Multiplayer Issues MEGALIST

Hi, my name is InfectedGrowth, and this game is my childhood. :smile:

Yes I know that there is already a pinned megathread, this is an organized MEGALIST. While there are plenty of threads with people adding more and more details about the issues with the game, it is hard to get a list of all the issues without repeats, rephrases, etc. In this post I aim to list all of the current issues that have been reported, focusing on multiplayer. Please reply to add anything NOT on this list, and I will edit it to add it here.

First of all I would like to congratulate Gearbox and BBI for a fantastic job on the game. While many of the HW1 mechanics are still missing, you honestly passed my expectations, so thanks. I have been having a great time experiencing it again. That said, you asked for feedback, here it is.

To anyone who might say that I played the game too long ago and don’t remember the specifics, I kept coming back to the game every two years or so after release. Last time I played the originals was the last few weeks before remastered came out.

Note that this is focused primarily on multiplayer.

KEY: ~ = Objective(not personal opinion) issue, '# = Bug, $ = Suggestions/Opinion. Some are a combination


Overall/Match issues:

~ '# 1. Lag. Server lag (I.e. not FPS-based) is common, especially in games of 4 people or more. If the goal is to have stable 8-player games, this is top priority for optimization.

~ '# 2. Loading. It is uncommon to enter a game in which everyone loads in without crashing. This makes team games almost impossible to get working. Loading needs to more stable and consistent.
'# a. Specifically it will often freeze on “downloading content.” You crash if this happens.
'# b. “Waiting for other players to load” often takes so long that people leave the game out of impatience

'# 3. Random crashes. I have had games in which I crash within the first 5 minutes, and also some in which I play for a good 30 minutes, before crashing and losing all of the time I spent. Obviously this is a priority. Note: see next issue

~ 4. There NEEDS to be some way of rejoining a game that you crash from, whether it be on load or randomly during gameplay. Some option when you reload multiplayer asking whether you would like to rejoin the game
you crashed from would fix this issue. Considering how long games can be, it is ludicrous that a random crash could waste 1-2 hours of gameplay. The game should be able to keep your ships, still performing their current orders and reacting normally, until connection is reestablished. After a certain amount of time, say 10 mins, their fleet could scuttle or be divided up amongst allies.

$ 5. Friends list would be nice or steam implementation for invites, etc. Maybe even join in progress.


Menu/UI issues

'# 1. Queues hitting (q) are messed up. Construction of a new production ship resets the list to only the mothership. Closing and reopening it fixes the issue.

'# 2. UI SCALING. We need to be able to scale it in smaller increments. Currently (at least on my resolution of 1366x768) the settings are: 1) perfect size but too small to read the numbers of ships selected 2) takes up most of the screen 3) UI elements overlap 4) UI elements are off the screen.

'# 3. RU meter, when cleared using backspace, will come back if you open build or research, but will not go away after the respective menu is closed.

$ 4. Why is there a button below the control groups that does nothing but hide itself? Also adds another backspace hit to clear the UI.

~ 5. Launch manager doesn’t organize ships at all. Either have them sort by type, or add a double-click to select all of one type.

'# 6. Tactical overlays only appear in sensors manager if you are really close to the ship. Additionally, you cannot focus on or select ships from a reasonable distance in the sensors manager.


Command/Control

$ 1. While it was ok in 2003, we need better indication of exactly what our ships are doing. The order feedback has only one output, which corresponds to the priority command. What we need is multiple outputs. For example: I order a destroyer to attack a frigate. It shows a marker for attacking that frigate. I then order it to move while attacking. It should then show both an attack output AND a movement indicator. Additionally, ships that can attack multiple targets should have outputs for every gun (maybe in a darker color or lower opacity or something) and a primary target for the ship. Support units should indicate everyone they have been ordered to repair in addition to the ship they are currently repairing. This could be an option in the gameplay settings, or only present in the most detailed tactical overlay setting, or only present when mousing over the vessel.

~ $ 2. Tactics should be more significant for fighters. I think that fighters should adopt the HW1 system of tactics, in which evasive (passive) allows them to “dodge” (see Ship AI #1), increases move speed and decreases weapon damage and accuracy. Aggressive should do the opposite.

'# 3. There is a bug which causes main cannons/weapons of many ships to focus on other enemy ships and fire NOTHING at the ship you actually order it to attack. (Example: defenders, BC’s)

~ $ 4. I have a proposal for tactics, for larger ships (especially those with multiple guns.) In reference to the bug previously noted, I think tactics should dictate how secondary ship guns function:
Note: Deciding whether to attack or not is the same as usual
a. Neutral: Main guns fire only on target ship. Secondary guns fire on any ships in range that are attacking the ship or friendly ships, although only if the ships has actually been given an attack order (I.e. not moving)
b. Aggressive: Main guns fire only on target ship, although BC and HC ion cannons could attack multiple targets at once. Secondary guns fire on any ships in range.
c. Passive: ALL guns fire only on target ship. Bounding box attacks will result in only targets in box being targeted. Effectively this means focused fire.

~ 5. Obviously formations are not right:
~ a. Fighters do not stay in formation when moving or in combat. (What is even the point of them then?) This is top priority. It is clear that there is coding for making ships fly in formation, based on the HW2 squadrons. Find a way to use this for separate ships, it is only an issue of moving together and syncing attacks.
'# b. Wall formation forms plus-shapes rather than rows
~ c. Sphere formation does not surround the target ship(s) (for guard or attack) This could be fixed by having no ship in the center of the formation, setting the center of the formation to a point equidistant from all targets, and scaling the formation depending on the size and positions of the ships selected.

~ $ 6. Guarding does not work as expected. When you issue a guard command, it says “escort confirmed” but guarding is not escort. Guarding should cause ships to follow their guard target more directly, especially with fighters. Right now they leave the ships they are “escorting” to pursue targets that are not directly threatening their quarry, leaving the ships unprotected. Maybe on aggressive, HW2 fighters could do this, but they should still try to stay near the ships they are guarding. HW1 ships, on the other hand, should stay with their targets, remaining equidistant from them and matching their speed, and fire at any enemy ships in range. If on evasive, they should “dodge” (see #1 and #2 in Ship AI). If in a formation/strike group, ships should remain in formation and fire from their position. Note that this is crucial for defenders to be viable.


Ship AI/Micro

~ $ 1. Biggest issue: SHIP ACCURACY. It is all over the place. I get that it uses the RNG diceroll system, which I don’t agree with, but it can still work with some major adjustments. First of all, ships need some sort of variable “difficulty to hit” modifier, which would depend on (maybe) their current speed, some sort of “maneuverability” stat, their ship class (fighter, corvette, etc.) and whether they are “dodging.” (Fighters set to evasive would have this modifier active and would, do an appropriate animation, like in HW1). I know ship class is already a modifier, but speed and distance are a must. The “maneuverability” stat would relate to how often a ship turns during combat, to simulate the fact that if you lead a shot and fire, and the ship adjusts course before impact, you physically cannot hit it.
The big examples of this are: Assault frigates somewhat consistently hitting fighters with their guns, fighters missing shots at capital ships from reasonable range, HW1 corvettes missing like 70% of their shots, and worst of all: frigates and destroyers COMPLETELY missing other capital ships from their normal attack range, a LOT, and COMPLETELY missing stationary corvettes from point-blank range. This makes no sense.

~ 2. Another HUGE issue: K/T strike craft can’t strafe. In HW1, corvettes could easily fly backwards, sideways, etc. and did so often during combat. They would face their targets and strafe around, firing accurate shots. Currently, they think that they are HW2 corvettes, and fly in circles, preventing 50% of their guns from having an angle. This issue also relates to guarding, where corvettes and fighters could match speed with their quarry and fly backwards/sideways, etc. to fire on attacking targets. This strafing functionality is key to how the HW1 fighters work, and to making formations and guarding work like in the original game.

'# 3. Many of the anti-fighter missiles have a turning radius wider than the fighter, preventing them from consistently hitting them. This is an issue with missile destroyers and Turanic missile corvettes. These missiles also have no trails from a reasonable distance.

~ '# 4. Ummmmm support frigates and corvettes:
I know the engine is limiting, but it is up to you guys to make them viable. Is it possible that repair could be a version of friendly attack, with a beam weapon that does negative damage? Don’t know, but they need range, and the ability to switch repair targets quickly if they are going to be at all useful. :frowning:
'# a. Drag selecting a group causes them to either only repair one ship, or give no feedback as to who they are repairing. (See Command/Control #1.)
'# b. Once focused on a ship, they will not leave to heal other targets, even if other ships are under attack, until they ship they are on is FULLY healed. This is especially bad in a combat zone, as getting ships to stay at full health long enough for the SF’s to leave is problematic.

'# 5. Once harvesters finish harvesting an asteroid region, they will parade and sit there, even if the ‘h’ command was used.

~ $ 6. HW1 Interceptors fire like 3 single shots per run, whereas they originally shot like 20 or so in rapid succession. They even use the graphical effect for rapid-burst fire, despite this. Due to this, and the issues with accuracy (see #1 on this list), HW2 interceptors can take out multiple ships per run, whereas HW1 interceptors miss almost all of their single-shot fire. I don’t understand this at all. LITERALLY copying the projectile and fire rate from the HW2 interceptors would fix this, although simply firing the current projectile way more rapidly and decreasing damage per shot would be a much smoother fix. Again, I have no idea why you did this GBX.


Multiplayer Specific UI Issues

~ 1. LOBBY. We need a overall multiplayer lobby with chat. Community is important kids.

~ 2. Hosting does not require a password, but says that it does and cancels the first time around. Leads to everyone thinking you can’t host without a password.

'# 3. Chat text limit is way too small

$ 4. Personal Opinion: I think the host should be able to assign teams themselves. I wasted like 15 minutes once in the lobby because nobody would switch to the right team.

'# 5. There are more games available, but the scroll bar only goes so far down.

~ $ 6. Why is the multiplayer region-locked? Either prompt the player on region when they join the lobby, or make it worldwide. (Good idea to sort games by worst ping if this is done)

~ 7. Add direct connect hosting and joining. It was in the engine before, why was it removed? Port-forwarding is more common nowadays, people can handle it.

'# 8. If you are kicked from the game with the fleet colors editor open it will stay open in the background and will not be accessible.


Keybindings (more subjective)

~ $ 1. ‘z’ should still function as a general special ability key. While it is reasonable to have specific keys for each (for cases when you have multiple ship types selected), it is silly to have to memorize convoluted key bindings for simple actions.

~ $ 2. Bringing up build or launch with ‘b’ or ‘L’ works as expected, but afterwards hitting the same key switches build or launch ship focus, rather than closing. While binding a key to this function makes sense, it should not be the same as the key used to bring it up. Toggling is nice and logical.


Balancing

Note: Some of these are based on my own impressions so far. This section needs the most work.

For the most part, Kushan vs. Taiidan, and Hiigaran vs. Vaygr are balanced. The main
issue here is between game races, as expected, and with the HW1 ships not functioning
like the original.

~ $ 1. Kushan/Taiidan (K/T) frigates have way too little health. HW2 races’ frigates are not as significant parts of the fighting force, while K/T frigates are the core of the fleet. They are bigger, bulkier and should be much more sturdy. Especially against fighters. Interceptors should not be able to shoot down an assault frigate as fast as they do.

~ 2. Big issue is with Hiigaran and Vaygr ship upgrades. Many of the ships that were balanced compared to K/T are OP after upgrades; an equivalent force of K/T is greatly inferior to their H/V counterparts.

~ 3. Hiigaran and Vaygr Battlecruisers are vastly superior to Kushan/Taiidan Heavy Cruisers. In addition to the upgrades issue:
~ a. HC’s build much slower than BC’s
~ b. Only one HC can be produced at once while two BC’s can be produced at once if you have two shipyards
~ c. The game counts BC’s as production ships, allowing you to survive your actual production ships dying and live of a BC, but not an HC for K/T.
~ d. BC’s can dock and hyperspace strike craft, HC’s cannot (and without support frigate hyperspacing K/T have no way of deploying strike craft with HC’s without risking/building a carrier).

~ 3. K/T strike craft are crap compared to H/V ones. 14 interceptor squadrons should equal 70 fighters (5*14=70), but the H/V interceptors ruin the K/T ones while only losing maybe 3 squadrons and assorted other members, which can be repaired back in with no cost. HW1 fighters also have functionality issues, and die wayy too easily. (see Ship AI #6 & Ship AI #1). This is even apparent in the campaign, as my 50+ fighters would be killed within 10 seconds by the first attack run of the Kadeshi.


Sound

~ $ * 1. Let’s talk about weapon sounds
'# a. Before I mention the obvious issue, I will note that some of the sounds are bugged. specifically: 1) Hiigaran destroyer guns, as well as the heavy guns of the HC’s use the Vaygr destroyer sound. 2) point defense guns use the heavy single-shot sound that frigates, the hiigaran destroyer&BC’s, and the heavy cruisers should be using, rather than the soft rapid fire sound they originally used (present on all vessels with PDG’s).
~ $ b. Ok. The pew-pew lasers. ALL HW1 fighters used a powerful, rapid fire braaap sound for their shots. While they fire single shots now (see ship AI #6), they still shouldn’t sound like lasers. There are no lasers in homeworld except for the laser corvettes. HW1 Corvettes also sound like lasers, while they should be using a sort of toned-down version of the frigate/hiigaran destroyer sound. Heavy corvettes are supposed to feel… heavy. Don’t try to “appeal to a modern audience” by removing the things that made Homeworld unique.

‘#’# *WORST BUG AWARD ‘#’# 2. D’ya know that bug from HW2 where if you focussed on a ship while it docked, its engine sounds would persist at max. volume at any distance unless you undocked them, zoomed in and zoomed back out? Well it’s back. And even worse than before. While in HW2 you could reset the sound by entering the game options menu, this no longer happens, so this bug will just PERSIST. Even worse, I have had sounds get “stuck” to me just from viewing ships with previously docked strike craft inside. This bug is 12 years old and is honestly the #1 thing ruining my enjoyment of the game.

'# 3. Sometimes the sound FX will just stop and not come back until the game is restarted.

~ $ 4. Battle music is triggered way too easily. It should only trigger when shots are fired or an attack order is issued and ships are within range. Then it should stay until there are no ships in range.

'# 5. Often times, about 30 seconds after the battle music starts, it will go silent until you disengage from the enemy and re-engage.

END LIST


If you read this whole list and have an issue to report or a suggestion to make that is not on this list (in some form or another), please post below and I will try to add it to the list. Please use my markings for issue type (~ '# $). If you would like to talk about a sugestion I made, revise it, or just vent annoyance at bugs, feel free as well :smiley:

TL:DR: If you are Gearbox, then please read it, most will be review anyways (it is very long, sorry :slight_smile: Else: This is mostly what you have heard one the forums and/or realized yourself. Feel free to add anything you found that is real obscure.

PLEASE focus on multiplayer issues or game-wide issues, this list is for improving the multiplayer experience. Campaign list would be MUCH larger.

4 Likes

@joekgbx @BitVenom

Firmly and resolutely seconded.

Ya nailed it.

Thanks for putting this list together! I’ll definitely make sure to look this over and pass it along to the team.

In the meantime, let’s all continue to use the other Megathread just so we don’t have duplicate threads being updated. That tends to make the information harder to find and dessiminate. Thanks again for your work here!