Maya got a boost recently. So, Maya should be re-evaluated

rush86 · December 9, 2015, 8:15pm

Maya was never bad. Before these lastest buffs to her skills she was still really powerful, especially with smgs. She was always a beast when it came to mobbing now shes even more so.

Handsome_Dad · December 9, 2015, 8:23pm

I’m another in the “Maya was never bad” camp. In a game with a lot of great mobbing classes, she is still among the strongest. Frankly, I find her to be better at it than even Grog + Harold Sal, and with some very different builds.

As far as solo raiding goes… Is she really that bad? Boss for boss, is she weak against more than Axton, Krieg, or Gaige? I’ve only dabbled, killing Pete and now Craw, almost getting Hyperius, and getting stomped by Terra. Haven’t taken her to Gee, Vora, Vermi, Dex, or the Dragons.

Poisd2Strike · December 9, 2015, 8:54pm

A re-evaluation of Maya as a whole is not required. Granted, the 10/29/2015 Borderlands 2 patch required certain skills to be re-evaluated (example: Cloud Kill). Prior to the 10/29/2015 patch for Borderlands 2, Maya was already a very viable character. Her only real weakness was (and still is) soloing certain Raid Bosses. The premise of the thread you referenced (Sadly Why Maya is Bad) was flawed to begin with, since it is obvious the OP of that thread had little understanding of the character (Maya is described primarily as a “healer”) and kept comparing Maya to Zer0 concluding that Zer0 was superior.

While Maya is certainly capable of healing herself and even other characters, categorizing (or pigeonholing) her primarily as a healer ignores her potential for both DPS and defense and, therefore, her versatility as a character. If someone is ignorant of or lacks an understanding of Maya’s versatility (which would be a mistake), then it is clear how they could arrive at the same mistaken conclusion the OP of the other thread did. Logically, a flawed premise can only lead to a flawed conclusion.

Abvex · December 10, 2015, 7:29pm

Not all raids are created equal either. The difference between the hardest raid boss to the easiest is pretty large. People can say she is bad for “this x raid” but “bad for all raid” is wrong. I think she is pretty useful for Son of Crawmerax. I hope Gearbox evolve the raids more going forward and include minions and mini mobs to fight in-between. Let your character Kill Skill be of use.

Raiding as a whole for Maya is where she should be for a support class. You bring her in for any coop raid and she will be your lifesaver.

Azabob · December 9, 2015, 9:38pm

There are a lot of terrible players in pretty much every game and they will often attempt to pretend as if the reason they don’t excel with a particular playstyle because “that’s the bad one”, which is every so often you will hear “Maya is bad” or “Axton is bad” or “Snipers are bad” or whatever.

Derch · December 9, 2015, 9:38pm

AR’s are bad

Poisd2Strike · December 9, 2015, 9:46pm

Ahem…but isn’t the Bekah an AR

Carlton_Slayer · December 10, 2015, 12:00am

Only if you expect them to act like real life ones, which I did coming from a military background. But after learning more about them and playing with Kreig, Gaige and now Axton, I can’t tell you how much I love the Hail…

Derch · December 10, 2015, 12:06am

I’ve head similar things with pimpernel not being a realistic sniper and I say to that “borderlands not battlefield”

Gulfwulf · December 10, 2015, 12:37am

I’ll see that and raise you a Bekah, Ogre, Kerblaster, Hail…need I go on?

[edit]: and Maya never needed an evaluation to begin with. I was doing perfectly fine playing with two others before the patch; the only difference now is how quickly I can steal kills away from Gaige.

Derch · December 10, 2015, 12:55am

It was sarcasm

stuarthome3 · December 10, 2015, 2:20am

I don’t know how many people have tested Cloud Kill in lower difficulties since the patch… But let’s put it this way: enemies rarely survive the first damage tick. Maya is almost certainly the most powerful character in the game in Normal mode now in almost every scenario.

Poisd2Strike · December 10, 2015, 3:12am

Just did a quick run thru of Bloodshot Stronghold and Ramparts in TVHM (farming for the Dahl Efficiency skins). So, enemies are level 50. I have OP8 gear, but had a Rough Rider shield equipped + Breakneck Banshee and 11/5 Fleet. I also have 5 points in Kinetic Reflection which gives a 100% chance to deflect enemy bullets and proc Cloud Kill. Half the time, I didn’t even have to use a weapon. The enemies would die when their own bullets were reflected back at them and Cloud Kill came into play. It was pretty hilarious.

Gulfwulf · December 10, 2015, 3:50am

I know. So was mine.

Handsome_Dad · December 10, 2015, 4:56am

I don’t like Bandit shotguns or most Jakobs shotguns. I dislike spiniguns of all types, including the Ogre. I don’t really like Tediore anything, even for Axton. I understand and appreciate that they are great in certain applications, buuuuut they’re not my style. I don’t really like most launchers because of the slow reloads. That’s kind of a theme for me, actually. Reload speed and animations matter to me.

Matrixneo42 · December 10, 2015, 5:37pm

I agree. I have yet to feel like I’ve done well when playing as Gaige (or claptrap in TPS) for example. But I’ll easily admit that they probably aren’t suited for my playstyle.

I do feel like the dragon raid in solo or as a team is best suited to Sal, Zero, and thirdly Krieg. Someone already mentioned Maya’s strength with Hyperius (especially back when she could pretend she was in FFYL, but she’s still strong with them today). She’s not too bad with the Snowman. Terra, it’s annoying that she can’t phaselock onto anything (probably my pet peeve with her, because that often hurts one of her best DPS skills). Spider leg boss, not enough experience. There are more than I can remember that easily now. I think the headhunter packs were a great addition to the game. They certainly gave Maya some more “boss food”.

I never agreed with the Maya is bad thread. Though I didn’t like how many of her skills didn’t scale that well. And I posted this mostly to suggest that people who thought she was bad overall, should check her out again. Especially some of the extreme builds that people have been working on.

Matrixneo42 · December 10, 2015, 5:40pm

I started to really like the hail in the Pre Sequel. A shock hail with Athena or Jack and an ice hail with Lady Hammerlock. I’ll have to go back and check it out in BL2.

Matrixneo42 · December 10, 2015, 5:51pm

I love tediore reloads. Many times I’ll end up shooting one or two bullets and reloading and repeat just so I can throw that out for it’s damage tons of times. Often one of my second wind mechanisms.

While playing a lot of zero and mordecai over the past year I did start to appreciate more of the burst damage playstyle. For a long time I played borderlands with more of a “shoot bullets all the time” mentality. So I valued Damage * Fire rate more than just damage. But with sniper classes it pays off to slow down and take one awesome crit shot instead. And that has been fun to explore. It also meant I used Jakobs a lot more.

Back on Athena in TPS recently I’m more about proccing shock and fire elements with fast guns. Which goes back to my Siren SMG roots again. But in TPS it’s often with lasers or simply any fast gun. And with Athena, scoping a lot less of course because her shield prevents that when out.

I’m rambling.

kritchie2023 · December 30, 2015, 12:34am

Haven’t played in awhile, but the only thing that bothered me was the DOTs in UVHM, as you pointed out. Other than that, Maya was already a major force to be reckoned with.

As someone who loves DOTs, I may just have to go back to a few of my Mayas now and laugh maniacally as I burn all the babies.

DeputyChuck · December 30, 2015, 3:10pm

3 of my builds are DoT based (2 as a primary strategy, 1 with DoT as a support), and they all work fine in UVHM. when you get to OP8 that changes a bit, but OP0 to OP2, DoTs are totally OK if you are specialized in it.