Hyperspace Gate Upgrade Proposal

I’ve tried to love the Hyperspace gates…I really have. But they cost so much to set up. They are also nearly useless on small/medium maps since it doesn’t take much longer to simply move to your target on conventional drives. On these maps, RUs are more efficiently spent on ships/upgrades.

On the largest maps, they have potential when combined with teammates…but it still ends up being more feasible to just jump Carriers/Cruisers (and sometimes Destroyers) to attack enemies or defend points. Since the Hyperspace Gates are stationary, they are also usually destroyed before long…

Here are 2 possible proposals to making the Gates more useful/used:

  1. Make ships in hyperspace via Hyperspace Gates immune to Hyperspace Inhibitors/GWG. It sucks spending all that $ to set up the gates, jump a fleet…only to run into a Hyperspace Inhibitor/GWG! Not only do your ships take damage from the Hyperspace Inhibitor field (because they aren’t production ships), they now don’t have the ability to use hyperspace to get to where they need to go (even if they get clear of the Inhibitor Field).

*Even making them immune to the damage of being pulled out of Hyperspace would be a step in the right direction!

**I get that this ability might be overpowered…that can be fixed by making the Gates themselves very vulnerable to damage! If they were as vulnerable as a scout (for example), you wouldn’t be able to simply send a Gate to the middle of an enemy base!

I’m not even sure if it is possible for the game engine to apply different rules to ships using hyperspace via Hyperspace Gates!

  1. Make Hyperspace Gates a type of utility ship that can move quickly.
    *Perhaps the Gate Link can remain active while the Hyperspace Gates are moving = that would introduce some interesting tactics.

I’m definitely for making it movable for any amount of times. (Maybe you mean by that for 2nd?)

Turning it immune to grav sounds simply weird, besides, how do you think a gate can survive within an inhibitor radius that close to enemy cap ships? Maybe it means something to send ships to the frontline ignoring inhibitor but that will just make the gate such an important utlity to keep in many games.

1 Like

Turn them into one time use slip gate creators that either side can use. @antibitx you down for some Cold War?

What I meant was being able to move them at any time…even while the gate is active! So you don’t have to ‘disconnect’ the gate to move, then spend another $1000 RU to reconnect it.

I believe the main idea behind paradox’s suggestions is having a hyperspace gate that can move multiple times allowing it to sneak behind an enemy’s base, link to another gate, and allow hyperspace jumps to ignore inhibitors in their path as long as their exit is not inside an inhibitor bubble.

This would prevent players from unfairly jumping a whole bunch of destroyers and bombers right on top of your inhibitor-equipped MS/carrier/shipyard but still let players use gates for strikecraft/frigate/destroyer flank attacks and ambushes in player’s blind spots (so you would still have the 11 km inhibitor buffer for reaction time).

I would be against this. Being able to retreat your gate at the first sign of trouble (moving at speeds faster than any strikecraft) while still pumping out reinforcements would be overpowered. However it could be carefully balanced if there was a split case for its speed e.g. keep its base speed of 600 when unlinked, 50-100 when linked.

The penalty for unlinking it and moving away at full speed would mean having to spend another 1000 RU to restablish a gate.

I really like this!

1 Like

I don’t know what is unfair here. (Edit : maybe I see what you mean now.)
I don’t think breaking a grav’s rule just for the sake is the right way to go.

As for moving it, if that’s how it’s going to be, it can simply disable its hyperspace capability while on transit to another location but without breaking the link. 50-100 speed is such an easy target. Think about that the location of the gate will be very apparent once it’s used against hyper sig sensor. It will be as fragile as before.

Yeah, this all sounds nice, but then it just becomes OP in my opinion. It sounds like it is also nerfing the hyperspace inhibitors.

I have played several games where the other team made good use of a hyperspace gate. It works well the way it is.

Perhaps make it a teeny bit faster and a teeny bit less expensive?

2 Likes

As if inhibitors aren’t very effective now. What would be really nice is if AsOE could scale to map size. Even probes.

They are pretty effective, no?

No, that was the point. Borderline too effective on smaller maps.

Ahhh I see what you are saying.

Just reduce the cost and make the hyperspace gate a lot more tanky. Give it a heck of a lot of HP so that you require a lot of firepower to destroy it.

If the gate costs 1000 RU’s and has 40,000 - 50,000 armor, it will definitely be used a lot more.

2 Likes

Yeah, just in case though I made some pictures to convey this idea better.

When gates link through an inhibitor field:

When gates link into an inhibitor field:

The idea is to make gates more strategic. While being able to move them multiple times would be great, this advantage alone would be a little irrelevant given that units are pulled out of hyperspace and take damage when they hit an inhibitor field (which are very prevalent and relatively easy to spam as HW2 races) making successful flank gate setups nearly impossible.

Allowing gate links to ignore inhibitor fields in the hyperspace path could make gate gameplay a lot more interesting.

Being able to run away at a speed of 600 and reenable the link elsewhere without costing anything would be overpowered. The 50-100 speed was a suggestion based on the idea that you could move the gate without breaking or disabling the link but still revert to its base 600 if the player chose to break it for a hasty retreat.

Whether or not gates should be able to temporarily disable links, instead of breaking, when repositioning would be the first question to answer for this kind of balancing direction.

2 Likes

I really don’t believe gravity well should be able to be circumvented. I’m not sure how one can spam inhibitors either? They serve a purpose. There is no hyperspacing allowed within that sphere of influence. It is a sound game principle and not to mention a science fiction principle. Being able to move a gate seems pretty OP as well.

Seem as though the purpose of these ideas is to get people to use it more often by making it more attractive and so is less a balancing issue?

2 Likes

If we want to get theoretical about it, an inhibitor should collapse the gate, not pull ships out of transit. Ships attempting to pass though a gate with an inhibitor between them shouldn’t be able to enter in the first place.

2 Likes

What if:

  • Instead of costing 750, they cost 250.

  • Connecting them costs 1000 RUs. Disconnecting is free. But re-connecting, even the same gates, will cost another 1000.

  • Upgrades: Increase movement speed, increase armour.

  • Functionality: One gate can connect to an existing un-connected gate for a total of 1000 RUs. Cannot move while connected.

  • Inhibitors work as normal. Hyperspace is hyperspace. That said, it’d be nice to have a warning–I don’t know if it currently does that. “Hyperspace Inhibitor detected” the game should say, since the gates are connected.

The benefit of the above is that, if you were rich, you could have one exit point with a lot of entry points. As long as you were willing to connect for 1000 RUs for each entry point (and disconnecting afterwards). Offers some flexibility and shouldn’t be too overpowered.

The lower production cost will also encourage use, but the total amount will remain the same.

Omniconsumer, you are right. We ARE trying to figure out a way to make Hyperspace Gates more attractive…as it is, they just have too many drawbacks to bother with.

There are a lot of underutilised units in the game…a perfectly balanced game would mean all units can be useful! As it is, there a some units that really need ‘something’ to make them viable…namely, Hyperspace Gates/Gunships/AssaultFrigs/ and maybe even minelayers.

*The reason I mention minelayers is that they aren’t meant to be on the front line…but since mine durations are so short = the minelayer has to continually upkeep the minefield = they get killed fast!

Personally, I would like to see each minelayer have a maximum number of mines it can have out any time…BUT those mines don’t disappear until the ‘parent’ minelayer lays more mines somewhere else!

2 Likes