M10 solo Takedown Confirmed - never again!

Finally managed to finish the new Guardian Takedown, alone (because I couldn’t trust the game not to crash) in M10. It was a nightmare to play, honestly.
It wasn’t so much the enemies, which were tough, but that most of my deaths were due to platforming issues and twice my game crashed while fighting the final boss.

There was a point where you have to jump between three platforms and leap down a tube. That was perfect. You can skip the fighting, if you platform well. If you fall, you have to fight some enemies and try again. That’s how the platforming should have been, thoughout the whole thing. Punishing, but not forcing you to start again if your character fails to mantle or a jump-pad messes up.
I liked the mechanics of most of the Takedown, but it was WAY too punishing and took too long, with no way to save progress in the event of a crash.
As for rewards, I was lucky enough to get a Smog and a lightspeed grenade, everything else was trash. If it wasn’t for the fact that there’s unique loot, I wouldn’t have bothered to finish it, (except maybe for bragging rights) and now I don’t plan to try it again, as is. Ever.
I just don’t find these raids fun. I’d rather replay side missions and do some mobbing. Looking forward to the next DLC, but in the meantime I’m sticking to leveling up new characters and avoiding mayhem mode.


Interested to hear everyone else’s views on takedowns.

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I really like the boss fights in new takedown. I do think that some tweaks are needed to make it enjoyable though.

There should be checkpoints after both crystal challenges. This takedown is so long that crashes and getting booted due to connection issues can ruin a whole night of gaming with friends even if everyone is a super-leet expert with top-tier gear.

Bizarrely the result is to actually discourage team attempts - and this is a takedown with mechanics designed to reward teamwork!

The spawn rate at crystal challenges needs to be slightly reduced. Guardians respawn so fast that it almost doesn’t matter how fast you can kill stuff*. I soloed with my bullet witch Amara and it genuinely didn’t matter what the Mayhem level was; even one-shotting everything with Recursion couldn’t overcome the respawn rate.

*Yes, with aggro-drawing techniques like Gamma Red Fang Fl4k this is not an issue.

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Positives:

I love the boss fights, even the immune phases don’t irk me as much as other bosses’ do.
Map looks fantastic.
Music’s great too!
I like the charge-the-crystals mechanic.

Negatives:

The enemy HP (being addressed soon, so whew.)
The crystal parts, especially the first one for me, are more difficult than the boss fights. I’m hopeful that this is also something that gets tuned in a hotfix.
The freakin’ platforming, and the huge risk it brings. It’s kinda cruel, especially the last sets near the end. I’m kinda hoping for a “finish the mobs, a stable light bridge forms instead of moving platforms” change in certain platform areas, but we’ll see.

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“More checkpoints” was a complaint in the maliwan takedown. Don’t understand why it wasn’t implemented in this one. There should be a checkpoint before each boss, so you don’t have to re-run the map to get to them each time.

Yeah, I think they were good, though they had too many immune phases and just repeated the same thing over and over. Could have done with a little more changing things after each immune phase.

This is honestly the biggest complaint I have. The game crashing so often, especially in co-op, ruins the fun.

I agree. I liked the low-grav elements, and platforming, I just think they needed to ensure you weren’t punished as harshly for missing a jump or whatever. Even just have falling teleport you back up and suffer a health penalty (-10% hp, or something). But, I’d prefer that you fell into a pit of enemies that you had to fight your way out of, rather than just instant death.

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I actually don’t object to the immunity phases for new Takedown bosses because you actually have to do something other than just wait.

With first boss you have to reposition and do some platforming. Slightly repetitive; if I were designing it I might have reduced the number of cycles by having those phases at 1/2 way through each bar instead of 1/3.

With the final boss, the phases give you chances to kite the suicide Guardians toward the boss in order to knock him out of immunity and deal significant damage to the boss. This is a smart way to do immunity because you can actually do something strategic to help you kill the boss faster and preserve a bit of ammo. So on this one I wouldn’t change a thing.

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With the final boss, the phases give you chances to kite the suicide Guardians toward the boss in order to knock him out of immunity and deal significant damage to the boss

you can do that? interesting. I did not know they caused damage to their own side

That was an ok takedown though I felt some sequences were too long, particularly the last boss is boring I found Wotan more interesting than this one, it is a tad repetitive and not very inspired.

crystals are ok once you figured a method: mine is to tank with rad launcher/red suit or shock launcher/transformer waiting for the first one to be charged then alternate between the two remaining ones, and there is no problem.
As a Zane user platforming is greatly simplified by using clone as checkpoint :rofl: falling off? no problem just switch with the clone and you can learn the jumps without stress.

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Each immunity phase should spawn two suicide guardians. You kite one suicide Guardian to him then get it to explode right next to him while he charges the exploding orb, then kite the other to him and blow it up. This can be done with any character but might be harder with Moze. The first stops the immunity phase, cancels the nova, and stuns; the second one does actual damage.

Love having clone swap as insurance for platforming. Might try that while I’m learning the techniques for skips! (There are lots of move speed shenanigans that allow you to skip some of the platforming entirely and speed up the run. Zane and Driver Amara can do them without Speed Demon modifier.)

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Thanks for pointing that out now he is even easier than he was. The nova was the only threat he posed disrupting it is pretty cool

got a smog this time

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I finally solo’d the Guardian Takedown on M10 last night using my Rakk build Fl4k (for those of you that don’t play Fl4k, one of the squishier builds among the VHs). I use the word “finally” not because I have really tried that hard, but I use “finally” in the sense that it just TAKES. SO. LONG.

I probably did about 10 attempts over the last week or so, and because each failed attempt seems to take at least 30-45 minutes, it is really time-consuming (as everyone knows) and, frankly, just kind of boring.

Out of my approximately 10 total attempts, they broke down about like this:

-5 either ended with me falling off an unseen ledge or missing a mantle onto a floating platform

-3 runs ended with me being hit by Anathema’s radiation explosion while in mid-air after using the jump pad, and then falling into the void while in FFYL (really dumb mechanic that forces the player to decide whether you should try to go for the jump pad or stay in the radiation bubble and hope you can get a second wind)

-1 run ended by being knocked back by a Guardian off of Scourge’s platform

-1 successful run (did not get ONE SINGLE DLC WEAPON AT ALL! WTF!)

Note that there were no runs where I died to enemies. That seems sort of paradoxical to me for a raid in a BL game.

@hovismetaphor55 Regarding your OP, I am pretty sure I am with you - I may try playing or even soloing the GTD again at some point, but I don’t think it will be any time soon.

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-3 runs ended with me being hit by Anathema’s radiation explosion while in mid-air after using the jump pad, and then falling into the void while in FFYL (really dumb mechanic that forces the player to decide whether you should try to go for the jump pad or stay in the radiation bubble and hope you can get a second wind)

I learned the hard way that when you don’t have the time to jump waiting for the explosion is always the good choice, the boss permanently summons mobs so… Roughly and assuming you don’t waste time: if by your second jump you still land on a platform with an explosion brewing just wait and go FFYL

And yeah this takedown is all about puzzle and platforming, I agree that the enemies are really a low threat contrary to Maliwan takedown

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I am assuming that you noticed that once Anathema goes immune, there are beacons showing you the platforms where the radiation bubbles will summon? By the time you get Anathema down to his shield bar (the bottom bar, not the top two yellow armor bars), ALL of the platforms have radiation bubbles on them, so you cannot avoid the bubbles at that point and WILL go down. That is the mechanic that I am referencing as kind of dumb.

I found the better strategy is not to even try to move platforms at that point anyway. Just make sure you have your anointments up (or whatever damage trigger your character uses) when the radiation bubble closest to Anathema goes off, and then hope you can get that second wind.

But maybe I missed something strategy-wise and what I am saying above really is not the case. The above is what I was able to figure out in my attempts.

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So finally managed to take it down today and got a shock Globetrotter. Won’t be doing this again until they get something done about the platform sections. When playing in a duo co-op and when person falls it’s just so unforgiving. Hopefully they address this with checkpoints or something because as is right now I don’t plan to do this anymore until falling is more forgiving.

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I tried to pay more attention, and I confirm it is still possible to escape when he is down to his shield bar at least on the first quater of the bar. Then I got knocked out of arena once again which is personnaly my main issue here, so I can t tell right now if the number of novas can still augment. It seems to be one nova per bar down


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@olivier_shady Hmmm - possibly? I mean obviously that is the case in the picture you took, but I have never seen that to be the case in my attempts. And I have done the same thing you did; i.e., go into photo mode when the radiation novas are “blooming.”

So perhaps it is possible on that last shield bar to find the correct platform to jump to that does not have the nova bloom, but I still would contend that the more reliable strategy is just to go down near Anathema, and that way you basically are guaranteed a second wind instead of having the possibility of falling into the void while trying to escape the novas.

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I agree you have to be super quick so it is probably best to go for second wind. I never managed to escape them 100% anyway. Though on a game design point of view this really sucks if you have novas on all platforms it means the springs that triggers especially in this phase are useless, imo that would even qualify as ticket material for bug.

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It definitely took me 4 or 5 attempts to figure out what was happening in that arena. It wouldn’t be so frustrating if you didn’t have to play for 15-20 minutes just to get to that point. It’s not like Hyperius, Vora, Gee, Terra, etc., where you can do the boss over and over again to figure out the mechanics, and then once you die you can try again quickly. That seems to me to be the “poor design” part of the raid.

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I’ve seen a video showing the Anathema fight, and it recommended keeping her on the middle platform. When you take down a portion of her bar, and she goes immune, run to the opposite corner (from wherever she is) and hide behind the jump-pad thing. It’s risky, due to enemies with knockback attacks, but better than getting caught in midair by an attack.

Yeah, the first time I reached her, I was trying to second wind each time, rather than avoiding her attack, but there’s too many and my FFYL meter ran out too fast.

Yeah, this is one of the most frustrating parts. There should be a checkpoint right before the boss, so you feel comfortable playing around and testing out the mechanics, instead of worrying about having to start from scratch if anything goes wrong.
It’s made more frustrating when you consider that there’s a platform before you face Anathema, with 2 vending machines, which would be the perfect place for a checkpoint, but there isn’t one there. That’s just bad design, as you say.

Note: I did explore a little, and found several hidden chests inside the takedown, including a couple on the platform with the vending machines, but since the chests mostly give out weapons and they aren’t scaled to mayhem, I felt like there wasn’t much point to opening them. Why bother hiding stuff in a map that punishes you for exploring by making you restart if you fall, if the rewards aren’t even worth having, let alone worth the risk??

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To be clear, my strategy is to avoid the novas until I get to the shield (final) bar, and then I start going down for the novas at that point.

I haven’t watched any videos on this, but I tried the middle platform strategy because it was the first thing that occurred to me to try. I did not find that to be a great strategy though. I just found whichever platform you are on during the shield bar, it works best to just stay there.

@hovismetaphor55 I found those 2 hidden chests on the platform down to Anathema also. It made me wonder whether it occurred to them that, at least at this point, no one at all cares that they are there.

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I find it odd that people die to this. Try that: if he gets ready to explode, jump up (any platform, doesn’t matter) and if his primary bubble explodes just jump back. The delays between the primary and secondary bubbles is so big, that you have more than enough time to jump back.

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This only works if you are close to the jump pad when you get him immune. So for me, less than 50% of the time. The delay is a few seconds at most. More than enough for Amara or Zane, not nearly enough for Fl4k or Moze.

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