Let's face it Borderlands will never be difficult

I see a lot of people say they need a challenge or the difficulty needs be increased but can never really elaborate on how to do this. Right now “difficulty” seems to be to just up HP of enemies and make them deal more damage, but even if all enemies one shot you and needed a whole ammo pool to kill the game would not be difficult. You just need to sit behind the right wall or rock and have patience. Even Malawian Takedown M4 is pretty easy if you just take your time and go slow.

Real difficulty IMO would be to improve AI, flanking, swap weapons, sneaky suicide bombers, snipers that don’t run up and melee you, but all that is way easier said then done and I just can’t see it being implemented, therefore borderlands will never truly be difficult.

Credit where credit is due though the bosses in this game do a pretty good job of it, having dodge-able high damage moves if you pay attention to the ground and their actions. Only downside is this is Borderlands, so your most likely using builds that melt bosses in 1-5 seconds and never really get to experience their whole move set more then your first play through.

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You want to up the difficulty, hire some really good AI programmers and start using human-like AI with the enemies. Right now the enemies still have the same AI that you would find in first person shooters from the late 1990s. They’ve only recently learned how to duck behind cover, which was a major gameplay element in the 2006 release of Gears of War. There are online shooters with bots which are virtually indistinguishable from human players. Try a mob of 20 of those and see if the game is a bit more difficult.

This game could easily be almost unplayably difficult with just an AI improvement. Unfortunately Gearbox only knows how to increase health, armor, and shields, and nerfing anything that works well. That’s their only way of increasing difficulty.

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completely agree, but i dont think borderlands 3 needs it until the weak stuff get buffed to be usable .

the few fight in borderlands that takes skill imo , i would say crawmerax and op10 voracidous with a controller .

They’ve been doing that - or certain enemy classes anyway - since at least BL2. That and the “run away fast as soon as player goes into FFYL” are the most common gripes I’ve seen on these forums.

Also, difficulty is highly individual. What is difficult for one person may well be easy for another, and impossible for a third. A more accurate thread title would be “Borderlands will never be difficult for some players”.

It’s not like we haven’t had these discussions before. This is what, the fourth thread to touch on this topic since December?

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I’m sure once they do that there is a Nobel prize, Fields medal, or Turing award in there somewhere (that’s a pretty hard problem). :wink:

Joking aside, you are effectively asking BL to be more realistic shooter, and I’m not sure that’s exactly the category they are going for.

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OMG this.

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Point is that’s 1990s and early 2000s AI. You won’t find enemies in this game working together. You won’t find one or two enemies using rocket launchers to lay down cover fire while a small group flanks you behind cover without firing until you’re out in the open. You won’t find them coordinating attacks with each other, all staying hidden behind cover and then popping out all at once. You won’t find them baiting you into traps.

Common enemies have one of two basic reactions. They either stand in basically the same place or walk in little circles and shoot at you, maybe ducking behind cover once in a while if it’s close, or they walk or run straight at you. They all act as individuals, so a mob really is just that, a mindless mob, not a group of enemies working together. Zombies with guns, that’s all they are.

And that’s not even AI. That’s a scripted reaction to a specific event. An If/Then instruction. An example of AI would be if it started to run and then ducked behind the nearest cover and lobbed grenades at you while you were in FFYL.

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I’m not interested in a challenge, and this game is frequently more difficult than I’d like. Was just doing Slaughterstar 3000 with a friend earlier today on M1 and we both got killed in round 4. Too rough.

(And when we dove back in the game got confused and released the waves one after the other before they were finished, unleashed the final round bosses before round 4 was completed, and then gave us the bonus loot and said to turn in the mission while we were fighting the bosses…)

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You don’t have to kill the final bosses to complete slaughterstar. Just the final wave. If you want help hmu on Xbox.

GT: Facehuggybear

Smiles in Hyperius nova attack

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Lets face it, you should maybe play a different game…?
Lets be honest. Borderlands was allways that way. And i absolutly love the game for that.
You want more difficulty (or a different way of difficulty better said)?
Search yourself one of the thousand shooter games out there and play it. (Or play it pvp, so you have your group thinking and realistic moveset for your enemys)
But thats just not what bl is or ever will be.
The difficulty hear is to find your own build, your own weapons, etc. to be able to take out mobs/bosses without hiding behind a rock and wait for 30minutes… having fun tuning every skill point you spend, every gear you equip
I personally like this. And thats why i play borderlands. If you like it too, thats nice. If you dont like it, stop spaming the forum with the same thing over and over again and play a different game that you like

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The difficulty is almost entirely based on build and gear. Example… when M4 came out, people were saying it was too difficult and “bullet spongy”, etc… now people are saying that it’s too easy. The only thing that changed is that people improved their gear with anointments, new coms, weapons, etc…

Many of the people that are complaining it’s too easy now, are people that actively seeked out meta builds on youtube, and downloaded and stripped gear from .sav files as a shortcut. Now it’s too easy.

When M5/UVHM/new DLCs/whatever is next comes out all this will happen all over again. It’s the same cycle that has happened since BL2.

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You’ve got the wrong idea sir I don’t want it to be difficult, I am making this point in the hopes to see an end to the lets make this harder argument by showing how futile it is. I agree with you Borderlands is not the game you should be getting if you want that type of challenge. I play it to melt faces with crazy guns and if it were that I would still be playing, but apparently balance is more important.

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As one of the people that miss certain challenges from borderlands 2 I don’t think that’s the case. I did some research the other day, I was looking for a solo raid Fl4k similar to mine. I didn’t find any spot on but some close ones I could take a few notes on.
What became apparent very quickly is the people using these builds consistently have issues using the build, primarily because they can’t push our the same damage as modded gear, lulz.
My Fl4k has several builds I’ve made that would like the taste of a seemingly impossible battle at firs or a real invisible.

Your statement here is the best example to me of why difficulty is subjective and why it’s okay that some of the “top” players find the game too easy. I personally find M1 wayyy too easy. This is why I am very happy to see that they’re considering more mayhem levels. I wanna be pushed further and the fact that some people have to dial it back tells me that I’m more skilled than I thought.

When @jgartenbenz and other players like them point out that they’re still having trouble and finding it challenging, it tells me that I’m doing well, and it should tell the top tier players the same (imho). This isn’t a dog on the “not as good” players because the better players should all realize they were there before. It also gives the “better” players a chance to offer help and advice to new players and build a community, something I personally think are extremely socially valuable in gaming.

It reminds me of when I played non stop dark souls. Minus the few a**holes, the general community was and still is very supportive of struggling players, as long as they keep trying. Also, even when struggling players complain, the community will often find ways to give good advice (I mean yes and also tease people to git gud). I don’t know about you, but the souls series is considered one of the hardest games of this generation and I find it easy now…so do top tier YouTubers.

Anyways, the thesis here is that Gearbox has created a wider range of difficulty than I think the generally highly skilled players on the forum realize, and that’s good. I’m personally hopeful that they continue to challenge us as they further support the game.

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Just because someone doesn’t like the harder difficulties, doesn’t mean that they shouldn’t exist. Just because someone else doesn’t like the easier difficulties, doesn’t mean that they shouldn’t exist. Neither of the factions or game modes mentioned is harmed by the existence of the other faction or game mode.

If someone doesn’t like the higher difficulty levels of the game, they don’t have to play it. And vice versa.

Lots of people like Borderlands 3 for lots of different reasons. Catering to as many of those people’s different tastes is just smart game design and, furthermore, smart business.

Seems pretty straightforward to me.

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Until content gets locked therein, that is…

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If you ain’t dying you ain’t trying.

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That is fair. That was not a good decision.