Lack of build diversity in bl3 and ideas how to fix it

Having played borderlands 3 now for a decent sum of time I’ve come to realize my main issue in the game. That being creating and working on fun and varied builds.
Main issue being the lack of allegiance relics, and other weapon and element specific relics. For example things like the bone of the ancients, and stuff like that in bl2.
Other issue being the lack of fun and diverse purple rarity class mods or even blue class mods, that we had access to in bl2. For example the blurred trickster for maya, rogue for zero, grenider for axton, the deputies badge and so on. But with the new system for class mods in bl3 I feel limits the amount of builds i can create.
It’s no longer possible to create a build solely on a specific weapon type. And is now more focused on only being able to use specific skills that the class mod offer. Dont get me wrong I do enjoy the new effects that the legendary class mods offer but feel as if having both systems would open up more opportunities for builds giving me more of a reason to farm for new gear and experiment with my skill trees more.
Any thoughts or feel as if I left anything out that needs to be more in depth feel free to let everyone else know.

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I guess this depends on the player. I personally prefer trying out a couple of builds but my tendency is to focus on only one build. Make it strong. Reach its limits. Find the most perfect gear that I can to make this one build really strong.

Eventually I will or may hit a threshold or get bored. That would be the time I will investigate other builds. In my younger years I prefer to be a master of multiple builds - jack of all trades. But now I don’t care anymore. I focus on one and reach that with laser focus.

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I think the only major complaint I would have is that legendary relics don’t feel as beneficial as they did in BL2. Like if I get a legendary relic in BL3 the first thing i look at, even before which skills are boosted, are the stat modifiers.

For example, when I’m searching for a bloodletter class mod for my big shield/1hp Moze, it makes it a pain to find one that fits with the build I’m going for. I’m probably one of the few that enjoyed the simplicity of legendary class mods in BL2.

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I just want the absolute worst bugs involving skills and class mod effects to be fixed :frowning:

Agree that the non-legendary mods are really underwhelming with the current system we have. Would love to see purple/blue mods add extra skill points or have perks unique to that rarity to make them viable alternatives to legendary mods. Right now legendary mods have their unique effects, add the most skill points, and have the most perks–there’s no reason to choose anything else.

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I would really like to see more defensive aniontments. The siren has a decent one with damage reflection and lifesteal on ase is good but people feel discouraged from using it when compared to more offensive anointments. 5% of health on ase and 3% while clone is active seem subpar when compared to most Vault Hunter’s skills.
I would love to see an anointment with bullet reflection or short spurts of immunity or invisibility. I still use the heal 25% on ase terror anointment for my Fl4k to give them massive survivability, but I can’t farm that anymore.

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For the most part, I disagree. I remember once saying that I wanted even variety in stats for class mods and relics. I was wrong, because Gbx already did a pretty job covering necessary stats, and more relevantly, farming these stats already isn’t easy. So adding more stuff to farm, allegiance and weapon-specific relics, is a bad idea. Also, what you’re looking for is already there.

Let’s say you want to make a rocket launcher build. Well then, you’d need to find a class mod with+31% heavy weapon damage, +28% splash damage, and insert your choice, and a relic with +17% heavy damage, +33% AOE damage, and insert your choice. The problem is that the process of acquiring such items isn’t cut and dry like it predecessors. You’re at the mercy of RNG, even more so, and correct me if I’m wrong, that is what I think you’re criticizing. I wouldn’t necessarily say that it contributes to a lack of build diversity. I suppose if it was easier to find the right stat rolls, you’d have an easier time making more builds.

I agree about purple class mods being neglected. Reaching endgame is incredibly easy, so you end up not having to worry about farming them. Some of them are nice to have, because they can boost useful skill points, but generally a legendary class mod is better. I had an idea that the legendary effects could be combined with your purple class mods and that’d be your legendary class mod. They would be interchangeable parts. I have no idea how Gbx would support that. It is a dumb idea. Anyways, blue class mods being neglected is a product of them redesigning rarity of class mods. I’d say that getting a +5 skill points is now the equivalent. Gbx is eventually going to release more legendary class mods, so having purples and blues stick around might be problematic.

Most legendary class mods are decent and each class at least has one class mod that is good. What needs to be done is buffing the not so good ones. Cold Warrior, Techspert… Zane seems to have the most… Also, they shouldn’t have made Seein’ Dead so strong. It makes the other ones seem obsolete. Balancing legendary class mods would be nice, but there are other issues that hinder build diversity.

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Can you clarify what you mean here? AFAIK game does not actively prevent you from equipping 4 shotguns or whatever rocks your boat…

Heck, there is a guy in a parallel thread who is planning to run through entire TVHM with a single gun (Lucky 7).

Not saying its impossible to use a build with entirely or one weapon type, but instead trying to say there are no artifacts or class mods that help or benefit you in anyways for those specific weapons or manufacturers.

I see were you are coming from, so I should be more specific. There are good relics and class mods in the game that are near impossible to get the exact ones you want, whether it’s the correct stats or anointments. What I’d like would be a more straightforward approach to relics like bringing back allegiance relics, not saying the system we have isnt functional. It would just feel better to have a relic with preset stats and effects, rather than having to farm for a relic that might have a random prefix, suffix, stats, and anointments. And when it comes to the class mods I agree that the legendary ones are greate and there effects are fun and interesting, but having other options would help expand the games variety, rather than having a place holder till you acquire a legendary class mod.

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Ya I can see how focusing on one character is fun for some but for people like myself I find it difficult to play the same way everytime once i feel like I achieved what I wanted with said characters. So having more options for builds and weapons, ext to work towards is the one thing that keeps bringing me back to the game. As of right now that’s just what this game lacks for me, I’ve tried many different gear related builds but they have all had one flaw that being the synergies between the current relics and class mods.

Now I am confused: what about all these class mods that give “+45% on Atlas critical hits”, “+28% Shotgun damage”? There is a reason folks brag about getting FL4K COM with “+45% Jakobs damage”, “+30% pistol damage”, because it’s so good specifically for Maggie or any other Jakobs gun, pistols in particular.

Don’t remember on top of my head whether relics give manufacturer/gun type-specific boosts, they probably do as well.

I get what you’re saying. I think we both can agree that the current system has too many RNG layers. However, we don’t see eye to eye on how it should be resolved. I think the game could benefit from a crafting system that allowed players to change one aspect of an item, but they can only keep changing that one selection. It’d be a good balance between having to farm and getting what you want. I don’t see Gbx reverting back to BL2’s system. It’s possible and I wouldn’t mind it. But, I think it’s more work than necessary.

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Your correct in saying that there are stats on artifacts that boost specific weapons and manufacturers but what I’m saying and sry for not being to clear, are there arnt any artifacts specifically made by the manufacturer that have flat/permanent stats tied to the artifacts. For example let’s say there was a torgue artifact that always has let’s say, increased rocket speed, explosive damage ect… that’s tied to a prefix then you get the suffix and other things random.

I agree I cant say that either system is better, and it’s mostly me seeing the game with rose tinted glasses. So your right that my main issue is the rng with the artifacts and other gear in the game that makes it seem like I have less options.

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Don’t forget that allegiance relics in bl2 did more than just boost damage or overall damage. They boosted mag size, fire rate and reload of specific manufacturers as well. And while the current artifacts do include those kinds of bonuses, what op is getting at is that they were all bonuses wrapped in one package for each manufacturer.

Another thing that bl2 had that this game doesn’t is ammo pool size relics. Something I miss dearly now that I try to make m4 sniper builds on any vh other than moze. Same for shotgun/rocket launcher builds too. The ammo drop and ammo crate system in this game, unlike bl2, doesn’t seem more likely to drop missing ammo but totally random ammo drops instead, even in solo. It may be an oversight, but I really believe it’s to push weapon diversity over relying on a single weapon type. Which is fine overall, but when we hit end game and have shotgun builds to try out on the most difficult setting it becomes frustrating.

The artifacts in this game seem to focus more on the cool new mechanics in this game and seem to be balanced around them like slide, slam and melee with a few exceptions. And while that is great, it does tend to really lend no hand to build diversity or singular build types outside of those mechanics. Snowdrift speed builds and infinite ammo/health with Facepuncher are pretty much the meta and only real interactions we get for the artifacts core effects outside of their additional stats.

There are a lot of choices made in this game in the name of diversity that come close to, but never really pushes that envelope with a little extra pizzazz that could really make and shape builds. Not saying bl2 had that, but this game could, so it’s sometimes kinda disappointing, just my opinion though.

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I miss having the name of your class mod next to your player icon, little nit picky but it was cool to see if a Siren was running say a Legendary cat class mod or a legendary nurse class mod

Same here… Plus, I am not all that inclined or adept at figuring out certain synergies. I tend to just try and make the most powerful VH I can and move on to the next. Off topic, but I have been having terrible difficulty finding the motivation to try and optimize Fl4k after spending a LOT of time getting gear for Zane. Probably just a little burn out.