Maurice is a gawddang intern. He doesn’t get paid. Tannis is holding out…
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Drybonz
#40
Character development is the death of this game franchise. Give us quirky characters with no explanation, a loose framework of a plot, and stuff to shoot at, no un-skippable movies and no conversations that you have wait through to get your next waypoint, and you have a winner!
Hey wait… that was Borderlands 1!!!
jgartenbenz
(Jgartenbenz)
#41
Then Maya would have still managed to get killed by Troy and fulfill the only important role she had in the story.
No. She chose to physically grab him. Her choice. Cause and effect, some might say. If not for the necessity of plot that meant she would’ve died whether Ava was there or not, maybe she would’ve remembered that she was a siren and not physically grabbed him.
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I like Maurice 1000 times better than Vaughn, if I were CEO the guy that wrote him would have been fired
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Ava became an unwitting hostage to Tyreen, forcing Maya to use Troy as a bargaining chip. Had Ava not been in danger, she could’ve tossed their ashes into space; ergo, Ava should’ve listened to Maya.
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jgartenbenz
(Jgartenbenz)
#44
Tyreen didn’t have to take Ava hostage. That was Tyreen’s choice. Maya wasn’t forced to take Troy hostage. She certainly wasn’t forced to physically grab him, as she could grab him with her siren powers. Doubly her choice. Heck, Lilith and company could’ve paid more attention to what Ava was doing and stopped her from going down to the planet. Maya could’ve chosen to leave Ava on Athenas.
Should Ava have listened? Probably. But it doesn’t make her culpable. In any case, even if Ava wasn’t there Maya would have died. Her only purpose in the story was to die and elevate Troy. She certainly wouldn’t have been able to ‘toss their ashes into space’. Both people who got hold of her powers in the story showed more immediate prowess with them.
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There is no probably. At this point, you’re just making up excuses for her. Maya wanted to leave, but Ava wanted to open her damn mouth and goad Tyreen into teaching her a lesson. You keep saying ‘choices’ but refuse to hold everyone but Ava accountable. It was her choice to disobey Maya and head down to the vault; and it’s laughable you are throwing out the fact she snuck out of the ship without anyone knowing, which her backstory hints she’s good at doing.
It was also her choice to talk smack at the twins, not fully understanding what they were capable of while Maya insisted on leaving. And speaking of which, it’s also funny you think Maya didn’t know what she was capable of. She very well knew what her powers could do, as her echo logs hinted at in the second game. However, because she morals she keeps herself in check; if not, there might be two Tyreens running around. It’s like having a nuke: a same person understands what it is capable of and doesn’t use it unless absolutely necessary; evil people will use it as their first choice.
Not sure if you understand cause and effect, but if it was Maya by herself , there would be little to stop her from restraining her powers if she needed to. Tyreen may be able to pop out of thin air, but if Maya managed to catch her, that’d be a problem for Tyreen.
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jgartenbenz
(Jgartenbenz)
#46
And she directly suffered her own consequences.
You want to talk about what’s funny. Every person who wrongly assigns blame to and lashes out at Ava are being exactly like her when she screams ‘figure it out Lilith before you get someone else killed!’ It may have happened off screen, but at least she was able to grow out of that.
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Having her grow past it off screen didn’t Give her the development she crucially needed. We could speculate that she did, or she’s just hiding it. Had we seen it on screen in a way that was similar to Tina accepting Roland’s death, it would have definitely eased some of the problems with her character.
It’s also why most agree that Ava being given Sanctuary after Lilith sacrifices herself fell completely out of left field and didn’t seem to add up considering that Ava, after you’re finished with Promethea, really didn’t do anything up until we killed Troy.
There is also a difference between shifting blame on others and accepting responsibility. No one doubted that Maya could handle herself, and just about everybody expected the twins to show up. But in the grand scheme of it all, Ava still appeared as a spanner in the works.
kabflash
(So many titles, so little impact. )
#48
I think it’s more likely that Maya couldn’t handle herself and her fans don’t want to admit she got beat and outclassed by the twins and so look for someone to blame. When looking for someone to blame, the easy target is always a priority hence Ava.
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I wonder what Maurice listens to in his headphones. Dubstep? I hope dubstep.
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jgartenbenz
(Jgartenbenz)
#50
I’m guessing he’s got at least one Was(Not Was) song in the rotation…
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Honestly, Lilith’s encounter had more fighting in it then my has. Would have been cool to actually see her fight, but I guess time was an issue with some of the cutscenes. I never played anything besides Axton in the second game, just didn’t care for the other Vault Hunters. Even though Krieg was cool. However, how everything transpired is painfully obvious. Not to mention that no one even knew, not even Troy himself, that he could leech off other people without Tyreen. So the say that Maya couldn’t handle herself sounds more opinionated and factual.
and Troy had his own character problems because it look like he was growing out of his sister’s shadow and may have become the antagonist we would have to kill the very end. but then we kill kill him, Tyreen still Lives when she probably should have been dead, and we have yet another planet to explore. But it also ties into the story problems with Borderlands 3 as a whole.
kabflash
(So many titles, so little impact. )
#52
It seemed to me pretty obvious by Tyrene’s response to Ava’s comments what their intentions being there were in the first place, they weren’t planning on letting anyone leave period. Ava being there and saying things didn’t really change that. One way or the other they were there for a reason, Troy’s revelation just happened to be a nice happy surprise for them to make it all the easier. If Maya felt she could take them on, then she would, instead of her first instinct being to want to run away.
I feel like this was a missed opportunity. They kind of starting to build up that Troy would overtake Tyrene’s place but then it just kind of went away. I think many people would rather Troy ended up being the final encounter instead of Tyrene.
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Guess they felt there were enough Male villains in the game and tried to add more females to that party. This is the ONLY game where we have female bandits after all. Though this is explained because before, most of the bandits were ex-Dahl prisoners.
jgartenbenz
(Jgartenbenz)
#54
Are there any female Maliwan troops?
Judging from the sounds they make when slaughtered…no. However, those heavy troopers are very likely the nomad bandits from 2.
I vehemently hate maurice after he body blocked me near the mayhem console and I had to quit the game because I couldn’t move.
The point of grabbing him physically was to pressure tyreen into a standoff. Not only was her siren power incapable of killing Troy itself - as tyreen was capable of killing Ava in a simple movement - phase lock would’ve consistently grown weaker the longer she tried to hold her powers.
The inability to strategize would’ve ended your leverage in the same scenario much faster than a miscalculation on the part of Maya. She unwittingly gave her life for her subordinate because she had no other real choice - choosing to ignore that is your own shortcoming and not a defense of the situation.
Had Ava not been there they probably would’ve written in Maya’s death anyways, but don’t detract from Maya’s attempt to do the right thing in the smartest approach possible because you have no other defense of Ava’s insubordination that led to Maya’s death.
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