That’s completely unrealistic.
In incursion, I’ve lost match that we dominated all along and heavily by a single push that lasted 2 minutes long and destroyed both sentry. That’s the time you need when level 10 sometimes.
One single mistake of a team leading to 4 or 5 deaths successively with a 50 sec timer (level 10…) is more than enough to completely return the situation even if you were winning 100-30 or something.
Same thing with meltdown. After 250, it’s far harder to protect your minions due to having to overextend a lot, + characters that are “late bloomer” starts to really get strong around that time.
No comeback mechanism? Hello no. The only very snowbally mode is capture. The other two aren’t.
As I said, if character strengths are equal you’re relying on the other team overextending or making a mistake.
If I’m playing this game to win and I take your first sentry down I will NOT be pushing your second sentry down ever. Why would I? I can control most of the shards, most of the map and there’s a timer I can run down.
Same in meltdown, if I get minions in after the grinders have moved and have a lead I have no incentive to push past mid. I can clear waves and that’s it.
I don’t think you understand this game since you’re entirely ignoring the timer.
Sure incursion and meltdown aren’t as snowbally but they do not have a comeback mechanism. This is not dota2 or LoL where you are forced to end the game.
players can easily become greedy. It happens all the time. I’m a very cautious player but it happens to me as well. Including one that ImO triggered a defeat of our team that shouldn’t have happened.
Ummm, I didn’t say anything about messing with the ELO. I simply said that you are bumped up the queue for priority. If you’re five games in, but the same ELO as me when I start for the day, you SHOULD be ahead of me in the queue unless your ping to that game is really bad. if I’m higher in ELO, then yeah, I should be ahead of you for a suitably matched team.
I’ll say no to all three right out. I’m a person who favors surrender, and there is nothing more obnoxious than to have someone refuse to surrender, because THEY want to get platinum or loot and will hijack the group to do it. Your goal here, is not to discourage surrender, but to ENCOURAGE sticking a game out, win OR lose. So you can’t base the reward off of avoiding people profiting by losing a game. if you want people to stick out a losing match, it has to be in their interests as well as the winning team. If it’s not, this will never end.
As I said, you’re making mistakes and that’s the only thing that’s giving the other team a way back in. That is not a comeback mechanism if anything it’s a lack of discipline.
Don’t get me wrong I tend to keep pushing as well since there’s nothing on the line anyway. But if there was a decent competitive/ranked mode I would not be making that “mistake”
If queues are quick I am not going to spend 15 minutes or whatever waiting for someone to screw up and hope my team capitalizes on it.
“If queue times are quick…” If queue times were quick, I probably never would’ve started this thread, as the other two gripes in my initial post are minor by comparison.
But they’re not, which is why I’m so anti-surrender.
They were fast enough on xbox. Now it seems to be a bit more random.
If you make a platform agnostic thread expect other people who do not have queue problems to chime in.
You’re not getting a faster MM without broadening the MM at the same time. The problem of the long wait isn’t that you’re waiting for other players to go before you, it’s that there is not enough players with an ELO clsoe to you to start a match.
You can’t enter a match that is already running, too. Nor can you replace someone ina team that choose to rematch together, either. Or being put into a premade, either.
So yeah, that doesn’t work.
Surrender is not needed to begin with. in sport, when you’re losing, you don’t have a surrender button. EVEN if you’re taking a beating.
And we’re not even talking about taking a beating here. I’m FORCED to surrender because others vote for it.
You say you don’t want to be forced to stick with a team just because they want the reward? Do yuou realize that it’s exactly the same than what I’m saying? I don’t want to be forced to surrender just because there is no incentive to even make a little EFFORT and TRY (just, try, you know) to play and win a match.
'omg we’re not crushing them, it’s hopeless, I died twice, oooh, they’re leading by 2 points, lets spam the surrender button until it’s accepted".
Look, just to be clear, if the surrender was only used when you’re taking a beating, I wouldn’t be upset about it. But it’s not the case.
The reason you’re refusing my proposition is exactly the same as the reason I’m wanting that change. I hear you, but I can’t agree. The difference is, with my proposition, you may be forced to remain, but at least you’re getting rewarded. In my case, I’m not being rewarded, and I’m being forced all the same.
As I said, you don’t surrender or rage quit in any sport, why surrendering when there’s like 10 minutes left in a game?
No, not really. Mistakes aren’t the only way. Your team can simply manage to do it by playing together. You would abandon all possibility of winning just because you’re not guaranteed to have that possibility?
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I think there might be some reading comprehension problems, so this is getting pointless.
There are NO comeback mechanics other than the winning team screwing up. IF I’m on the loosing team and they have shown 0 signs of communication or teamplay and don’t have a lategame comp then I’m generally not interested in hanging around for 15-20 minutes hoping for a miracle.
There are some variables that can change this such as “casual” queue, having some people you know in the game, long queues, …
And to answer your question, if both teams know what they’re doing then with the way this game is set up I don’t think there’s any possibility of a comeback.
The lane becoming longer after 250 IS a comeback mechanic.
And comeback happens all the time, especially in incursion, despite the “no comeback mechanism”.
Why, because while there is no mechanism dedicated as a “comeback mechanism” on incursion, the evry fact that you’re levelling up but the sentry remains the same IS a hidden comeback mechanism, because it’s making it easier and easier to destroy the sentry in one single push compared to early game. That’s why so many latye push can turn the tables. There is no need for more than that.
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Again, you’re assuming that the winning team is somehow interested in finishing the game before the timer runs out. I honestly don’t see any reason ever to take that risk.
Get the lead and keep it. The fact that most people don’t seem to realize this is a different story.
There aren’t a lot of really competitive games being played but if you check the tournaments it’s pretty much looks like the team that gets the lead wins.
No, I’m not. If they don’t want to push forward, it’s even better, giving us the time to organise and push big time ourselves. the gap will be less large than if they keep pushing, which allows even more for one single push bringing back the situation in our favour. Again, a won game is a finished game. Till then, if you want to think it’s better to wait for the losing team to react after you too kthe lead , your problem. Saw so many teams lose by doing this. LAte game one single good push can down a sentry, yet your team is thinking somehow that this push will not happen and isn’t pushing to widen the gap and end the game. It’s a really risky bet.
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Not really, more control of the map is more shards, more xp/levels, more thralls, … If you sit back on your smaller part of the map you’re at a disadvantage that you won’t be able to make up until everyone hits 10, if you try to poke out we got the level and gear advantage. If you wait things out and go for a last minute all in push the winning team is closer and can just counter so again your point is moot.
If you want to see this in action watch any high level dota2 game where the team on the backfoot gets contained and starved out.
Organizing a bunch of randoms in this game is bloody impossible, in a 5 vs 5 premade situation people should be smart enough to make the right decisions.
Edit:
Regardless of the above when it’s random people vs random people it’s all up to luck on who screws up the most. If it’s my team and they don’t shows signs of improving the game turns into a waste of time.
How is it a waste of time? Just because you’re losing? So I suppose in sport they should surrender as well. I mean, if they feel they have no way to win, why continue, it’s a waste of time, right.
No, seriously now. You’re liking playing this game, right? If you like playing it, why is it that it require you winning or having a good chance to win to actually enjoy playing it? If you feel like you have less chance to win than to lose, then it’s not fun any more, it’s a waste of time and we should all surrender?
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If I’m playing a competitive game I play to win, not to run around and look at flowers.
If I’m playing starcraft 2 I’m not playing until my last drone dies, if you play dota2 you gg out pretty often before the throne goes down, … In most competitive rts games it’s even considered rude to drag out the game when you can’t come back.
This isn’t a tdm game where you just kill people, generally I’m playing for the object that’s all that matters to me, if it’s clear that we’re not getting that objective then what’s the point?
Oh really, it’s clear that you’re not getting it? Or it’s clear that you have low chances of getting it? And playing to win has nothing to do with surrendering. Right now, there’s that Euro 2016 for soccer, right. Don’t you think it’s competitive? Do you think the teams are not playing to win? Did you see a team surrendering midway after getting lead by 4-0? No.
I’ve been playing pvp games for like 16 + years and sorry, but trying to win until the end has never been rude. It’s laming (for example, discarding the win but trying to extend the duration of the game to make the opponent give up) that is regarded as rude. Like, hiding stuff here and there on the map without trying to win anymore.
BB has limited duration for each game (30 or 15) so such lame behaviour is out of question. Not surrendering isn’t regarded as rude at all.
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Guess we played different games then, coming from a rts and MOBA background it’s definitely an accepted thing for as long as I can remember. (E.g. see every broadcasted starcraft game ever)
Let’s go with the sport logic for a moment: If a team has a bad player, are they required to keep them playing? If a team member is injured and can no longer play, is the rest of the team required to play without that member or any other to replace him? No. As far as there being no surrenders, Boxing, MMA, and quite a few other sports have specific rules where people not even directly ENGAGED in the match can end it, even over the objection of the actual participant they support. Hell, that’s where the term “throw in the towel” comes from.
Actually, those are the cases when I want a surrender, and people ignore it. I don’t want to give up a match where we’re jsut BARELY losing. But FFS, when two people go double digit deaths before 10 minutes pass, Or when someone just is clearly NOT aware of how to play, I want out. I was in a game with a thorn. I’d died in a push along with a DPS, so it was 3v5. While our sentry was under attack by five other players, the genius Thorn was at the middle shard…shooting at a mikoshroom that was put there. Even when the Sentry BLEW UP, they didn’t turn around. They LEFT the shard(they didn’t actually TAKE the shard as well), and tried to solo push through their tunnel and tried to take their sentry solo. It’s stupidity like that which drives me to make a surrender.
But as I told someone else, I know I’m fighting a losing battle. Eventually, you’re gonna get your wish Zey. Gearbox will remove the surrender option. And I know that I and others will wash our hands of Battleborn after that. I am not here to be a punching bag for another team, because players on MY team decide to throw the fight by acting like idiots. When GBX takes out the ability to end a match with some kind of respect, and punishes people who actively disconnect, I’ll have zero desire to play it any further.
Rejected.
there is no such injury or situation ingame. And in a team, if you start a match and that someone in your team is bad, you can’t put it outside of your team until the match end, no. So you have to continue with him no matter what. Remember, peoples that are on the bench are still part of the team. So no, doesn’t work. [quote=“Khas, post:117, topic:1510480”]
ctually, those are the cases when I want a surrender, and people ignore it. I don’t want to give up a match where we’re jsut BARELY losing. But FFS, when two people go double digit deaths before 10 minutes pass, Or when someone just is clearly NOT aware of how to play, I want out. I was in a game with a thorn. I’d died in a push along with a DPS, so it was 3v5. While our sentry was under attack by five other players, the genius Thorn was at the middle shard…shooting at a mikoshroom that was put there. Even when the Sentry BLEW UP, they didn’t turn around. They LEFT the shard(they didn’t actually TAKE the shard as well), and tried to solo push through their tunnel and tried to take their sentry solo. It’s stupidity like that which drives me to make a surrender.
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Or you know, you have used the fact that you were dead and therefore had nothing else to do to communicate and stop them to do that… Except if you did it, why did you just stood here watching them? If they don’t know what they’re suppsoed to do, the fastest way they’ll know is by being informed of it… I won match against premade team with 2 complete beginners that didn’t know left to right in pvp (didn’t know how to take the thrall, didn’t know how to recall or that they could do it…) because we kept informing them of how to do thing and what not to do during the games with them. With the rematch, I played with those two 8 games in a row, we won 7 and loss the last one by a small margin…
Peoples are already washing their hands from battleborn due to the abuse of surrender you know.
Furthermore, while I said that surrender is not necessary, I do not mind fdor it to remain, as long as an incentive to not use it that often is put in place. What’s annoy me here is the complete abuse of it.
I often play a character that takes time before getting to its full potential (orendi, reyna, boldur, mellka). So peoples that look at the situation early will not see that and panic if the other peoples in the team aren’t doing that good either. But I know that I can carry quite a bit of team later on with the correct character, especially in incursion. Yet peoples won’t let me do that because they surrender early. OMG we’re lead in points by quite a bit/they have double of our kills! the situation is hopeless!
Well guess what, as Reyna after level 5 I just need one time to reverse the situation in incursion. As Orendi after level 5 I’ll probably go in a long kill streak and my current 1-1 will become a 15-1 or something. There you go, you’ll get your kill, you’ll get your points. So just.freaking.WAIT. But they don’t. Before you know it, while you’re in a middle a of a battle you’re informed that you have surrendered. NO, I HAVE NOT.
Do you realize how frustrating it can be for me when it happens so often? Should I really only play characters that are good starters just so that peoples don’t get scared by the early result? Seriously?
…what did you think i was doing? This is what really frustrates the hell out of me with the anti surrender crowd. That any bad play I bring up is somehow MY fault because i wasn’t being teacher and coach as well as a player. I shouldn’t have to TELL someone something that is flashing on the screen. The status of ALL sentries, allied and enemy, are at the top of the screen, and a big gold exclamation point flashes over one when its attacked
…what are you talking about? Reyna becomed a VERY serious dps threat after level 2 when her priority target makes her plasma blasts homing. Mellka is threatening from START, being able to trade in raged and melee, poison her target and jet in and out of mist fights. And…as you just said to me, if you’re talking to your ream, why are they voting for surrenders, when you can reassure them vocally tgat you will be coming on strong in the mid and late game?