Make Kleese a full fledged healer

A couple of points before I begin:

  1. In the current meta, healer from level 1 is essential. A team without a healer is at huge disadvantage against a team with a healer because of one simple reason: team with a healer has no downtime due to health lost during the fight. A player that lost his health and has no healer in his team needs to either recall to base (costing time and his absence to his team), or to hug the healing buildable at his base, which sosts credits to build, even more credits to heal effectively, and is easily accessed and destroyed by enemy team. Damaged player in a team with a healer only needs to spend 5-10 seconds around his healer to get his full health back. Teams with healers are much more fit because they can apply and sustain pressure more effectively and consistently. Which leads to the next point.
  2. The game is starved for healers. Taking into the account the previous point, there is only 2 actual out of the box (this means from level 1) healers. When healers provide such huge advantage that you essentially feel like you handicapping your team when you don’t pick one, just 2 healers is a poor choice. There needs to be more actual healers.
  3. Lets be real. No one in their right mind would level anything other than “Don’t Call it a Heal Chair” on level 5. The helix upgrade is too valuable on it’s own, and the alternatives are not even trying to compete. And I don’t think they ever could, given the usefulness and utility the heal aura provides. There is no point in trying to nerf/buff anything within this choice, because you’ll either render something overpowered, or utterly useless.

And, what it all boils down to for me:
Adjust Kleese’s healing aura and make it his default feature.

My proposition is roughly this:
He will have this healing aura by default, it will heal something like 35+5 per level (that’s 80hp/sec at level 10) health each second to nearby allied battleborn, and it will SPLIT the healing among the nearby battleborn that have health to heal. So, if alone damaged battleborn is standing nearby, he will be healed for the full value per second, if there are two hurt battleborn, they both will be healed, but healing potency will halved, and so on.

What do you think?

I disagree. Kleese is a late-game tank/support. Doing this would utterly destroy the current strategic playstyle that Kleese employs and render him more godly than pre-nerf Ambra or Galilea, every team will have a Kleese. As it is, Kleese takes a surprising level of skill to master and his usefulness on a team is unparalelled, making him any better than he already is would break the game wide open then we’d have another character to whinge about being “OP”

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It feels to me like you didn’t read my post to understand enough what I’m suggesting.

Right now, everyone is always leveling heal on level 5, it’s only right thing to do. ALL Kleeses have 120 hp/second heal arua starting from level 5. No sane person would ever level any other helix on level 5.

What I suggest is that he has this ability by default, but instead of 120hp/second he would be healing 35+5*lvl, and the healing would be split amongs the people. That means that by the level 5, new Kleese would be healing 55hp/sec split among the nearby allies (55hp/sec for a single ally, 22hp/sec for 2 allies, 18hp/sec for 3 allies, etc.), and by the level 10 the healing amount would be 80hp/sec split among healed allies. That’s 40hp/sec less than current Kleese is healing starting from level 5, and he doesn’t splits his healing among people, he heals all nearby allies equally.

The only advantage of what I’m suggesting is that Kleese wouldn’t have to wait for level 5 to get access to the healing he’ll be getting anyway, and that he could be picked in place of Miko or Ambra for that regard. (Well that, and also the fact that he will have some actual helix choices at level 5 now :D)

Could you explain how that would make him OP?

Don’t get me wrong, but I love Kleese. Super easy to play as and is OP as hell. But. The heal at lvl 5 is strong as hell so i can understand why they would wait to give it to him and why it wouldn’t be something you start with. If anything I wish they would make it to where Kleese could heal himself or something because when you are the only one on the time and you are fighting Rendain. Everyone else has full heal and theres Kleese throwing down rift after rift just to try and keep his shield up so he doesn’t lose that last bit of HP. Perhaps they can make it so that the Rifts heal kleese at least a LITTLE bit of heal or something.

Man, is it really that hard to read? I never proposed to give it to him in the current state, I proposed to give it to him in adjusted state, in which - you can find if you’ll actually take some time to read my post.

Also, that healing options kills any kind of variety in choice at level 5, which is also bad.

Unlike Miko and Ambra, kleese is a big bodied target who has no reliable way to self heal. So if he’s rolling next to some giving them heals like you’re saying he can get picked off very easy and have little escape. The character was built to be a shield builder and shield destroyer. He does that well. I don’t think you should try to fundamentally change the type of character he is.

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Again and again - I DON’T. He is already what I am suggestig, just from level 5 and much stronger.

Since none of kleeses other skills buff his healing than it wouldn’t make much sense to give him this skill as a base. He can’t buff it or focus skills towards making him a “full fledged healer” he’d just be passively healing all the time. Other healers can spec into skills that buff their healing abilities. Kleese couldn’t do that unless you rework his entire helix. So making him a full fledged healer doesn’t simply necessitate giving him this healing passive your suggesting. Now if you wanted to say his tasers could be used on teammates to heal and cost chair energy to use that’s making him a more committed full fledged healer. That change would solve all three issues you discussed but just slapping a very weak passive heal on doesn’t do that

You can simply put a heal mod on the place where this helix previously was. Adding heal to his taser would simply make him another Miko.

If you give him his chair healing at base you can just push people in from the beginning. All the healers in the game have to focus off damaging enemies to heal. You’re suggesting kleese shouldn’t have to stop focusing damage in order to heal by design. In the end, it sounds like you have an issue with one of his skills rather than the character in general. No one picks the alternate helix augment because it is only useful if you die. (The mutation is kinda useful). Their are plenty of characters and helix options that are so good there are no other alternatives (ex. OM napalm, ambra flame shield movement speed buff) I don’t think your reasoning that this one skill is always picked means it should just become a part of the character is sound for such a reason.

How do you consider Kleese to be a tank?

His shield capacity increases with every level and Energy Rifts keep his shield up. Early game Kleese is fodder, late game he draws aggro and is very difficult to kill. Thus, tank :slight_smile:

Can’t say I’ve ever seen Kleese as difficult to kill, regardless of the stage of the game.

My friend Marquis takes down Kleese in a matter of seconds, with less than 1 mag.

Snipers are the bane of Kleese, when I play Kleese if I see Marquis or Toby on the enemy team I know I’m doomed before the game starts. Unless you have a counter sniper, you’re gonna have a bad time.

On the other hand Slif, Kleese can be very solid in denying enemy snipers their crits/kills through the ally shield healing. If you place them where the Marquis can’t hit them then you’ll force him to reposition.

Friends have suggested taking the sniper helix to counter marquis, but I find the shield charged mortars are enough to kick him off his perch (assuming they’re not vigilant link stacking) and then my rifts refill me before he has a chance to take advantage of the drained shields.

It does force you to be far more aware when you reposition however, and to play chokepoints behind a Montana even more religiously.

I’m going to roll with no.

Kleese has his niche, and it’s not like you can’t run a healer along side. From level 1, he can’t heal, but he can still support.

Kleese is first and foremost Territorial. He excels at locking down bottlenecks with networked rifts, slowing mortars, shield stripping tasers and black holes. In PvP as well as PvE, if I’m playing Kleese, I’ll often get a friend to run a healer. If I get a healer, I always run the +50% chair power for better sustain on my taser, so I can slow enemies with a black hole and strip their shields before the damage gets dealt. I’ve racked up a fair few multikills in PvP with that method.

Things have their niche, it’s just something that needs to be accepted, or all of the characters will end up being ground into a bland, homogenised paste. By your arguments, we should make all Eldrid characters have shields, so that Kleese and Reyna can support them better.

Shield supports are shield supports. Shield supports will better support people with more shields
Health supports are health supports. Health supports will better support people with more health

If you need one and not the other, you should be running the one you need. If you need both, get someone to run the other one so you can run both. It’s that simple

No, pal, that’s by your logic.

By my logic, first of all, game that enforces importance of healing within the team should have diverse roster of healers. What I suggest takes nothing away from him and doesn’t stops him from being exactly what he was before. All I advocate for is for him to embrace this aura and get some actual, not a no-brainer, choice for his helix level 5.

No it really isn’t. You’re saying that Kleese needs to be a proper healer. I’m saying that he fits his niche and doesn’t need to have healing as his central role. He has enough of a role already, and no player should have his kind of area denial matched with his shield stripping as well as preposterously powerful shield buffing with built-in heals thrown in on top.

I definitely agree with you on the note of needing more healing characters, but they need to make sure they are as different and unique as all of the other characters so far.

Edit: Your opinion is your opinion. That’s fine, I respect that. What we’re saying is that your opinion isn’t everyone else’s opinion.

That’s funny, because what you think he doesn’t needs is exactly what he does every game as soon as he hits level 5, and several times more powerful than I suggest.

And, by the way, in the current circumstances of hero releases as rare as one per several months (and given the sorry state of the game, I’ll be surprised if there’ll be more than 5 heroes they are obliged to, if there will be even those 5), and the fact that the only supposed healer among them is already released, all that can be done is shift one of the existing heroes towards the role, which he is already performs extremely well, just tied to the level.