NEEDED Character Patches in the Fall Update

I still find this quite risky for a final patch. Not forcing someone like El Dragon to waste a gear slot for health gear (which isn’t online right from the beginning and forces him to be careful at least in the first few minutes of a match) could lead to power creep. He already hits hard, giving him the option to stack more offensive gear on top of that doesn’t really sound that fun to me.

I’m not a high class player myself. I was in a lobby yesterday again where everyone else had spent 2x up to almost 8x as much time in this game as me and even the most tryhard Deande I can play (maybe I tried too hard and made mistakes or was to passive because of that - have to analyse my footage first what really went wrong there) wasn’t really enough to not be the only reason for unbalancing teams by playing instead of just spectating. I still often enough have no other choice than playing games that are more competitive as I’d really like.

While playing with this group in the past, I’ve seen El Dragons who were almost as resilient as pre nerf Boldur and soloed a whole team right next to the enemy sentry. If those luchadores could’ve played with a more offensive loadout, I’m sure they would’ve gone out of some matches with multiple pentas on top. The only viable strategy against him I’ve seen until now was to starve him of XP as much as possible at early game, when he doesn’t have his gear up and hasn’t hit the clap which is something like his emergency strategy to leech XP from minion waves out of safety. When I see a competent player on El Dragon hit level 5, my usual reaction is that I want to scream something that would only be shown as squares here - and this is not just me, even much more experienced players have huge respect of him then. Giving him a health boost would make his early game easier and give him the opportunity to go for a more agressive late game loadout.

Health gear might have been too strong, but nerfing it hard now and compensating the losses by buffing the characters who relied on it might snowball into another balancing nightmare. I don’t really know if I want that risk when it’s a “well, that’s it” kinda deal …


If we go with my suggestions; 200 max health increase and 50% nerf to max health gear, it’d be more of a case of plaining out his power curve theoughout the match. Improving his early game while reducing his late game.

If we look at the numbers it’d be;

(Now / Suggested)

  • 1 secondary - 210 < 305
  • 1 primary - 280 < 340
  • 1 primary, 1 secondary - 490 > 445
  • 1 primary, 2 secondary - 700 > 550
  • 1 primary, 3 secondary - 910 > 655

Not stacking max health will yield more health in relation to itself, but not in the grand scheme since most do stack, at which point it’s less efficient.

With these changes he’d be more emphasised as a glass cannon, becoming easier to kill and potentially dealing more damage.

While I could be naïve, I don’t think an indirect buff to him in terms of allowing more versatile loadouts would make it a severe balancing issue.

He doesn’t need buffs, no.
But I don’t think it’d hurt if he got an indirect or two depending on to what extent.

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so stacking full max health yields 910 usually but you’ve reduced it 655. So if I kept my loadout the same and with the 200 extra health naturally, then he’d be at 855 extra health compared to the 910 I’m giving him now, which is a slight nerf. This would actually make me want to stack max health even MORE considering I’m not even getting as much as I used to.

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Yes, but the latter includes the additional 200 health, meaning that

is wrong.

[Base Health] + 200 + 140 + 105 + 105 + 105 = [Base Health] + 655

Which is why I want to make sure such a balance change to the gear is properly counter balanced amongst the characters which needs it.

I set it conservatively to 100-200 to not overdo it for the characters I mentioned above.

The intentions behind nerfing the max health gear is

A) Allow for more versatile loadouts
B) Make the game more balanced

A is somewhat self explanatory. Nerf max health to put it more in line with other buffs to increase competition between the different attributes so players can choose more freely what to pick rather than feelibg obligated to stack max health because that’s the “gear meta”.

B is referring to the meta overall. It’s somewhat absurd to me how someone such as Orendi or Mellka (or even El Dragòn for that matter) who have and are meant to have relatively small health pools. They’re skirmishing glass cannons.

A while back a friend sent a screenshot where he did quite well as Caldarius against a set of skilled players. He also pointed out that it there were a lot of “fatties” (my words, not his) on the enemy team while he was merely but a squishy Caldarius in comparison.

However, he stacked all max health.

Caldarius’ base health at level 10 is 1721. Add the shield on top of that, and you got 2021. Then you got the additional 910 health from gear, which gets you to 2931. So you could have someone as agile and hard to lock down as Caldarius being nearly at 3K HP, which at least in my eyes doesn’t seem balanced. Hence why this is one of the reasons why I want it nerfed.

Certain characters, such as El Dragòn, may need a stronger counter balance. But given how the upcoming patch is supposed adress the CC-meta, I’d reserve more generous buffs to survivability in general to see how the new meta will be.


has PTSD flashbacks of pre-nerf Dragoon
Vagrant…make the bad wrestler go away…

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Insults towards members and GBX-staff are not welcome here and against our Forum Rules.
If you want to emphasize your position or opinion please do so without insults or personal comments.

All I know is that if they nerf dragon into the ground again somebody’s going to be receiving a strongly worded email.


Why would you take away volley crits? They only happen at extremely close range. And they’re arrows, why on earth would they not crit? :joy:


Because that ability does enough damage as is.

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For the ability to do that much damage the weak frail sniper has to pretty much touch the other person. It’s almost like it’s a high risk, high reward ability.


You need to learn about something called “sense of humor”

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I’m a Benedict main, I’m just Critically Jealous alright


@Ganjamira doesn’t need to learn anything, she’s doing her job and your post just so happened to fall under her jurisdiction.


To avoid any outbreak here - humor is a great thing, but within bounds. Here these bounds are formed by our simple forum rules.

Even if sarcasm and cynism is technically against our rules, often it´s harmless and therefore get´s ignored in a reasonable fashion.
Insults towards GBX-staff and fellow members don´t have this safe-zone, even if ment in a jest.

For all other questions or comments please send a PM to me or another mod of choice.


-18% damage to Oscar Mike.


Oh, i see what you did there… Haha!

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Dumbest buff NA

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That means: don’t discuss moderator activity on the open forum. If you have something to say about us, so do via pm.

Garrus, buddy, don’t drink and troll.

As for Dragon, just play Montana.


Move along folks. Back on topic now, please.