No more calling for nerfs!

Battleborn Battleborn Competitive Multiplayer Discussion
#1

I’m getting very frustrated hearing about people calling for “nerf this” or “nerf that”.

This isn’t WoW or Lol or any thing similar. This is one of those games where EVERY character is OP. So rather than calling for nerf, play the character that destroys you and LEARN how they react and respond so you can take them down.

Let’s start by looking at basic gameplay mechanics, are you a melee character? Then do not attack ANYONE within their peripherals.
Are you range? Quickly learn what your effective range is and get in it while staying out of your opponent’s effective range, once again, attacking out of their peripherals is also greatly encouraged.

Learn the character:
Fighting galilea? Stay out of purple bubble, attack from behind.
Benefict? Chase the crap out of, close the distance, stay outside of his blasting range, anticipate where he is going to fly to.
Marquis? Close the distance, kill his owl, stay out of time bubble .
Ambra? Kill sunspot, jump in air, attack from side, do anything to disrupt her beam, prepare for overshield, use special ability when it pops up.
Rath? Attack from distance, dodge huge X beams, stay away from whirlwind attack, attack from side.
Miko? Shoot mushroom caps on ground, close distance, if falling short on health fall back, stay out of their sight.

Anyway, every character can be defeated, and every character can be considered OP in the right hands or with the right gear. Rather than gripe about losing try to learn what you’re doing wrong and fix it.

And staying alive is most important, never chase down to their headquarters, never assume you can take 2 or more on, watch your health, know your mobility, and most importantly watch the map. You will quickly find no one is OP if you follow these rules.

Last but not least and not to be a supremacist, IF you are TOO casual to learn basic mechanics, then you are also TOO casual to complain about characters needing nerfs.

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#2

2 points: people can post what they like. If you don’t like a thread, don’t post in it.

The last paragraph uses some generalisations that aren’t very useful.

Other than that, your thread contains some good advice.

#3

Fair points.

Thanks for the feedback!

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#4

I agree in general. I hope the devs focus on buffing weak characters right now rather than producing further nerfs. The vast majority of players have never tried half of the cast (they are locked in the open beta behind difficult unlock conditions) nor have access to high level gear. Characters that feel overpowered now may be nothing once people unlock character specific gear.

But you also are being too harsh topic creator. While people calling for ridiculous nerfs to higher tier characters (like removing the auto-aim on Ambra’s beam) are uncalled for, they sometimes have a bit of truth in them. For example, Galilea might still do too much damage for how amazing her skills are. Hopefully they wait a few weeks into release before considering more nerfs for people to calm down. Especially players who never intended to purchase this game and didn’t even take the time to learn the mechanics before crying OP at every character that kills them.

#5

I have a general tendency to be blunt. Not trying to be super aggressive, just tired of belly aching lol.

And I do know that some characters are a bit lackluster in PvP (looking at you whiskey foxtrot) and some seem to have a slight advantage.

So buffing lower characters is far more reasonable than nerfing.

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#6

Now I know my reply might sound a bit aggressive, but it’s not meant that way. (Just my phrasing not always being optimal)

So lets look at some of the points you make:

  • “This isn’t WoW or Lol or any thing similar. This is one of those games where EVERY character is OP.” Actually, I would argue that WoW (or MMORPGs in general) and LoL (or most MOBAs) thend to actually be “one of those games where every character is OP”. The thing is they are usually “OP” in a very small area, with room to play around that / to counter it. Now I agree with you that Battleborn, even though neither a MMORPG or MOBA at its core, is very much a Character Based game where every Character should feel powerful (to the point of OP) in an area. AND ONLY THAT AREA. this is the cruecial part. If a Character is strong in a very specific part but lackluster at everything else, they aren’t OP (the reason why I put OP in " till now). Overpowerd would be if they excel beyond that area to the point where they make other characters obsolete or they just overperform in an area they arent intended to.

  • “So rather than calling for nerf, play the character that destroys you and LEARN how they react and respond so you can take them down.” While learning to play characters that you are bad at playing against is a very good strategy to improve, it sometimes isnt enough (when everyone ends up playing the same character…). Thats the point where you have to really consider a nerf. Sure, you could buff all the other characters but really, how viable is that. Whether to nerf or to buff is at the end of the day gearboxes call (they will probably have an idea of where the characters should be / or a character they consider perfectly balanced and then balance the rest around that one).

  • “Anyway, every character can be defeated, and every character can be considered OP in the right hands or with the right gear. Rather than gripe about losing try to learn what you’re doing wrong and fix it.” Just because every character can be defeated does’t mean he is balanced. Also don’t confuse skill with balancing. However when you reach the point where certain characters just CAN’T compete with others, you can’t just call it skill anymore.

As a final note, I think buffing is generally better then nerfing, however if single characters outperform they should definitly be nerfed! Also, you have really no right to complain about people posting nerf x and nerf y, thats really part of what the forum is for. For feedback, be it jsutified or not. Let the Plebs be Plebs and let them talk.

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#7

Wow, man that casual comment is kinda harsh. Especially considering the game isn’t even out yet.

I disagree that every character is OP. Most of the characters usually excel in certain situations so it’s finding a counter is easy if you know the move set.

Rath - yea, very dangerous up close so I stay away unless I have the advantage.

Benedict - he is fast and mobile but has low health, few options up close and his weapon has a rather slow attack speed.

AMBRA on the other hand. I can’t find any holes in her game. I started using her to find some gaps…I got the most kills on my team EASILY on my first time using her. It took little strategy or experience to rack up kills which leads to a snowball of course which leads to even more kills. I know it’s been addressed thoroughly on here but it makes no sense that a supposed HEALER/SUPPORT character can go head to head with attackers and out damage them. I straight up kill rath 1v1 with Ambra. Something is wrong there.

She has

Crazy DPS primary that homes in and doesnt need to reload. Has a range attack that doubles as a healing station. Has an auto overshield if you even think about killing her with extra mobility thrown in, ya know, just in case you were thinking about chasing her down. An AOE ranged ultimate. She literally has something for all situations.

Now that’s OP.

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#8

Blank nerfs dont balance anything, but galilea needs some fixing. When you nerf you also need to buff something.

#9

We’ve addressed that, I think.

#10

Ha, OK. Fair enough

#11

If you read the balance notes gearboxs says Ambra is supposed to be an offensive/ support. I’ve found her to be managable on overgrowth but very tough in meltdown on paradise. We don’t know the other maps yet so that may be all she excels at. If you have to have an Ambra for that one map then it would be fine. It would be IMPOSSIBLE to make all characters viable for all pvp and pve maps in the game. I don’t disagree she’s a monster but we have to see if it covers other maps/ game modes.

#12

im worried that all the characters that are probably getting nerfed are going to be nerfed into a state where they are going to be fighting an uphill battle the game, and are going to end up needing perfect gear or helix combinations to make them viable. After that Gearbox will realize that the nerf was overdone and realign the characters to either more of what they used to be, or something similar, and we’re going to have to wait a month or two for rebalancing of over nerfed characters, that were fine, but because of the lack of proper testing, had some sort of misinterpretation of what is actually really going on with characters and the game in general.

i’ve played the technical test with a group of 5 friends and we were high level, and basically unbeatable, even when picking random BattleBorn. Some characters were much weaker than others, but because we for the most part had a full communicative team we could always win. In the open beta i’ve played with a full team, and played solo, and obviously playing solo is difficult, not because i’m picking some underpowered character, although there seem to be more underpowered characters here than in the Technical Test, it’s because as an open beta, it’s OPEN, to ANYONE which is of course great, but inherently lends to at one point or another being matched with a total misunderstanding of how the game works, game mechanics, overall experience, etc. Even playing 3 or 4 man teams with randoms It can turn to relying on my friends or myself to push through and win.

There are some characters that I just struggle a lot to even to decent with, there are some characters my friends love, but i just can’t do well with, so perhaps i just don’t mesh with the playstyle, but there are a couple that none of my friends or i can really do well with and have fun doing it. Generally people are unfamiliar with character kits when a game comes out, so as people play the full game and get an understanding of how the game, and game modes work, and how characters work, and what their limitations are, people will understand what really needs nerfing, but more importantly buffing. Then reality will start pouring through and we’ll get down to what is actually happening in the game. Then Gearbox will make the appropriate modifications, but until then there’s no need to jump on the nerf train.

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#13

Soooo aside from the reiterating of my negative comments we seem to be on the same page? Lol

I will say certain characters do seem a little more powerful than others, but as pointed out, Ambra is better at one PvP over the other.

You will find Benedict is better at Incursion where he can just melt the spider sentries.

So on and so forth.

And yes Galilea and Ambra were a bit too powerful.

But in times coming IF one character can be taken down by 15+ characters, I think the problem is buffing the character that can’t take them down, not nerf the character in question.

But once again, Whiskey Foxtrot just sucks and needs to be buffed lol.

I find the most successful heroes are ones you can generously apply their specials.

#14

What whiskey? He’s nowhere near my best but I decimated as him. Without any gear too! He’s much more situational than mike since he lacks a dedicated escape but he’s amazing once you get a feel for his kit. His burst and his sticky took the longest for me to get the hang of against real people. Like all characters you just need a few games to experiment with him. One game doesmt give you the right to critique a character whether playing or vs. I played the CTT as well as the beta and many of the changes went very well. I trust gearbox with their balancing way more than any community.

#15

havent played ambra, but ive watched alot of stealth shampoo. my understanding is her staff generates increasing power? why not start it witg full power and cause her beam to drain it, resulting in a cool down where she can only use melee staff until it refills. upgrades could be increasing power pool for longer time before recharge, increasing dmg the less power it has, and enabling you to use beam again while charging (even drain at slower rate etc.). essentially the mechanic would work as an inverse of montana’s minigun. this would be an easy fix for the cheapest, easiest autoattack in the game and would simultaneously create a higher skill cap while molding ambra better as that attack/support…

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#16

Played as him enough times to get him to 4 or so, problem is I can’t stop comparing to Oscar Mike for obvious reasons, and I’d rather just use full auto than a semi-auto burst.

#17

So your preference decides the nerf? You do know burst means he’s more ranged right and that it allows more accuracy overall than if you just tap the trigger on an auto? It’s not the same. I do understand your reasoning though. Most people do prefer auto but he doesn’t need a buff bc of it. That’s where his ult comes in. It’s much better than mikes if the target is mobile or can easily avoid AoE which most people do.

#18

If your good at fps, anyone with a gun can be op, as for foxtrot, I got my largest kill streak with him (19) in the beta. I would happily say all the characters are balanced or op enough if you play right but ambra is op, oversheild and speed boost makes her near unkillable.

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#19

Ambra’s staff generates heat which she expends on her secondary attack. I played her a lot during the open beta and from my understanding heat doesn’t do anything other than add extra effects/dmg to secondary attacks.

That’s kinda already how it works. She’s fairly well balanced already and her play style tends to keep you on your toes and moving around. She’s pretty damn fragile so forcing her to be a melee character instead of a mid range would kinda suck. I think of her as a warlock/mage kinda deal.

#20

No more nerfs

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