How do you make this game difficult while making a lot of weapons viable?

Right now, everyone thinks mayhem 10 is easy now. So naturally either gearbox ignores the community that likes difficulty or they make the game harder. If they make the game harder, then weapons will become obsolete again. I’m torn between the two because I like difficulty, but I also like using other legendary guns, and I think right now the gap between using a non-meta legendary gun and a meta one is the difference between almost one-shotting a boss, and taking a minute or two like a real boss fight. Thoughts on this?

Borderlands to me has never been difficult…it’s about combining the right builds and gear to handle whatever’s thrown at you. If it feels easy to you on M10, that means you’ve mastered your character and gameplay. GBX can nerf/buff certain aspects, but it wouldn’t change the big picture.

You could always try another character, master that one and overcome another challenge…but if you have all 4 VH’s decked out, and completed every quest, challenge and raid, then there’s nothing else for you…you’ve won lol

If you want more difficulty in a FPS, it’s probably best to check out other games, like Doom, CS:GO, etc

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Have 1 max level for weapons and balance them around a standard difficulty
And then add a bunch of difficulty levels on top of that
I might not be able to kill stuff at the highest one
But moxsy might be
I don’t have to ripp up there
I play where I feel comfortable at
Weapon scaling is stupid and dangerous for the game because everyone wants to be at the top and kill stuff and demands proper noob tools to do so

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Probably because they cherry-pick favorable Mayhem modifiers?

Making weapons viable doesn’t change the difficulty in theory. The problem now is that 10-20 weapons kill a badass in 10 seconds (making this up) the other 150 take 25 seconds. The end result of that is that everyone uses the 10-20 weapons . If you bring the other 150 up to snuff all it does is give people more options to kill something in 10 seconds.

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Its tough to be sure…for me borderlands has never been a game with a meta. There are gear sets and builds that go together very nicely…if you follow the meta aka one shotting all the top content…it is easy. But then why are there all these other legendarys and special effects that dont follow the “meta”? Try stuff see what works…force tactical play…find a combination that is fun. Ive been really enjoying a mind sweeper moze with only bottomless mags capstone hybrid. Tested a few diffrent variations on the takedowns…and have a good time(although the martyr feels like the destroyer from bl1 if you catch me) also phasezerker amara with proprietary liscense with ttb and bullet reflect. Both arent overly powerful but are fun to play. IB oneshotting certain bosses is like b0re on zero…sometimes way to good, a farmers delight. But most times doesnt really hurt gameplay and is very fun.

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You can make the game difficult yourself
Use m0 guns on M10
Use whites blues greens
Take off guardian rank
Don’t use action skills or annoints…

The games in a decent place at the minute people are having fun. Balance some more of the underperforming weapons, fix dedicated drops then we’re good to go. If people want a challenge they can do it easily enough.

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That’s not a difficulty setting
That’s playing bad by intention because the game doesn’t have difficulty settings
None wants to play bad

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We’ve just had a couple of months with people complaining the game is too hard, no weapons or action skills work.

Now weapons and action skills work it’s too easy? You’re not going to cater for everyone M10 was probably too difficult for some people but they played it anyway because it’s top level. Now it’s easier the people who could manage it before are complaining it’s too easy.

The easiest solution is probably just make the game more difficult yourself. Or gearbox giving more choice around adding/removing modifiers. Plus adding options like we had cartels spawning in but everyone gets M10 gear because everyone wants M10 gear right?

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That’s the issue
It shouldn’t feel like mayhem 10 IS the game
Imagine finding a super god roll weapon, double barrel, 200% splash anoint what ever blabla…MAYHEM 8!!! ITS TRASH!
noones gonna care
Because mayhem 10 is the game and nothing else
If we didn’t have weapon scaling, people could actually just play easier if they wanted to and hardcore people could play hard without crippling themselves and it would still be the same gear, the same “tier”

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This is a game where difficulty means inefficiency.
In a more story driven game like Halo, to cite one of my favourite serie, the goal is to reach the end of the game, and on the highest difficulty you struggle from checkpoint to checkpoint and feel realized when finishing a challenging section.
In a game like Borderlands or Diablo, once the story is complete, the goal is to become more and more efficient at killing enemies. You’ll never reach a wall of difficulty once you’ve got your endgame going (a good build and the bare minimum gear for it), the content will usually be completable. What changes is how efficiently you can complete it.
It shouldn’t take 20 tries to pass a section or kill a boss in Borderlands endgame. It’s more a matter of how smoothly you can make the gameplay.

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This. Running low on ammo? Constant ffyl? Un enjoyable experience? Change the build.

Exactly, the entire point of finding powerful gear is to kill things faster lol I think a majority of frustration comes from MMMods. You don’t need to go full green gear to make things challenging, Try just swapping out a class mod that is boosting your dmg by 50% for starters :wink:

Now the dps that the characters can produce is higher, so the game is easy to feel. And basically, if the character’s survival is easy, the game feels easy. This game is easy for these two reasons.
The reason why Salvador is called the strongest in bl2 is that he can hold a GN in one hand and satisfy both DPS/survival at the same time.
In Bl3, characters’ survival is generally easier than BL2, but amara and Zane with SD are especially easier. They are some kind of Sal with GrogNozzle in one hand.
If the composition of the game allows the players to make some choices between dps and survival according to gears and skill trees, there will be fewer complaints about the difficulty of the game.
In that respect, Zane’s SD mod is a terrible one. It provides both dps and survival at the same time.
Moze’s Sapper, on the other hand, is a good thing. Because it simply provides survival.
If the composition of the skill tree is that way, those who find it difficult can choose to survive, while those who find it easy can choose the DPS, which is likely to reduce their dissatisfaction with the difficulty.

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Walking nuke doesnt appeal to me…my fave seein dead build was double barrel clone holding kill o the wisp and zane with a corrosive infinity withh 100 cryo annoint with banjo relic. It didnt clear any maps on its own…i had to play…swap places seek cover aim for the head…ect. Endless scaling would be the only way to get the kind of difficulty i think we are talking about…like a trial mode that doubles in difficulty after each checkpoint

I mean, the modifiers I use can significantly hurt a playstyle, but it’s not mine. Plus buddy system, which in and of itself is annoying

Currently, outside of GTD, M10 is easy with right build (still required).
GTD should stay the same, maybe MTD too, but the rest of the game need a buff.
More enemies or badasses aka cartel style. Elemental penalty so make matching element is necessary.
Other than that, it is enemy health lol.

Imho one of the very hard modifier should be -200% shock/fire/corrosive/kinetic/radiation efficiency against “wrong” health bars.
Elements matching would be more necessary but it would be manageable and even fun with the right setup and gameplay.

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Unpopular opinion:
You want difficulty, why not use the modifiers? I mean people constantly complain about them but I don’t see much argumentation. Moreover people only roll modifiers that make their life easier but you can actually choose ones that are difficult for you, why not roll modifiers like Rogue lite or infusion or whatever you are not comfortable with? That’s why they are here in the first place.

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i am not using any cryo or rad weapons right now
but i would still not use cryo or rad immunity modifiers
its just stupid, its not harder, it just doesnt make sense
silly lasers on the ground
they are helping when you are in FFYL, they are not hard
but they are annoying and in the way

the thing is, people want a consistent difficulty
to compare and play different builds with the same conditions
thats not possible with our rainbow unicorn system

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