How to Facepuncher -- Moze edition

This was originally going to be a build post, but I am still tinkering with different concepts to see what does the most damage.

In the meantime, I do have a couple of general tips that I wanted to pass along:

Skills

Short Fuse: Facepuncher shots do not proc Short Fuse.

Scorching RPMS: Melee attacks, including Facepuncher pellets, do not crit, but White Elephant stickies stuck to crit spots can. These stickies can benefit from SRPMs’ bonus crit damage, but given that you only have a 30% chance to lay stickies, I would argue that this skill is not worth the investment.

Pull the Holy Pin: PTHP does not enable the Fish Slap to crit.

Class Mods

The obvious choices here are going to be teh Bloodletter and Mind Sweeper. Skill rolls don’t matter a tremendous amount on either, but if you use a White Elephant artifact, you will want +2 TRL on the Bloodletter in order to reach 1 HP.

As for state rolls, melee damage and splash damage are obvious choices, but the Facepuncher and Fish Slap do not benefit from weapon type damage bonuses. Interestingly enough – the stickies left by the Facepuncher do appear to benefit from Hyperion crit and damage bonuses.

Artifact

Your two best options for artifacts are going to be Knife Drain White Elephant (for survivability) and elemental Stone White Elephant (for damage). The best stat rolls here should be obvious – melee damage, AOE damage, and mag size – again the Facepuncher and Fish Slap cannot benefit from weapon type damage bonuses, so don’t bother with them. Bonus elemental damage and DoT chance can be good on Stone artifacts if the roll matches the artifact’s damage type (radiation on a radiation stone; corrosive on a corrosive stone, etc).

Shield

The Stinger’s melee novas benefit from Mayhem scaling, so this shield is a really good option, particularly if you are using a Knife Drain artifact. The novas also have a chance to place sticky bombs that hit like a truck.

You can also do a neat trick with the One Shotter shield and Knife Drain artifact so that you fire off an amp’d shot every 1-2 shots. The net damage bonus from this tactic is pretty decent and comparable to the bonus you receive from the Stinger.

The Old God’s elemental damage bonus does apply to the damage dealt by elemental Stone artifacts, so that is another option.

Facepunchers

Not really to much to say here except go for the Redundant variant as it will lay down more sticky bombs per trigger pull. The three best anoints for the Facepuncher are 300v2 (for mobbing), consecutive hits (for bossing), and uRad (option for 1HP builds). While element NTM anoints work on the Facepuncher, I found that its low ammo count meant that I was reloading more often than I would like. The bonus melee damage anoint also works, but its duration is so short that it is not really worth the trouble of jumping in and out for IB for it.

Grenades

The Fish Slap works well on the Knife Drain build, though you probably won’t hit those triple digit million damage numbers that you see on other builds because your Facepuncher will be constantly resetting the Groundbreaker perk. That said, it benefits from Moze’s splash damage skills and still does single digit millions of damage on Mayhem 10, so they definitely worth using.

Other than that, just use a CMT and spec into PHTP and Vampyr.

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Quick addendum – when picking Mayhem modifiers, make sure to go with Slayer for your easy modifier. Any enemy you kill with the Facepuncher hit will explode into a plume of shield and health boosters.

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I tried this build a few times, but you don’t seem to have any suggested talent points. How far do you recommend going into each tree?

Edit: feel free to edit the original post with a link to a couple of suggestions

I will probably drop a build or two on the forum in the near future, but I think you have three basic options. Each involves heavy investment in the Red tree, primarily because it is not worthwhile to invest more than 20ish points in either the Green or Blue trees

1 HP Bloodletter – Kit includes a Knife Drain White Elephant, Fish Slap and Stinger shield or One Shotter shield.

Knife Drain Mind Sweeper – Kit includes a Knife Drain White Elephant, Fish Slap and Stinger shield.

Elemental Stone Mind Sweeper – Kit includes elemental Stone White Elephants, corresponding element Old God shields, and CMT.

1 HP Bloodletter and Knife Drain Mind Sweeper are good all-around builds and their performance is about the same. Elemental stones will sometimes edge them out if the elemental damage matching is correct.

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Couple of quick observations I’ve made messing with melee.

Slayer mayhem modifier will not pull you out of FFYL if activated bu a facepuncher.

The most efficient melee builds all have enough spare points to be pilot builds

This makes rocketeer and raging bear solid options for a Pilotpuncher build.

Purple coms like shield maiden, tactician, firewalker, marksman and baby boomer should not be slept on. A good chunk of these do better than a bloodletter. Bonus points in Stoke the embers are worth looking for.

FiTSD and Action Skill damage rolls are worth building for.

The interaction between Tenacious Defense, a Frozen Heart shield and an Ice Breaker prefix is solid, provided one keeps healthgate. The shield recharge rate skills are enough to keep your shield refilling easily. I’d recommend amp on break anointment, nova in-out, then Nova AS Start in that order.

The damage formula is different enough that it’s less important to worry about diminishing returns from stacking gun damage. It’s often still the best option.

I look forward to seeing your builds. I might send you the one I’m working on and if it’s different enough you might include some or all of it with yours. No pressure. :smiley:

Nice work!

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I’ve been messing around with the Bloodletter purely for how it interacts with the Stinger shield, which on net probably makes it more useful than any purple com. I will give them another look; I should probably also think about the Rocketeer again — I set it aside when I realized that AB damage does not contribute to Groundbreaker.

The Brawler Ward, cryo nova shields and Ice Breaker WE are on my to do list.

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Another thing worth mentioning is that regardless of whether or not you’re using the White Elephant, the Face-puncher can land critical hits when the shield and grenade anointments of 50% bonus elemental damage for 10 seconds are active. And although 100% bonus melee damage is not as good as the 3 weapon anointments you mentioned, it is also a shield anointment so you can easily enjoy both.

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Interesting – I wonder why those ASEs can crit, but the gun NTM anoints do not.

Didn’t really get the sort of damage boost I expected from using an Ice Breaker White Elephant, though that may be due in part to the fact that my artifact had terrible stat rolls.

I did get good performance out of the Brawler Ward, but it did require reworking the skill tree pretty heavily:

URad facepuncher + Atom Balm Static Charge =
Melee brainstormer + rad burst.

guitar solo

What triggers FITSD in that combo? The Static Charge chains?

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Actually, nothing. It was making such a mess I assumed skag den had a hand on it. Not at all. Worth trying out.

It would be pretty cool if Skag Den applied to both DoT damage and splash damage. It would open up the possibility of a Moze DoT meta.

It’s a real shame it doesn’t apply to that rad DoT explosion for sure.

I just picked up a fire stone static charge, it’s a little obscene.

Also I’ve noticed that the action skill damage roll seems to have an interaction with melee, I haven’t Crunched any numbers, but it seems substantial.

Am I ded?

Did I die?

No, you were always a ghost and my summoning ritual worked perfectly.

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Thanks for the post. I was thinking of doing this type of build. Then my Zane found this:

It is a pity Moze can’t proc ASE that often.

When I get back to the game I will have to try this out.

Anything is possible this year.

I’ve been using your wisdom to inform my face punching shenanigans. It’s been handy to have!

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So did a lot more testing of various skill builds and gear combinations, including 1 HP Bloodletter/Stinger/Knife Drain White Elephant, Mind Sweeper/Stinger/KDWE, Mind Sweeper/Stinger/Elemental Stone White Elephant, Mind Sweeper/Brawler Ward/KDWE, and Mind Sweeper/Brawler Ward/ESWE and I think 1 HP Bloodletter/Stinger/KDWE is the best option.

The Mind Sweeper/Brawler Ward/ESWE has the highest damage potential, even before factoring in micro nades, but so many of the build’s damage bonuses are conditional (depleted shield, Click Click, etc.) that maintaining peak damage is challenging.

1 HP/Bloodletter/Stinger/KDWE comes in at a close second in terms of damage potential, but it is much easier to stay at peak damage between the full shield bonus and red tree skills.

I think I will do a full build write-up this weekend.

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I tried melee build with new purple tree.
My gears were ASA +200 facepuncher, flare COM +63 melee dmg, white elephant +36? melee dmg.
I thought it would be rocking because +200 +63 +100 (from COM) +36 melee bonus. But at some moment it was good but most of time, very underperformed. well below my expectation. I don’t know why. it seemed perfect in paper plan.
Would you suggest any idea? Thanks