Lore Challenges: Why PVP?

Only problem I have with the lore is your unlocks are based on players preference one char galilea needs 25 ambra kills I’m 23 hrs playedinto game completed story been doing PvP around 30ish matches have seen 0 and on top of that the kill challenges only count if you land a killing blow the only people that have attained those type of lores have basically messaged enemy player and ask them to sit there and give them the kills

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Im with you. I do play pvp but im more of a solo/ story person. It would be nice if we can unlock these challenges while playing with bots.

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In fact I’ve killed Galilea at least as often as she kills me, Ambra is one of the few who have a reasonable chance against her. If you wait for the right moment that is. I bet that’s even more frustrating to a Galilea player. lol

I totally agree.

Don’t get me wrong; I’m sure that I’ll try out pvp somewhere in the future, but for now I’d really just like to enjoy the epi gameplay while the fixes and balances are being implemented. Aside from that, having to do pvp matches just to complete my lore challenges feels a little… stifling. Like I get it, but I really don’t feel that the lore challenges should be mode-specific when every player is different. That’s just my two cents.

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I’m glad that I’ve struck a chord with so many people. Support from people like you is welcome indeed.

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Chiming in another agreement here. I don’t hate PvP, but it’s not really what I play for (I am not good at it and I know it and I feel like I just get in the way), and some of these lore achievements are just so specific that having to do them in random PvP is very difficult. As people have said, the ‘kill x player y times’ ones don’t just require you to kill that character, first you have to find the character, while playing as a character you may or may not be skilled with if you’re only doing it for the unlock, then you need to be good enough to manage to kill them - which you might not be if you’re only playing the character hoping for the challenge credit - and then you have to do this in multiple matches if you aren’t good enough to get 25 kills against that one player in one match. This sounds like a recipe for frustration for the player trying to do the unlocking, the player being ganged up on an entire match because someone needs to kill them for unlocks, and the teams involved who have a player less invested in helping their team than they are killing this one dude over and over and over again.

On top of that, if there is a single bot in the game it doesn’t count for challenges. So I can’t even, say, get a gang of my friends together for a bunch of private matches so we can all work on our lore unlocks today - because there are not ten of us. We would have to go into public matches, and disrupt things even more, because now you have 2-3 people per team only working on lore unlocks and not actually playing a competitive game. I just think this’d frustrate the true PvPers as much as it’d frustrate me, a mostly PvE player who’s just getting in everybody’s way even more than usual with my lack of skill and only-being-here-for-the-unlock-ness.

I totally get making some things PvP-only, and I even get not wanting to allow XP or challenge grinding in bot matches so that people can’t just ‘cheese XP’. But I really feel like instead of encouraging non-PvPers to try the PvP in a way they will enjoy, this forces us to do it with characters we may or may not enjoy playing (but may still care about the lore of), in a way that distracts from teamwork and in a way sort of encourages player griefing (I’m not going to want to go into a match playing one of these need-to-be-killed-for-a-challenge characters out of fear I’ll just spend the whole thing being ganked). I don’t know, maybe they could allow reduced rewards against bots? Maybe if you’re in a bot match a kill only gives .5 credit towards the achievement, so that there’s still incentive to PvP but you have the option not to? I’ve heard there’s already been talk about doing that for bot-match XP rewards. I don’t know if that’s a good fix or not, but I’d be cool with something like that.

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This game is largely marketed for multiplayer. It makes sense that there are lore challenges that are multiplayer specific. It’s not like any of them are extremely difficult.

The one you mention is to kill 25 Oscar Mikes as Whiskey Foxtrott…in 9/10 games the enemy team has an Oscar Mike, it’s not that hard.

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I absolutely love your point, I was going to make it in the original post (but i was already at a full ramble at that point) as it reminded me of those old achievelments on xbox that required you to do something special on kill (Ones I remembered were Rocket Launcher a guy that just respawned and Teabag the same corpse X times) that needed to be removed because of how toxic they made multiplayer. Obviously this is much less extreme but its really in their best interest to keep story players that only want achievements out of multiplayer.

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While that may be the case for Oscar Mike and Whiskey Foxtrot, it isn’t the case for Galilea and Ambra. I hardly see Ambra and when I do, usually I am not playing Gal. Then I have to kill her but I always end up getting assist over actual kills. It’s super frustrating. If they made it so any character can kill Ambra or have assist count too, it would help a lot.

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There’s a larger issue with kill x player lore challenges, and it’s that you cannot ensure the other side has the hero you want. Then what do you do? You can’t leave and requeue cause you have to wait for the mission to complete due to how the game queueing system is set up, so all you can so is wait, or play a match that doesn’t help with the challenge at all, just for another chance to requeue, which again, you cannot ensure the other side has the hero you want, again.

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I’d like “have a hand in killing X” more than “kill X”. That makes sense.

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I really HATE* PVP content and games in general, so yeah - this irks me as well.

It’s not even just the lore challenges, there are a TON of challenges in general that can ONLY be completed in PVP!

And no - I am not referring to the “Versus” section - TONS of the “Buildables” section can ONLY be done in PVP, because the Story Missions lack spots to complete them at…

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They should have locked the lore behind character rank. The challenges are so unbalanced between different characters, and the fact that a GBX game (which, let’s face it, a lot of us bought because of their fantastic character design and humorous storytelling) is locking their characters lore behind anything at all is pretty atrocious. Not to mention the fact that the “lore” is nothing more than some crappy mission reports that really do nothing to flesh out any characters at all. I’m very disappointed with how they’ve handled the story and character’s backstories

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I am fairly sure that the idea behind the PvP lore challenges is to make the PvE crowd try the PvP. Because clearly we don’t know what we want!

It also comes with the advantage (from a design perspective) that the PvE players will serve to populate the matchmaking queues. When you are in a PvE queue and you get only 3 people, the game eventually throws you all into the game anyway. You can play despite of not having a full team.
This is not so in PvP: you need 10 people available for the queue. If the PvE guys stay in PvE land, they can’t contribute! And we can’t have that.

Though, in all honesty, I doubt enough PvE players care about the lore enough to actually go through it. Which means that if the previous paragraph is the actual reason, then it’s incredibly ineffective.

Maybe the challenges should have, just like the characters, two ways to unlocking them? Character rank, or a challenge? Or perhaps a PvE challenge AND a PvP challenge. Then everyone gets the lore eventually without having to play in a mode they do not like.

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I agree with both sides, but i find it unfair, that not every char has a pvp lore challenge, because some chars like oscar mike has way easier requirements for his lore than galilea.

If every battleborn got the same challenge or quite the same it would be fair, because its imbalanced if you got lores for battleborn like oscar mike or marquis faster as than oterhs

I also feel like the lore challenges should be roughly comparable.
You can almost get every challenge for Miko in a single campaign run-through.
Thorn, however, has a bunch of overly complicated BS… I mean. Get 20 jump-shot kills with Volley?! Come on! I don’t even play Thorn and I know that’s ridiculous.

If they want to “force” PvE players to try online PvP, that’s fine. But let them grind out their challenges however they want. Plus: “To unlock the final lore challenge, you must play at least 1 game online”. Problem solved.

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They should let you get some challenges against bots, some are way way too hard to do and give a bad unqiue legendary.

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/agreed

One of Boldur’s law challenges is to play a match with an entire Eldrid team. This could probably be done in PvE, but it still forces you to take part in something you may not want to do; scour the forums for randoms to help you get a lore achievement. I have a couple of friends that play, and I’m perfectly happy playing with them or solo. I will never unlock that lore (unless it happens by chance) because I’m simply not going to spend time organising random people to group up with me.

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I looked at the Steam achievements and not a single character had an unlock achievement over 1%, so I think it’s high time to remove the PVP requirements. I like the lore because it adds a bit of flavor to the characters, but I do not like PVP and have no interest in playing it. So, yeah, remove the PVP requirements GBX!

Hey @JoeKGBX, can we get some feedback on this? Thanks.

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I’m on board with this as well. I like solo play. The story and characters/campaign is why I bought this game. I like solo pvp against bots too. If playing against AI counted towards the lore challenges (they do not appear to since I have done this a few times and my VS stats are all at 0), then I wouldn’t really care.

I do understand the pvp is a large part of this game as well. I just feel we shouldn’t be penalized for preferring solo or playing pvp solo with all bots (which is pretty fun in its own right).

Having solo pvp matches with AI count would resolve this in my mind.

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