Is 'Backdooring' cheating?

Battleborn Battleborn Competitive Multiplayer Discussion
#56

I’m curious as to how long it takes for this to actually happen. In essence when someone decides to backdoor you’re leaving your team in a state of 5v4 anyway. So are you at an advantage or disadvantage? From what I’ve seen so far it actually takes a good bit of time to get the shield down an start chipping away at the sentries health ( at higher levels of course it would take less time). I’d say this is a legit tactic, but moreso exploits the lack of communication that there is in this game right now. Just like in any MOBA you should be splitting your attention from whats going on in front of you and and whats going on in your HUD (sentry exclamation mark, NOVA shouting at you, the sentry shouting at you). My question to those that are calling this cheap or cheating is do you not have a back line? In every single game if you don’t have an OM,Marquis,WF, Benedict or just someone who’s role it is to basically sit back and clear waves and such you might be doing it wrong and need to be THAT guy. Just having that would prevent a lot of backdooring anyway. I haven’t tried backdooring myself by but when I use benedict or marquis, i’m just sitting on my perch and killing minions/chipping away at enemy BB. There’s legit no way you can NOT hear/see the multiple indications that he’s being attacked imo. Not only does the exclamation mark pop up, nova says something and then your sentry himself starts complaining and crying that he needs help, doesnt want to die alone blah blah. I CAN vouch for the fact that the exclamation point popping up is bugged I believe but you should be checking on your sentry anyway just to see but it doesn’t happen often enough for it to warrant NOT checking to see whats going on. But thats where the communication comes in unfortunately because if you ARENT the guy in the back line whose job it is to actually handle that then its kind of an SOL situation because of course everyone cant be that type of character and expect to win against anyone thats competent. Just my two cents.

TL;DR no its not cheating because there are still plenty of indicators to help you prevent it from happening even if they are taking 0 damage from the sentry itself. Pay attention to your alerts. imo.

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#57

Hostility? There is no hostilitity, just pointing out that he is not comprehending what I’m saying. What me and my tank did, was back dooring, but he says it’s not and dismissing everything I’ve said as irrelevant because he hasn’t seen it himself… that is not only an absurd argument, it’s down right insulting!

However:

Tower diving is almost always used when someone dives under a tower to eliminate a player who is under their tower.

Back dooring in MOBA’s (which Battleborn is sorta a MOBA) was originally about players being able to destroy towers out of order, IE destroying the second tower before you destroy the first tower. Once the dev’s made it where the tower is immortal unless the tower in front was destroyed, back dooring morphed into referring to player (or players) who would attack towers without minion assistance, typically while opposing players were busy/not paying attention across the map.

Now, back dooring can turn into a tower dive, and vice versa a tower dive can turn into back dooring. And while they are similar (as in they are being attacked by the tower), the purpose are two completely different things.

However, unlike other MOBA’s, no one, atm, can be geared to solo and kill a sentry alone, or in a very short amount of time. However, it completely depends on the situation. The situation I was in in that particularly game, the enemy team was camping our first sentry area and was not pushing at all. They just wanted to get as many kills, hence why me and the tank sneaking around and fighting their sentry (he did die a few times) didn’t really affect our team. And even after we took their first sentry, only one or two of their guys would try to push for our last sentry, the rest continued to camp our first sentry area for some reason… don’t ask me why.

#58

Rath can double jump

#59

The negativity has kind of gotten out of control. However I do like what you suggested, where the sentry is immune to damage unless under attack by minions. They could also balance this out by making the sentry’s shields weaker, but only able to be damaged by minions. It would be similar in concept to other MOBAs, where you can only attack the enemy core after the Inhibitors have been destroyed.

Also, while I doubt the third lane is considered cheating, I bet it will be changed with the upcoming patch. I have a feeling (or rather a hope) that there will be some significant changes to the Incursion Map Layouts.

#60

Well you said it is a mistake in a Moba when you lose sight of your enemy. So even if a person sneaking up and attacking your sentry without being seen by the sentry you should use prior experience to find where your target is at.

#61

I know I’m in the very small minority, but I play with a headset on bare minimum volume of the game, and not once have I ever heard the sentry say he is under attack. However, an exclamation point always flashes when he is being under attack, so you SHOULD always be aware. You shouldn’t need a verbal notification to let you know you must play differently

#62

it is a mistake, but it certainly shouldn’t cost you the game without so much as a reliable warning, and NOTHING Your enemy can do to win the game should be without risk. MOBAs are all about decision making, there isn’t much decision making involved in “sit by wall, hold trigger until victory.”

I’ve lost maybe two games out of the 200-ish I’ve played because someone did this… each time it’s a momentary lapse of attention, and a very small amount of damage done… but it’s enough. The problem is, it’s not fun. It’s not fun to win that way or to lose that way. It’s BAD for gameplay, it’s bad for new players, it’s bad for the game in general.

The only people who enjoy it are the types that prefer to win with as little effort as possible, have no pride in achieving anything and aren’t here to have fun, but to ruin someone else’s fun.

#63

It announces it with a quiet little “your sentry is under attack” from NOVA, it also flashes at the same time. The problem is both are very easily overlooked and should be more prominent, AND the sentry will do BOTH while not actually under attack.

I mean, maybe it’s some stray bullet going across map to activate it when this happens, but it’s literally not enough damage to be able to even see that the shields are down at all, and it will go haywire. It’s not reliable.

This results in the first few times it happens you rushing over and looking for the enemy damaging it… then, you start to assume that if you’re pushed up into the enemy’s base it’s probably just a fluke. That’s a failing game-mechanic that does not accurately portray the state of the game.

#64

All I know is, is that until sentry sniping is fixed, I’m done with Incursion. That crap happening once is enough to make me not want to play for the rest of the day. Nothing worse than pushing minions and whittling down a sentry, only to still be losing to a team stuck in its base. And it’s not like I can just stroll in leisurely and kill him either. Yeah, try shutting him down as Attikus or Boldur. Hope you can come up with a better strat during respawn.

As for back dooring, if the sentry or turrets can’t hit you, and the most you have to do is hold auto attack, then yes, it is an exploit. There is no real risk once you set up camp. 1 character shouldn’t be doing what a team + minions attempts to do.

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#65

Ugh, sure, I’ll explain it nice and clear. Yes, while he can spec into a double jump, he still can’t sit behind a wall auto-attacking the sentry down; can he? He still can’t do what I’m talking about.

#66

Why is that such a hard concept for some people to understand? They act like the designers intended them to win with that junk or something.

#67

It’s another lane in my opinion. The fact of the matter is more then 5 characters in game can do it so both teams have the option. I believe it to be fair and a viable option.

#68

Another thing no one has mentioned, these strategies as is put certain characters leagues above other’s in usefulness. So many Battleborn have to push the center lane and fight things out, while certain, already strong characters, can just sneak to a sentry and hurt it without risk once camp is set up. Whiskey now just looks that much worse lol

#69

My issue with seeing it as a lane is that nothing of importance is in those lanes, so no one thinks about them. If I’m playing El Dragon, what’s more likely, me Splashing minions and keeping enemy Battleborn at bay, or hanging in a lane that holds 0 significance to my character.

And hey, maybe that’s the point, and why it’s called a backdoor, but there’s even less risk involved when you take into consideration those same 5+ characters are the only ones going to consider it a viable. Pushing a center lane hard as Benedict runs the risk of a Gal stunning/silencing you out of the air or a Whiskey hitting you with a slow sticky, but these other “lanes?” Most hard hitting power houses won’t bother unless there is a thrall, so worst case scenario, run back to center and continue to be useful there.

#70

no he… actually he can but that relies on late game and having lots of cooldown item and spamming his crossblades and the smash move and there are helix that cools one another from the double thrall spot, but not as fast as ISICS FREAKEN ULTIMATE!!!

#71

I asked my wife if ‘backdooring’ is cheating and she said yes.

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#72

It’s not a map issue. Overgrowth has the other tunnel that they can go through as anyone and back door. echelon has 2 of them. If you don’t defend you won’t win its that simple. The UI has an indicator that a sentry is under attack look for the exclamation point

#73

Yet cheating or glitchng by definition would give an unfair advantage, but since it requires no cheating or game manipulation by definition it’s fair game even if it lacks the spirit of the game. Same thing could be said about camping in other games ya know?

#74

Nah, I see what you mean. I don’t think it’s cheating, just not at all well planned (Though the sentry and turrets not firing on you is a bit exploitative IMO). As I said, it’s just a bit too easy for a select number of characters to do it, yet any character that has no choice but to hold the middle lane pushes and fights for every inch of progress, where even retreat can he punishable by death.

My complaint is with that. The uneven advantage it gives to certain characters above others. Doesn’t help that characters that can do it are already pretty damn strong. Meanwhile, Attikus is in the game. I love him to death, but jeez it’s a challenge.

#75

I have never failed to notice the alarm that my sentry is under attack despite several Backdooring attempts upon me. The “!” signal over the score bar is very obvious and I don’t know how people miss it.

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