If you're gonna balance content around Amara

Don’t. Just don’t.

This is how the power creep that you said you wanted to prevent occurs.

Raising every other VHer to this level of power negates the increased level of power of Mayhem modes. Now if everyone is doing this much and people are comparing M4 to OP levels, imagine what OP level you would have to do to have any remote challenge.

Balance exists in RPGs because there is more than one class that are supposed to fulfill different gameplay/narrative roles.. You actively undermine your own game by making 3/4 of those classes clearly inferior to the other one gameplay wise. Although each VHer is a main character, none of them have any differing storyline significance.

This has nothing to do with it not being competitive or not being an mmo/multiplayer (beyond co-op) and everything to do with just being poor game design/philosophy/awareness.

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The Speed is fine, because she was always this fast if you could do self damage. The damage should be toned down. You should have used the example in the Amara section A Dragon relic lets you kill bosses with a few melee hits. That’s insane and I’m stongly against power creep.

I mean, the damage issue has been stressed ad-nauseum.

The whole thing is she does more damage than everyone else, she’s faster than everyone else, she’s better at both single target and mobbing than everyone else, she has more sustain than anyone else, can make use of every Slam/Slide/Melee artifact better than anyone else, ignores elemental damage mechanics almost entirely and/or becomes stronger because of them, and is easier to gear and use than anyone else.

The important part to point out would be that it’s just a cutsman. She’s able to get to Traunt and kill him before a lot of people have killed the first spawn.

I have no idea what Unleash the Dragon is capable of anymore, but Joltz did a video of him not specc’d into any melee and hitting shielded targets and doing >50k /tick with a regular, non-facepuncher attack. I’m sure with effort you could double that. You don’t really need to put in any effort though, it’s Amara.

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Can you link it? Cause I know you can’t get such a numbers. Maybe it was offline or at the beginning before melee was nerfed?

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A thing that kind of annoys me is that the new Amara COM is also a lot easier to farm than the other ones because it’s not tied to a trials boss. I feel like the new COMs should either be all easily farmable from a team crew enemy or boss or none of them should.
And yes, I’m just salty because I absolutely despise doing the trial of discipline on Mayhem 4, not only because it’s just a pain but also because it prolongs every single farm to 15-20 mins with a droprate that’s probably not even 10%.

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I have literally only run each trial once in the 17 days I have on Zane.

I now have to farm them for my new com to do respectable damage. The damage on the com is pretty good, but it’s incomparable. The comparison only exists because there is such a demeaning and stark difference in ability.

It’s not like Amara wasn’t before or hasn’t always been the strongest. It’s that Gearbox doesn’t really seem to care in actually establishing a baseline and sticking with it and making sure there other characters are there too. If this is the baseline, it’s bad.

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completely agree. My thread on Amara has aged very well and people who disagreed with me now look very silly

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Don’t get me wrong, I still love Zane and think he’s capable of all the content. I wouldn’t be angry about killing Troy 155 times if I wasn’t able to do it.

This is about scale, the scale is terrible.

I’ll have to check that thread out.

I also have a massive issue with how Legendary COMs are being handled so check this out as well

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i think, atleast for now they should balance it around amara. unless i’m completely wrong, she is the only VH currently that can solo taken down M4 without resorting to combos that could be considered glitches.

i’ll be honest and say that i’ve only watched ONE take down solo vid, and that was joltzdude’s Moze run. He uses transformer + tediore for the mobbing and a lvl 1 stop gap for the boss. This to me is exactly the same as invulnabilty relic. i don’t know why he didn’t just run through the whole thing with lvl 1 stop gap if he’s gonna cheat it, but that’s beside the point really. i’m not against cheating, but if it’s the only way for a VH to do it, then there’s something seriously wrong. i’m trying to play the game that it was meant to be played, but all these nerfs last 2 months on moze have only hurt me, not the people who still uses glitches.

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I agree with your second premise, but not this one.

She’s the only VHer that can currently solo without glitches, which is absolutely true. I do not see this as a good thing. If she did it and the others could do it, but she did it faster, that would be fine.

The fact that she can speed run it and do the boss fight in about 4 minutes, while everyone else is struggling to do it at all is a glaring red flag. If everyone else was as strong as Amara the 4 person raid wouldn’t be a 4 person raid, it’d be a new event map. It’d be no different than Heck, which isn’t an issue if it wasn’t advertised as hardcore endgame content.

One VHer shouldn’t be flexing (xd amara xd) on the raid while everyone else is limping while dragging around a Transformer/Tediore/jackhammer dialysis machine behind them.

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Your thread asking to nerf Amara was before the new COM came out. Other than Do Harm stacking and now this new COM, Amara isn’t OP.

as i said, i’ve no idea who strong amara is since i’ve not seen a full clear with her, i’ve only heard she can do it the “normal” way. now, it’s obviously a problem if she can just cake walk it but she (and everyone else) should be able to do it with out resorting to glitch / cheat. tone her down, but not by alot while tone the rest up. it should be a struggle to solo, but it should not be impossible and it should be doable legit. easier said than done though, of course.

i’ve seen amaras new class mod though, first glance and it’s just insane how they even would add more power like that to her - doesn’t it improve her in bascially every way possible? speed, damage, healing (when paired with EP)

and to add insult to injury it’s very clear that she got the best mod AGAIN from the new content. People are saying Spiritual Driver and Phasezerker are on par with eachother.

WHAT?!?!?!?!

Phazerker is one of the most broken mods in the game. How in the hell does Amara get the best mod again?!

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I Literally never said to nerf her… ? I said the best character in the game, has an embarrassment of riches in terms of gear that other vault hunters can’t compare too

Either they should all be at this level or none should be. Amara has been the most powerful since the beginning, but Gearbox was too busy nerfing Moze and FL4K based on yootoobe videos from wannabe Calypsos. The fact that they gutted two other classes but left Amara untouched when she was already the most powerful just proves they have no holistic balance curve - Amara isn’t playing the game game as the other VHs.

It’s doubly obnoxious that the com used simulates the style of another VH (Zane). Like, Amara is already overtuned and has the most general diversity of brokenness - why do they have to also steal role specific traits from the other VHs? GET YOUR OWN GIMMICKS, AMARA.

Oh, and you don’t have to farm Trials for it, either. I’m just going to agree that forcing people into the Trials for coms without improving its rewards otherwise is a cruel joke, but then having some of them not require it adds that nice amount of insult to injury.

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Its terrible that they gave Amara, Zane’s entire kit with one mod. Oh and that mod has elemental projector synergy on it. Brilliant. Screw Zane. A developer clearly liked Zane’s fast playstyle but didn’t want to use the character. Best course of action was to give Amara Zane’s speed

so much this. i were and still am anti-nerfs, and at release i were very vocal about it - nowdays it’s just pointless… anyway, i said back then that it’s to early to start nerf / balance ■■■■ when people are still testing the waters. before release, Zane and FL4K seemed the most poplular picks over on reddit / twitter but when the game launched, zane were nerfed just prior and suddenly moze were the favorite choice by most (basing this on a twitter poll lol). Amara flew under the radar and moze were demeed OP because of a granade. Hex got nerfed, but they also nerfed all other granades too due to Meme of destruction constantly getting changed behind the scenes.

anyway, what’s done is done i suppose…

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