[Mod] [Pic Heavy] Homeworld: Past and Future

wow looks awesome. great work!
i want to replay the campaign once again, not vanilla, would like to play it with your mod.
is it ready to play through the full campaign ?

campaign seems to be crashing at present.

Yeah the changes in the last updates, have made the mod incompatible with the Campaign to anyone else except me, which is very weird, I’m looking for a way around this issue, but I think it will take a while.

Due to a recent Workshop tool failure, I’ve been forced to host the mod on the old ModDB page.
There you will find detailed instruction for installation in the Download page:

any update on the campaign incompatibilities in this version?

No, if it didn’t worked for you before, I doubt it will do again.

Maybe I will make an alternative version from the ground up for that, but I will need help from other people to test it, because for me the campaign always work.

I had it work once, and later not.

One issue I suspect is that if you’re using the LoadSharedModel on a hod that isn’t included in your mod, it can cause weird crashes. Is that something that might be happening in the campaign?

I see, I use that quite a lot, but none of those ships are being used during the campaign.

I think its related to the subsystems changes I made.

I just updated the mod to be compatible with the current 2.1 version of the game, if anyone is able to test it and give any feedback it would be greatly appreciated.

Also since I haven’t modified the hods, you will find all the vanilla hod related glitches, including the classic docking glitch specially for the Kadesh and some sideways bullets.

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Was able to launch as Turanic Raiders on v2.205 without issue. You’re missing bomber and turret icons. :slight_smile:

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I think the bomber was experimental for the turanics, but I will look into that.

Thanks for the feedback, also I’m watching at your SW Warlords video.

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My main issue with the mod right now is that I will need to edit almost every hod to apply all the small fixes that I had in previous versions of the game, and since editing hods is impossible now, I will have to create each hod from scratch using the old data.

I already have a process for this, but the results are quite mediocre, so any further improvement in the mod will take a long time unfortunately.

Actually I think would be easier to recreate the mod for the old HW2 engine :sweat_smile:

Good luck on that attempt. I would love to see and play it some day. With Homeworld Universe out of the picture your mod might be the only remaining hope to get to play with all the Factions we know of the Homeworld Franchise not counting FX mod as their models are unique and changed from vanilla assets.

Perhaps contact the old HWU devs. They stopped only because they were in the same boat than you’re now. They were alone who knows if you folks would work together things might work out just fine.

You should also contact yellow13 on steam. The creator of the Cataclysm mod. He as well stopped for being alone. Good luck on your project. :slight_smile:

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Hello Krnt, I’m happy to see this mod working again! I did a skirmish with this setup:

  • HWR: v2.205
  • Map: 8P Crimson Bond (custom map from Cloaked’s Ace Maps mod)
  • Player race: Kushan
  • Resource multiplayer: Default
  • Squadrons: No
  • Ship balance: HW1

and these are my first impressions:

  • Resources: it might be due to the custom map, but my collectors were harvesting way too fast, I depleted my initial asteroids field very fast and had more RUs income than I could spend.
  • Research: some researches have to be researched two or more times before they apply. Some researches cost a lot of RUs while some others cost only 10 RUs.
  • Squadrons: despite I chose to not use squadrons, I spotted the AI using squadrons, both HW2 races and Turanic Raiders.
  • Balance: I never played HW1, but are 7 Missile Destroyers working as intended? They are truly fearsome, even against a 4 AI maxed out strikecraft force.

Edit: when ships are constructed, they spawn in passive ROE, this is problematic expecially for Turanic Raiders when deploying offensively their Carriers.

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Hi echo7,

Resources: That is actually normal for HW1 races, they have the same collecting rate than in classic HW1 but the maps of HW2 are designed with lots of resources in small spots compared to HW1 were your resources are scarce and very scattered, effectively making them very good at collecting in HW2 maps, I may change their collecting rate, but I wanted to keep this as close to the classic as I could.

Research: I have yet to find a solution to the repeated research bug that was introduced in 2.1, about the cost of ship unlocking research, the cost (10 RUs) is just symbolic (in HW1 they were free) and needed for the game to be able to show the researching progress, however the ship upgrades have an equivalent HW2 cost since these are an added value, I will try to work around this, maybe change the values for HW1 and HW2 balance respectively.

Squadrons: I’m still working with this, kinda beta, only affects Kushan and Taiidans, I will add some more options to this to give more control.

Balance: I have tried to mimic the HW1 damage in the Missile Destroyers, its kinda difficult without using counted ammunition, I think I managed to match it for the first 60 seconds but after that it resets and they may do too much damage in the end, I was looking for a script that could count the missiles fired but I haven’t been able to have it working as intended.

About the Passive ROE that is normal for Kushans and Taiidans, which is the way it worked in HW1, but I forgot to add the default ROE and stance for the Turanic carriers which need to have Offensive ROE as default due to their aggressive nature.

In another note, this mod is not to be compatible with other mods, too much changes have been made internally and some features could fail or become completely unplayable if used with any of them, but seems that you were lucky with Cloaked’s Ace Maps mod.

I really appreciate your effort for the feedback, Thank you!

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Since maps are packaged as mods, they have their own Workshop/Tool category to make them useable with other mods.

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As long as the map pack doesn’t change anything in the game rules files or something similar, it should be ok.

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I removed the Ace Maps mod I downloaded from ModDB and replaced it with the correspondent Steam Mod, so that I can make sure it will not load while using your mod (just to be super-safe).

Well, I used HW1 balancement, not HW1 with upgrades… is it still correct to be unlocking the Capital Ship Drive with 800 RUs (or so it’s written in the research panel, more on this to follow) and Proximity Sensors with 10 RUs? Probably you already know this, but if you try to research something that in the Research panel on the right shows the value of its original cost (like the HW1 Capital Ship Drive research), it will complete spending 10 RUs, but if you cancel (not pause) it and then you try to research it again, it will cost 800 RUs.

If the research completes spending 10 RUs, then it will unlcok whatever it will unlock, but it will remain in the research list. If you research it for the second time, the global queue on the left will show its progress correctly, but the research panel on the right will show it with the completion bar full the whole time. After the second completion, the research will go away.

If the research is cancelled and then clicked on again to research it, the global queue on the left will show its progress correctly, but the research panel on the right will show it at 0% completion the whole time. At completion, it will have the same behaviour as if researched the other way.

Researches like Proximity Sensor, Sensors Array, Gravity Generator and Cloack Generator are not affected by the double research bug and their shown and actual cost is 10 RUs. Even after stopping and researching them again, they will still cost 10 RUs, will complete successfully and will not appear again. Might it be that the solution for this bug lies in how you implemented these four techs?

I didn’t express myself well, sorry for that. What I meant to say is that I had another skirmish using the Turanic Raiders and sent their carriers at the front line both to shoot enemies and to produce fighters / corvettes / frigates to cover them / help them out… but these newly producted crafts where in passive tactics while in the heat of combat :confused:

On a side note, the initial 3 Kushan Scouts are in Defensive ROE.

I thought the carriers would deal more damage (but then maybe they would be too powerful in the campaign). Also, if left alone they would target corvettes (I think this is intended behaviour, but in a case they had enemy frigates shooting at them); if told to shoot something big, they will use their forward point defence guns too.

Another feedback about the Turanic Raiders is that their collectors are counted as corvettes, effectively limiting what I feel is an already limited race (their heavy corvettes and frigates feel powerful, but the ions on their carrier feel not; or maybe it’s just me being a noob). Also, their standard corvettes are not able to shoot forward (you can notice this if you do a test match with 1 Turanic standard corvette against a Taiidan light corvette), maybe it’s a problem of attack style.

I also noticed that Kushani, Taiidani and Turanic Raiders can begin researching from the start, while HW2 races can’t. And lastly that Kushani lack a Cloacked Fighters squadron.

About changing HW1 collection rate, could it be possible to leave it as is in a HW1-balanced game mode and make it on par with HW2 races in a HW2-balanced game mode? I don’t know if it is even possible or if it is in the scope of your mod. I tried using HW2 balance, but I felt like resource collectors are not affected by the change (also it doesn’t affect research costs; does it only affect combatant vessels?). Also, is in the scope of this mod to have both HW1 and HW2 races balanced in a same match?

That’s all the feedback I have for now. I can’t express myself very well in english (or in my own language for what matters :sweat_smile:): I don’t know how to mod, if things are even feasible to do, I cannot even tell if things are balanced or not (there might be a reason why units stats are the way they are, like they counter a specific early game enemy strategy done by a smart human player or the like), so my posts want to be nothing else than a collection of my personal thoughts that I had while doing few matches with and against the AI.

Keep up the good work! ^^

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This helped me a lot, I was able to find the issue, the thing is that I forgot that the research in the new version of the game was split into several files, and mine was all in a single file, then when all put together they were effectively duplicating themselves, so I just make copies of the original files in my mod, but with all their content blank.

There must be a script around that is overriding the default ROE when the ships come out of the carriers, I haven’t found it yet, but feels definitively like a script.

Yep, I forgot to place them in the correct family.

That is correct, the two ions cannons in the Carrier are equivalent of an Ion Array Frigate each, just the same case as a Kushan Destroyer or a Taiidan destroyer are compared to their Ion frigates, however most of the firepower of the carriers are in the form of point defense systems, making them a totally different beast, along with their Heavy cruiser class armor, and their production capability they end up in a very strange spot, they are just good multi role ships.

More than a problem, that is actually their disadvantage due to their design, also the anti-corvette corvette from the Turanics is actually the Missile corvette.

I will be releasing a new version this week, with more squadron options and the new fixes included, I still need to look in further improve the balance.

Thank you for your feedback it is greatly appreciated.

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For this week patch, you will find a new version of the Squadrons restriction option in the game rules:

Default: this option allows HW1 races to build individually their fighters and corvettes and HW2 races to build in squadrons like original.

No Squadrons: this option restrict the building of strikecraft only individually for all races.

Squadrons: this option forces all players to build their strikecraft in squadrons, with a few exceptions like the minelayer and repair corvettes.

Optional: this option allows the player to build the strikecraft individually or in squadrons as he pleases.

The amount of ships in squadrons are one of the variables that can change in the future depending on feedback. I’ve kept the fighters for HW1 races to be built in groups of 5 and the corvettes in groups of 3 like the Hiigarans, for the Turanics I’ve used slightly higher ship counts, groups of 6 fighters and 4 corvettes, due to their vaygr like nature.

I have yet to do the same for the Kadesh, but this reminds me that there could be issues with the ships latching for refueling, I haven’t tried it to see if this was already solved in the 2.1+ version of the game.

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