance), it was an awkward choice for a test in this context (It’s guns like these that justify the RH on this list, @khimerakiller, it will happen), but regardless you can see its damage potential whenever you happen to hit Crits.

Transmurdera: They’re CC/Fatale without the crit, which is 90% why you would use them, didn’t really pay attention to this one cuz i knew it was awful.

Hellfire. welp…I don’t know what to tell you…it really doesn’t look nearly as impressive on video as you’ve been hyping it up. Even at ~300 stacks it takes a long ass time to kill things, and thats with an oxidizer in atmosphere against flesh

General: Why not use Storm Weaving? if everything is firing at ~10-15 without the boost stack speed would be skewed, I know for a fact that a FT can get to 30 FR with storm weaving alone (A True Blue only needs like 80% total, and Kwikner needs even less). Also you never get Barrage happening.

Just my observations.

(Sheriff) #468

Really ? Weird. You just shot the dummy or you actively tried to stack as fast as you could ? (not doubting you, just making sure we’re comparing the same thing)
In your own showcase video, you easily get to 460 stacks… while mobbing!

(go to about 32 seconds)
How can it Top at 350 stacks against a still target with infinite health ?

(Pandora's Industrial Engineer) #469

Yeah as fast as possible

No Unrelenting, SF, Zeus’ Rage, Element matching, ect… Basically only Hyperion SGs can stack +700 by themselves w/out kill skills.

(Resident DoT fanatic) #470

Did not know that. Thanks for letting me know.

I had Hyperion stock on my meat grinder. You must be wrong on the meat grinder.

Hellfire: I think i already noted why it looks worse than the others but is actually not. Read the post carefully again. And I also uploaded another vid where I actually show what Hellfire is capable of. “Welp” to you.

And if you really question its stacking ability, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZ-4iLqyKiw

I wanted to avoid swapping weapons as it allows additional degree of uncertainty - you will notice that on certain weapons more than others, on certain playstyles more than others, I will swap more frequently. I do that subconsciously. Also not to mention it is highly against glitched weapons and I did not use elemental barrage to show relative ammo consumption (I was near full on each of the run).

My observations.

(Resident DoT fanatic) #471

Yep. And it is the objective way of measuring how high of stacks it can reach. Also can confirm that only hyperion shottys can reach 700 w/o any of those skills you mentioned

(President of Jellybeans) #472

Whatever, all I knew is that it wasn’t the Dahl stock, You want 2 Stats on the Grinder, Recoil Reduction and Bullet Speed, it becomes much much more reliable if you use the variant mentioned in the TG, especially with a Duality.

(Sheriff) #473

Unrelenting I understand
I don’t know what SF is :worried:
Zeus’ rage too, although i’m not sure it helped you in that video
Element matching shouldn’t change much either

Ok, so basically the only real stackers are hyperion shotguns… so no room for the Octo there I take it.

Where does the Octo fit then ?

It doesn’t deal the hurt that the PL does
It’s not a one-punch knockout like the Sledge’s or Boganella
It’s not the Flakker or a development for boss fights
and it doesn’t stack like a Thinking

…why should it be top gear then ?

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(Resident DoT fanatic) #474

Remember what I said about replying only to parts of my comments?

(Sheriff) #475

Trying to be the mediator here:

You might not LIKE it, but if Hoyle only wants to address a part of your post, he has a right to :smile:
Cherry-picking parts to refute in someone’s argument is not cool, but sometimes it’s just about one detail, so it makes sense. Don’t take it personally.

(Pandora's Industrial Engineer) #476

SF = Storm Front

The Octo is a good alternative to the Thinking as a mobbing gun where things die faster than you can stack Maelstrom.

I’m still nowhere near convinced than the PL brings the hurt on Athena. And the Torguemada doesn’t really impress me either (besides only being 1 ammo a shot and buff-able by cryo I don’t see why Athena likes this one, if you know could you say why thanks :wink: ).

(Pandora's Industrial Engineer) #477

Hey guys I was talkin’ about something with @BookEmDano and he wanted me to bring it up to you all.

Yeah I’m just saying that the CC/Fatale section doesn’t really belong. The CC is bad in general and the Fatale can be replaced in its role as TG for Athena. Not to say there can’t be multiple guns for one role. Its just the Fatale’s role is kinda small… and I’m not against keeping it, but it shouldn’t have its own spot.

And I mainly use the Fridgia as a debuff gun, but for Athena if the Fatale is a freezing/crit closer gun to her the Fridgia can do better in close quarters.

There are some other factors, but so long as you’re in CQB the Fridgia’s higher base damage (2 bullets for one ammo), 0 recoil, and better freeze chance. Will beat the Fatale’s accuracy and bonus crit.

My intention for this is to free up a spot for the Hellfire. Any thoughts
Anyone else…

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(Sheriff) #478

OK thanks. In your video there were no storm fronts involved in the 460 stacks I saw. So it’s all Unrelenting… impressive skill.

Fair enough

It’s funny that these 2 guns are at their best when used almost the same way.

To me, the 'Mada is the best shotgun in the game overall. It might not be the best on every character, but in general, it’s the best. It has everything for it: High damage, gets a lot out of the vertical grip (66% increase…) more splash than other Torgue shotties, plus Flakks, very ammo efficient, great on single targets and as an AOE, decent stats all around, available early and very easily, only 2 parts to farm… What’s NOT great about it ?

In both cases though, you have to work with their special delivery. The 'Mada is a bit easier to use since its flakks are not moving up, but it’s overall the same: aim low or from higher up.

As for the PL, Have a look at James’ showcase, he one-shots glitches and mobs efficiently against shielded armored targets …even though it’s a fire gun.

That thing is even better on Athena than it is on Nisha.

(Resident DoT fanatic) #479

That’s what I’ve been saying! (but of course, our dear Hoyle takes problem with everything I say)

It’s going to be hard to beat Fatale’s cryo + crit bonus, though. We could probably lump either Fast Talker and Torrent or remove the Torrent altogether - the way Hoyle words makes it sound like a hipfire gun, but Fast Talker is a much better hipfire gun than that. Not to mention, having to ADS to max your DPS doesn’t synergize well with Athena at all.

(Sheriff) #480

Guys, let’s keep it friendly
Hoyle isn’t doing that specifically to piss you off, he just has a different opinion, and he’s defending it, not more voicefully than either you or @khimerakiller

You’re not gonna convince him (or anyone for that matter) by just repeating that “he’s not listening”

(Resident DoT fanatic) #481

Chuck, I deeply respect you and appreciate you doing this.

But the key word here is “sometimes”. You do it “sometimes”, then it makes sense. But if you do it every single time I bring up multiple points, well… that just makes it cherry-picking. And he’s been avoiding a lot of my arguments throughout the past, in this thread and elsewhere, including PMs. It seems he likes to pick his arguments and completely ignore other valid points, because, well, it’s “his” thread, even though Top Gear is supposed to be a community effort!

I rant on too much. Anyways, thanks for pointing that out, although that really doesn’t apply in this case.