New(ish) Player's Impressions

So I started playing shortly after this game went “free” and I thought I’d weigh in with my thoughts and give feedback/whatever. While this game is pretty cool, and I definitely enjoy the esthetic, I’m mostly going to be focusing on the big glaring problems I’ve seen in the past few days playing as a fresh, free player who’s reach about level 26. I’m sure I’ll get a bit of hate for some of the things I have to say, but so be it.

First of all, stuns. Yet another game that suffers from “stun syndrome.” Stun meta, chain stunning, 100 to 0 stun kills, stop it. Stuns are always bad for gameplay as they remove all player interaction for their duration, and they’ve been bad for pvp games since vanilla WoW. Reduce their duration, add diminishing returns, I don’t care as long as something is done. No one wants to see their character sit disabled until your dead, and they always dominate competitive play. Also, Deandre or whatever her name is, from what I’ve seen her ult is like cancer bad. Maybe do something about that.

Second, the queue times are ATROCIOUS. Whether in the novice queues, or the post-20 queue, I usually wait about 20 minutes for a game. This is bad. I’m looking at steam charts, with like 700 people in game, there is no reason for it to be this long. I’m pretty sure there is like zero skill based matchmaking anyways so why is it taking this long? And I really hope it’s not skill based mm, which will bring me to my next point…

Snowballing. Practically every game is outstandingly lopsided. I’m getting 100-0 incursions, 44-500 face-offs, 61-400 captures, etc. This time of game is the standard about 8 times out of 10. I’m not saying I haven’t had good games, but it is DEFINITELY not the norm here. I suspect this has something to do with the leveling system, which I don’t fully understand yet but seems problematic. If I’m level 7 and I see a teammate at level 2 (post 20 queue), somethings up. Levels don’t really seem to be integral to the gameplay, and aside from removing levels entirely or employing a team level system like Heroes of the Storm has, I can’t offer any solution. But the real issue here is the mad snowballing, no the xp/leveling system.

Next, the grind. Getting money/gear is agonizingly slow and not at all friendly to new players. I’ve gotten enough money for maybe 2 37k character and 1 13.5k character on my way to 26 or so. And now that I’ve finished all my quests (do I even get more “main” quest?), my income has plummeted. I can’t even imagine grinding out the 14 characters required for the ranked mode, although I wonder if anyone plays ranked, I’m guessing the queue is even longer since it basically omits all the free players meant to buffer the population. Which brings me to my final point…

This is going to annoy a lot of people, I’m sure, but this game was a failure. Averaging sub-100 concurrent players makes this evident.
http://steamcharts.com/app/394230
And then instead of going f2p like everyone knew it had to, they do this “free trial” nonsense that mostly feels like you are still being forced to buy the game to really play it. I understand this is a business first, but you really need players before you can even ask for money. Often times the first thing people ask before spending money on a games is, “does anyone play it?” I won’t rant too much about this cause I know it’s been discussed before. Also spare me from your anti-f2p’r sentiments, I’ve heard it all before. This game needs free players to survive, treat them well (better?).

P.S. Almost forgot, just a little peeve, if I ghost pick (right click) a character, and that character is not picked, DO NOT GIVE ME RANDOM. Just give me my ghosted pick if I don’t pick in time. Super simple. And no I’m not going to stare at the pick screen the whole time, after 20 minutes in queue, there is something else I’m already doing.

TLDR: Free player experience so far, awesome game, but with stupidly long waits just to stomp or be stomped. Stuns and stingy business model not great for gameplay. I feel like this game needs to move away from MOBA style and more towards “hero shooter.”

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If it makes you feel any better one of the devs has stated that the goal of the next patch is to move away from the chain CC dominated meta.

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Deande.

That is her name.

How do you mean cancer bad?

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Multi-target stun, I assume.

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Preaching to the choir, buddy. We know all these problems. Except the Deande ult one, that one’s new.

The CC is being worked on, but it requires a full on patch for that sort of thing. The population on PC has been so low that any sort of ELO would just be pointless. Now we got a lot of people and the experience gap is so wide any ELO would seem pointless. Kind of a catch twenty two that’s going to take a while to sort itself out.

I also get some sick pleasure whenever someone complains about wait times and brings up steam charts to say the game is a failure. I’m on Xbox and the only time I wait longer than five minutes is at four in the morning. Heh heh heh…

Finally, would it make you feel better or worse if I told you that those characters are actually much cheaper than they used to be? When Alani, Kid Ultra, Earnest, Beatrix and Pendles came out, anyone without a key had to pay 47.5k.

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multi target stun that deals less damage the more targets are caught in it.

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If deande’s team is smart enough is her ult+ someone else ult/skills

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That’s my point, there is no ELO based mm, so why in God’s name does it take half an hour to get a game? No reason for it to be this long. Either quick queues with unbalanced games, or long queues with even games. Right now we have long queues with uneven games.

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when you can set up kills as easily as you can confirm them

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Also Deande’s ult is a channel then release in a huge conical aoe that hit targets in succession, and stuns them. So if its like 1 or 2 people that get caught its about 4 seconds of perma stun+damage. Stuff like that shouldn’t get past alpha QA frankly.

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You also have to take into consideration that a lot of those people on steam charts are playing PvE, Bots Battles, or are just sitting at the lobby for whatever reason. You might be surprised how much of a chunk that makes up. The devs certainly were.

Then you have Draft mode, which isn’t really a “ranked” mode, least not officially. That and quick match have separate ques, because not everyone wants to go through that pick/ban system. So wait times suffer for that, too, and will likely do so until the population goes up. And we’re likely not going to see that happen quickly because the population also keeps the skill gap wide.

The population is like alcohol in this game. It’s the cause, and solution to, damn near all this game’s problems.

Kiiiiinda. It’s not a channel, not in the traditional sense. The player has no real control over when it goes off. They also are locked in until it does go off, so Deande may as well have a big neon sign that says “shoot here” over her head.

I don’t recall it having a stun if it only lands one hit on someone, but then again Deande is literally my lowest rank character. (7, in case you were wondering). If it does, I can definitely see that being addressed in the CC change.

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I’ve played games with a quarter of battleborn’s current population, with queue times under a minute, and matches that were without a doubt, more even that what I’m experiencing. Don’t try to put all the blame on population. And assuming most of the current population is new, free player, they aren’t going to be in PVE at all.

Every game is just stomp, stomp, stomp. After today I don’t even know if I want to keep playing. In matches of incursion, I sometimes never even see the other teams sentry, in other modes, the losing team doesn’t even break 100 points. This is more than just imbalance because of low population, trust me. Something in the core gameplay needs to be done to stop these matches that are more one-sided than anything I’ve seen in games before. If other newcomers’ experiences are anything like mine, this game is going to die (another) quick, short, death.

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Deande is far from the worst this game has to offer in terms of balance. You missed characters like Galilea, Alani, Beatrix and KU at their strongest. Currently the balance of the game is better than it’s been since October. In terms of the chain CC meta Deande is one of the lowest ranking offenders. Right now the big issues with CC are Kelvin, Ghalt, Shayne and Rath. Boldur is also pretty ridiculous but not in terms of CC.

I agree with this sentiment for the most part but the truth is her ult could be toned down just a bit. It’s really frustrating to have a 5 man pick a deande and basically do nothing remarkable with her until she hits 5 then just jam the ult constantly

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The Deande’s that just do that aren’t the ones you need to worry about.

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I agree to an extant. They however are still in rightfully powerful imo. I think nerfing the ult just a bit to where bad deandes can’t just jam it in on 5 mans won’t affect the deande mains so much since they actually utilize her kit is all

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I don’t think Deande’s stun is too much of an issue. I know it’s the longest stun in the game, but it also has a lot of drawbacks that can easily be taken advantage of.

  1. First off, it’s her ult. This means that:
    A. Deande has to reach level 5 before her stun even comes into play. It’s characters that can stun right out of the gate that are far more threatening to start with.
    B. She can only use it once every 70 seconds. Even when Deande does have her ult, as soon as she burns it, you know that you’re safe for about a minute(ish). It’s not like she has her stun readily available often, (like Gali or Kelvin for example).

  2. Deande’s ult has a cast time, it isn’t an insta-stun like most others. This gives you the opportunity to stun/silence her back rendering her ult useless for another 70 secs, (this is fairly easy to do as Deande can’t move whilst she’s casting either); or move out of her ult’s radius as it’s relatively small. Be aware that she can still turn around during her cast time however, so moving to the sides won’t work.

  3. Deande is vulnerable whilst using her ultimate. As I said before, she can’t move whilst casting it, and every Deande player knows about her ‘self-stun’ once her ult animation finishes. The fact that Deande herself, is stunned longer than what her enemies are, puts her at a severe disadvantage. This makes her an easy target and you might even be able to kill her if she’s weak enough.

  4. She has to sacrifice her ultimate’s killing power in exchange for her multi-stun. The more people in her ultimate, the less damage it does as it’s divided between each enemy, so the safer you’ll be. The only time you should worry is when you’re the only person stunned, or when Deande has her team behind her to follow up on her stun with their own skill combos, although the latter will only work if she’s playing in a premade or her teammates are smart and catch on. Deande by herself can’t do much with a multi-stun however.

  5. Outside of her ult, Deande has next to no CC at all, (minus a few slows from optional helices). If she stuns you, but doesn’t kill you, she’s got nothing to follow up with. Believe me, other characters were A LOT worse in terms of having too much CC. (I’m looking at you Gali).

The downsides (IMO) balance out her ultimate and believe me, it can be hard to pull a Blink Storm off if you don’t get the right opportunities as it’s easily countered. Not to mention, it’s always satisfying when you manage to cancel her ult or kill her whilst she’s self stunned, and I main Deande. :stuck_out_tongue:

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As a veteran PC player, I agree with everything what was said.

A “free trial” that had a positive player base growth for 2 days… Now we are back to 288 people playing the game at the moment. Heh.

They had all the chances to balance ALL the characters with this patch, but they just nerfed some to the ground and let the skill chaining persist.

I wrote about all the different problems this game has right now in many different threads, so I will not repeat myself.

Sorry dudes, but Battleborn cannot be saved. One step forward, 2 steps back. We have seen this for more than a year now.

I really hope GBX will stay with the single player games and not venture into another multiplayer fiasko in the near future.

Imagine Battleborn as a co-op/single player game that you can play offline without the unstable servers bullsh*t. Would have been a gem!

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I’d really like for Gearbox to try this out. It could help new players tremendously.

This feels more like you’re saying “Make it more like Overwatch or Paladins”. Sorry to say this kiddo, but they ain’t gonna change it now, not after a year.

Besides, the last time games “tried to be like another” was back when everyone was making MMORPGs that were like WoW, and, well, you know what happened to those.

The best thing Battleborn can do is stay with its MOBA roots and keep pushing that, otherwise it would be “just an Overwatch clone”. There is a benefit to being unique.

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