My Struggle With My Mains

I really have a hard time dealing with the bad reputation among my favorite characters, so I’m going to talk about three of my favorite characters to play or used to be my favorites in some cases. Rath, Benedict and Kleese. I hope that you can understand why they don’t entirely deserve all the crap that they get.

First let’s talk about Benedict. I played Benedict before he got buffed with more health, damage and hawkeye duration. Let me tell you it was difficult to play him. He had great damage output if you could take the time to learn how to play him and could get out of a bad situation pretty effectively. He was still countered pretty hard by snipers because when he’s flying through the sky he’s a pretty easy target with low health but I was okay with that. Characters have counters that’s a fact of life and I’m okay with it. So he was underrated because of how difficult he was to play and only a few people took the time to truly master him. Let me tell you, Benedict was one of the few characters where if you saw the master skin on him it actually meant that that player was a god damn beast with him. I personally know only four people that took the time to learn how to play him (myself included). So I took pride in my master of Benedict title. It felt like I had actually accomplished something that only few others had. And then I read the patch notes about his buff… Increased health, increased damage, and an extra 1 second on hawkeye. I knew that Benedict would become one of the strongest characters in the game and everyone would start playing him. I was right, he was broken, and the community started to hate every single Benedict player out there. So now every time I see some comment on the forums saying something like “Benedict requires no skill to use” it just feels like another stab at my pride. The thing about those comments is that they are true now. Compared to how it was with him to now, even with the damage being reverted, it’s true. All the time I spent playing him feels like it was wasted. To this day, with my 1000th match of PvP just last week he is still my 5th most played character and I haven’t played a single game with him since he got his major buff months ago.

Now let’s move on to Kleese. Kleese before he got his health buff was a high risk/high reward character. I loved playing him because he can control an entire area of a battlefield with his rifts and needs to be focused by several people to be flushed out of wherever he decides to set up his rifts. And when I figured out how much damage I could actually do with energy mortars, let me tell you I was having a blast. I could out damage nearly every ultimate in the game with a skill that has a ten second cool down. But this came at a risk. He had the lowest health pool in the game. Every time I pressed R1 I risked revealing that fragile health pool. It felt like every character with a gun was a threat to me if I was outside of my rift network. If for whatever reason, someone actually chose shield penetration in gear or helix, I was in danger from that person. That is the only way I could justify his rifts dealing over 500 damage every two seconds at end game and energy mortars being able to one shot anything that isn’t a tank. Now with the 88% increase to max health I feel like I just have no threats other than a really, really good Whiskey Foxtrot at end game. I sometimes feel like I can just sit down and have a nice snack mid game and just press L2 whenever someone gets close to me and I’ll hover away with more than half my health and another kill. It just feels like the risk of playing him was removed and with it a lot of the fun as well. I’ve barely played him since his health was buffed and he is still my 4 most played character.

On to Rath, my most played character. So at this point everyone knows that Rath can ambush you with Catalytic Smash, hit you with Crossblade, and then whip out Dreadwind and destroy you with one of the highest DPS abilities in the game while you are slowed and silenced. This has been the death of many new players and the cause of many “Rath is OP” conversations. I’m going to tell everyone out there that thinks this is true how to counter Rath. Teamwork. I know, shocking isn’t it? This combo is easily punished by your team because it’s so obvious. I’ve seen many Rath players interrupted during this because when you see a Rath use Catalytic Smash you should always be aware of the possibility of Dreadwind coming up next. Now, there’s not much you can do if you are the one being hit with this but you have to remember THIS IS A TEAM GAME. Rath’s ult is the second easiest in the game to interrupt as half the CCs in the game will cancel it and the other half will still give someone a chance to escape. So if you get caught by yourself against Rath, chances are he will kill you and there is little you can do about it. Is that a reason to complain about him? No. He’s an assassin. He’s supposed to be able to chase down people and inflict massive bursts of damage and CC. I won’t complain when Ernest is clearing waves or when Miko is healing because that is what they are meant to do, so why do people complain about Rath being able do his job? Because so few people understand how to deal with him, there are a lot of misconceptions about how strong he actually is.

I also see a lot of people talk about how a good Rath player will just have more kills than deaths. They say that it’s okay if you died 12 times so long as you get at least 13 kills. Those people think that he is only good for killing players and I just want to take a moment to say that they are wrong. Rath is probably the best disrupter in the game. Catalytic Smash can interrupt almost anything in the game. If there is an ISIC on the enemy team I make my job that he is never in Omega strike for more than ten seconds. If a teammate gets pulled in by Gali, Ghalt, or Shayne, I make sure that Gali, Ghalt or Shayne doesn’t get to hurt them before they start running. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve saved a friend being chased by someone by knocking up their chaser and slowing them. The point is that Rath is an incredible character that few people give credit to.

I’m not sure what I meant to accomplish with this thread. Maybe I wanted to change the way someone views some of my favorites, maybe I just wanted to vent.

What do you think about Kleese, Benedict and Rath?

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Well it sounds like you wish to bring up a struggle of terms with the balancing done on those 3 characters. No worries :slight_smile:

In regards to Benedict he always seemed fine to me. Despised great ones but overall a character that seemed like he took a while to get the hang of. Which I thought was fine. I certainly think the health buff was ok but everything else after that was just a huge balancing fiasco. He seems fine now. Just respect his potential damage out put and he is nigh useless

Kleese is a bit of an odd duck when I consider trying to balance him. I have a huge problem with squishy big bodied characters as I I feel there hp should be naturally higher than a character that fits the same class type. I know everyone wants Kleese nerfed but imo he isn’t insanely broken. His mortars aren’t super hard to dodge and melee don’t have a lot of business getting near him which is where taser often shines. Kleese is one of those characters that you need a dedicated harasser for(which are often characters that do pretty decent against melee i.e. Toby and Monty) I just personally feel it’s a case of knowing your role properly.

Raths changes have been nothing but upsetting to me. Before the major tweaks on him he was basically the git gud poster child and I liked that. Most characters rebalancing seems to be for the most part based off of low skill players to have a relatively easy time dealing with each other which is odd to say the least. Your ability to deal with rath in a team game automatically jumps your skill level up by a notable margin as he makes you go “hmm… Should I just be blindly firing off my skills constantly and chasing kills or should I be more tactical and alert to deal with characters that may shut me down?” Rath is a fun and useful character thst really doesn’t deserve the rep he has

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Yeah right now Kleese is by far the best turtler in the game. Especially since most the DPS can’t 1 shot AoE his rifts. If he sets up right in perch no character in the game can remove him.

Also you are right Rath is an insanely good counter initiator. he was one of the only ones capable of stopping El Dragon and he’s also a solid pick vs the big bad Gali. What people often don’t realize is this character does right about 700 damage with his two skills before he even clicks the ultimate. Which means some character are already dead and you just need to melee them.

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Rath was the first character i mastered and my favourite character during the Beta. I hate what they did to Dreadwind in the most recent patch as that ability, like you said, is so easy to disrupt.

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That feeling can suck, but sorry, I remember a time when picking Attikus meant starting a match at 4v5 because some smart aleck on your team thinks he knows the game better than you.

Nothing is worse than feeling like you can’t pick a character you like because it might handicap your team, when it’s a perfectly legitimate pick.

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I was going to post a breakdown of my own, but you summed up my own thoughts nicely.

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As a Rath main I feel you man, sometimes I don’t know why is there this much hate on him, especially on his ult, now it barely qualifies as an ult cuz I barely use it anymore to get kills, I still do great with him cuz i can still kill with his other stuff but everytime I can’t secure a kill with Dreadwind and even people like WF, OM and Marquis escape from me, literally a part of me dies.

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I just want to say thank you for all the comments on Rath. It feels good to know that I’m not the only one who understands him.

I used to despise raths ult, I was one of many that wanted that thing destroyed for a while. As time went on though I became fine with it and learned to counter it, and thought to myself"this is what he’s meant to do" and I stopped complaining about it. I don’t agree with his nerf to dreadwind.

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THANK YOU!!!

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I can’t comment on Benny and Kleese since I basically never play as them but jeez… Rath.
I used to be really good with him but then came the nerfs and I basically never touched him since (couldn’t stand to see him nerfed because people just didn’t even look for strategies to counter). They nerfed Dreadwind way too hard and the latest nerf was the damn last straw, I’m seriously pissed now. It was always easy to counter him, his ult is so easy to break… now his ult feels like a two second joke idk.

I’d love to pick him up again… but nah.

I also use to find Rath’s ultimate very annoying, but I never screamed nerf. I just learned to be more aware of my surroundings. Learned how to counter or escape.
I am not a Rath player, and I deeply miss the old Dreadwind.
I use to have fun “Air stalling” and watching a Rath DW into nothing, but in face off the other day…I decided to eat most of the combo…Dreadwind didn’t kill me… I feel like I can just lazy dodge it now…

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I’m not really that upset about the nerf to Dreadwind because like @akumakuro4004 said [quote=“akumakuro4004, post:7, topic:1548879”]
I still do great with him cuz i can still kill with his other stuff
[/quote]

I feel that the nerf was unnecessary but it was put in place because most people don’t understand how to deal with it. I’m upset because this means people don’t understand how strong he is or why he is strong and the changes coming for him won’t be good. They will be made on false presumptions about him.

I always thought Rath’s swords were made of cotton candy. I don’t feel the damage there when I attack with him.

Kleese is a pretty loaded character but all in all I think he’s in a healthy spot. Except for the taser. That damn taser. Like what the hell is up with that thing. It’s broken. Sorry. Maybe it’s bugged and doing more than intended, idk. But it does too much damage and can sometimes go through walls. Taser is the only beef I have with kleese

Oh yea and Kleese…I hate Kleese.
I make it my job to destroy him and his rifts.
Miko follows close behind. Miko dies I will make sure of it. Kleese dies. I will make sure of it.
My hatred comes from people not focusing them to begin with and allowing them to get “comfortable” -_-

Did you start hating him before or after he got a health buff?

It was because of how often new Raths hit 10 kills before level 5 and then only got kills with ult. Believe me, this happened practically every match at first

Finally someone else who player pre buff Ben and Kleese!! Benny was my fav character since the CTT

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The true potential for his damage comes from his skills. Catalytic smash followed by crossblade does a lot more damage than people realize. Especially at levels 6 and 9. The melee’s strength is in finishing someone off when they are slowed and silenced. Also he has some off the best range with his melee so it’s understandable that the damage is lacking because of that.

Rath should never really initiate against someone that’s at full health with the intent to kill. Unless it’s against someone really squishy. Rath should focus on targets that have already taken damage so he can finish them off or he should focus on making someone retreat. I will initiate against a medic at full health knowing that I won’t get the kill just to make them retreat and allow for my team to take advantage of their missing medic.

I Didn’t mind when they gave him the 75 cooldown, a bit dissapointed but I could cope with it cuz they didn’t mess with the ult but this patch, come on if you’re gonna decrease the duration and damage then at least decrease the cooldown for pete’s sake, I can actually say that Toby’s ult is above Rath’s ult and that’s saying a lot.

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