How to implement a nerf properly

So I categorize nerfs into 2 separate categories.

  1. Things that are not working as intended/broken/exploit.

  2. Things that are overtuned.

So the Pipebomb…Catagory 1

Fade Away…Catagory 2

The thing that separates the 2 is people know category is broken or is an exploit. So when nerfing category 1 timing does not matter, Nerf it as soon as possible. People can see it coming a mile away and should have a backup plan.

Now with Catagory 2 the gamer is simply following the rules you established when you made the game.
Fade Away is 8 seconds…the developers should know how powerful the skill is. I think Fade Away got nerfed becuase of its popularity more so than it being OP.

In this case timing absolutlely matters. When you post a hotfix and implement it the same day you’re giving people no time to adjust. And this is very important becuase people have spent hours grinding this gear and making thier builds to all of a sudden have buulds ruined and that time wasted.

At the end of the day…the developer made the mistake intentional or not. The playerbase should be given more time to adjust so the transition to the post hotfix game is somewhat seamless. Playing this game right now is like driving and being stopped at a red light every single block.

I’m not against nerfs…and honestly agree with most of them so far. I dont like the way they are actually implented.

My suggestion is post one Tuesday…implement on a Friday. That’s should give the playerbase time to formulate a new build as opposed to instant panic.

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I agree 100%. If the game is being broken ie pipe bomb. Fix it as soon as possible, but if the build is just too good and needs a retune ask the community first or let us know ahead of time.
I agree with the nerd to the perk it made them way more powerful than the other vault hunters. That being said a heads up to find gear to mitigate loses would be nice.

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IMO the nerf to damage from 50% to 25% was big enough. The 2 less seconds of precious time was not needed.


The way I see it, Nerfs are never welcome PERIOD, this is not an mmo, or a pvp game. How you play your game does not in any way shape or form affect others
It’s not so much the timing is wrong here for all these totally unnecessary nerfs, it seems to be a clear case of bait and switch…all the advertising for this game showed Lootplosians with clear video footage of Loot Tinks exploding and legendaries everywhere, and other footage showing huge amounts of loot on the ground supposedly after farming etc…They got our money, they got their sales, THEN AND ONLY THEN they issued nerfs which in effect has made the loot quality as bad as Borderlands 2 ever was. In a sense we’re not getting the product we saw in the advertising, compared to what it has become now with these nerfs.
It’s about priorities, with 95% of the community whining in here about genuine issues with performance, horrific lag in the menu, Bank glitch, lost save files, vertical splitscreen, woefully inadequate bank storage and other assorted issues, all of this was ignored, but they decide to nerf our game instead. I do understand that some fixes take a lot longer than others, and the devs want to make sure they get things right before they start issuing patches and hotfixes, BUT when the first thing that is done is to nerf the loot and to nerf certain weapons, you have to question the timing of these nerfs and prioritization

I disagree with your opinion on not nerfing because its a single player game. If they didnt nerf the loot drops then it removes the reason to grind at higher ranks, since all your loot can be gotten in a few rund. And nerfing specific weapons and abilities is important as well cause if they dont it would limit the way people play each character. A good example of this in the past was everyone ran Sal from bl2 almost the exact same. It can ruin a character for a lot of people. I had no interest in building a flak cause I knew his crit build would absolutely melt everything and the game would have no challenge, but his pet build looked to weak. Now his crit build is still super strong but not so powerful that all the bosses just melt. In the long run these nerds are to keep people playing the game. If the game gets to easy everyone will just quit playing it.


Any way a nerf is implemented, people will complain. What the OP is doing is common, but unfortunately flawed all the same. The suggestions stem from ways to make it affect the OP less, but simply aren’t viable because they’ll make different people complain all the same.

If something could do with nerfing, your best bet is just to nerf it. This means any subsequent buffs can also come out sooner. If you wait X days to implement the nerf, you’re delaying any customer feedback on that nerf by X days as well (theorycrafting can be handy, but often doesn’t work out because people just see the raw numbers and freak).

This is a lot of what’s happening tbh. People writing big posts about how numbers are going down and That’s Bad, but very little actual video footage of FL4K apparently sucking now. Lead with that.


I didnt say my way stops complaining, I said my way gives the gamer more time to prepare for it…buffs included.

Next time…read what I said.

Yes I agreed too. 25% is too much … could be around 35%

And GITM 8 sec -> 5 sec (Current on game) was not needed.

Next should be Amara and Moze… since people likes to OR around something.

I did. What I’m saying is your suggestion might be enough for you, but it would cause other people to then complain. There’s not necessarily any reduction in people being upset - just different groups of people.

So with that in mind: why should Gearbox do such a thing? It’s not going to reduce the volume of the complaints.

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I don’t care if people complain…I care that people’s time is being wasted becuase Gearbox doesnt test thier games.

But my time waiting for the editing period to be over so I can see what actually works or not is still wasted time…

Not really…in that time you can still use the build that’s going to get nerfed…what you do with that time is up to you.

Or you could view it the sooner the change is made - the sooner you can get to the point you stop having to change the way you played. It’s two sides of the same coin - so there’s 0 incentive to change the way it works now

Theres plenty of incentive to change it. Not everyone reads hotfixes or go on forums. The more time to get the word out the better.

That seems like the biggest waste of time imo… Developers need to get paid - by saying here’s what we want to test out but let’s wait a week to do our jobs all your accomplishing is extending the period they get paid for not having done it right the first time. And the more money goes into this the less the team can put towards developing new content because it’s still being fixed…

Not to mention a shift code was announced on Twitter ahead of time so folks could stay up late to redeem it. The code never worked was expired the entire time - if scheduling a code is beyond their means do you honestly think that trying to schedule hot fixes and patches around the customer is going to go off better?

It does not save any customers time either way - and you risk breaking the attempts to fix things and not getting us new content on time.

Just let it go bro

prime example.

  • They announce the Fade away nerd to be 6 seconds… now its 5 seconds with no announcement.

  • They said Queen/Kings Call was a 50% fire rate reduction…ends up going from 10 rpm to 3. I’m not good at math but that’s not 50%. Giving the buffer allows for better communication as opposed to “gotcha” surprise nerfs.

We need to stop acting like they woke up on friday and decided on these nerfs that same day. This was planned way before the hotfix day. You can easily do a development manifesto like Path of Exile to give people warning…then give official numbers closer to the actual date.

Finally they better not be working on new content when the current content is still in a poor state.


Bloody Harvest was announced on August 30th, first dlc by the end of the year. If you didn’t get those memos how do you expect anyone to keep up to date with what they’re planning to release for upcoming hot fixes?

Also, I’m sure they woke up and decided on the nerfs the same day. I’m also sure they didn’t implement them the same day they were decided on - but their job is to code and debug not PR. If you ran a company would you hire PR for your programming needs?

PR isn’t for “this is what we’re trying to fix” and even if it were somehow it wasn’t effective enough for you to know about the new content they’ve been working on since long before the release so again it’s just a waste of time.

Edit - before I get a lot of “how do you know about the dlc?” it was included in the graphic they released titled fall/winter 2019 road map. It would be silly to include it in the road map for this year if it was intended to be released next year is all I’m going off - I have no more details than that.

I dont care about some stupid Halloween thing…this game’s foundation is on quicksand at the moment. I have tbe season pass…I know about the DLC.
It’s great to know they care more about DLC than having an optimized game on release.

I’m sorry…Roadmaps are the dumbest things in gaming right now and it needs to die in a fire. Roadmaps are doing games like Anthem and Division 2 well right now.

A well oiled machine works together with all of its parts. Its not just one department going rogue doing it’s own thing. PR and Programmers dont work together…however that’s what leadership and management is for. They are the buffers.

Lol you want better communication from the team, then trash road maps (the release cycle version of pretty much exactly what you’re asking for) in the same thread.

Anyways this has gone way off topic… Bringing it back in this is how you properly nerf:

Get a test server, do your balancing together, release in one patch with notes so it’s over and done with.

Hot fixes still work but are just the cheapest route possible.

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I 100% agree with adding a PTS.