#12

Thatā€™s good to hear. I do hope to see a forum post discussing all the feedback youā€™ve received throughout the beta and what will be done to alleviate any concerns.

#13

Hereā€™s what I posted on reddit in another thread earlier, which should give you guys a bit more info on this.

There are currently several penalties for leaving a match already in place, but these are either not clear or strong enough to disincentivize people from leaving the match. We will almost certainly pursue both education and penalty changes to help get this under control.

The penalties currently in place are:

  • If you leave a PvP match, you cannot join another match until the one you left finishes. You only have the option to re-join.
  • You earn a reduced amount of experience and credits if you are not present at the match end
  • If a team has less than 4 players during character select, you will return to matchmaking in the front end.

We are tracking those who disconnect and do not return to the match and have some other avenues of consequence we can take towards those who are bad sports.

We also expect that getting our skill-based matchmaking running (giving you the chance to match with players closer to your skill level, be that high or low) will go a long way to helping alleviate some of the strain here.

So, no specifics on what further we might do at this point, but this is a major topic of discussion among the devs now. Weā€™re watching and reading your feelings and comments, and want to work to make this a better experience.

An additional detail for my friends on this forum - weā€™re seeing a difference between the actual data regarding leavers in the matches and what is being passionately reported on the forums. In general, the statistics for matching leaving doesnā€™t show a pronounced increase early in the match (which is what these forum posts suggest). The data DOES show a big spike late game, which Iā€™m nearly certain corresponds to being on the losing team later in the match.

Iā€™ve certainly seen some disconnect problems, but in the few dozen games Iā€™ve played the last couple of days, leaving doesnā€™t seem to be as problematic for me as it does for other forum users. The data supports that, meaning either we are not yet looking at the data correctly, or that the problem is a bit rarer than reported.

Either way, this is an issue we are taking seriously, and as I mentioned above, I think there are some steps in place and some steps that we can take in the near future that will help incentivize players to play full matches.

3 Likes
#14

@Jythri, may the data deviate because of the - ime current - fact that leavers, when they realise they are not able to play elsewhere as long as left match continues, tend to re-join but only to, as a form of ā€œprotestā€,
lame about doing next to nothing to support team? That way getting the end benefits but not contributing at all (and in the process corrupting the data).

I e, technically, in the match. But not in reality.

1 Like
#16

That may be another problem that weā€™ll need to address if we see more toxicity emerge. But when we track ā€œleaversā€ weā€™re tracking players who disconnect and then never reconnect in the match.

#17

Itā€™s an option, yes.

Weā€™re trying to balance getting people in matches with the number leaving that makes the game unplayable. Right now, weā€™re seeing plenty of 4/5 matches end with wins, for the players that stick it out and play. Weā€™re measuring how bad this is before we cause anything less than a 5v5 to disconnect, because weā€™re also cautious of the other problem, where players troll-disconnect during character select keeping others out of the match with frequency.

Keep posting your thoughts if they change or progress, and weā€™ll keep watching and measuring.

2 Likes
#18

Tx for providing the more detailed info :thumbsup: and for tracking, addressing and ultimately preventing the multitypes of sabotage.

#19

Just lost an Incursion match (50-73) because our Marquis immediately went AFK and some other player disconnected halfway through, not that he was getting any work done. AFKers should be given a ~2-3 minute timeout, after which theyā€™ll be kicked and replaced with someone from matchmaking, same with disconnects.

2 Likes
#20

Is it possible that you are overestimating the win-ability of 4v5 because the match making in the beta is not consistently matching teams of very close to equal skill against each other? That is if the variance in the skill of the two teams that are being matched is very high then 4v5s will win a fair amount of the time. If match making improves post launch such that very evenly skilled teams are regularly matched against eachother that winrate for a 4v5 should plummet.

I think regardless of the winrate, 4v5 matches have a much higher chance of causing a negative game experience than a 5v5 matches. It is no fun to stomp a team that is down a man, and it is no fun to get overrun when down a man. Even if half of the 4v5 games end up being close, I think most players would much rather wait an extra 2 minutes to start a game than to spend 15-25 minutes in a game with a 50% chance of being a lost cause / easy win. If the community is over-reporting the incidence of leavers / disconnecters I would take that as an indication that the times it does happen are highly frustrating and leaves a strong impression in players minds.

FWIW I think League of Legends has a very good system for this and a very low rate of leavers so I would really recommend considering adopting existing systems from one of the competitive team based games that have been tested by millions of players over the course of years, at least as a starting point. Then you can see if Battleborn needs something a bit different, but why not at least take the industry standard as a starting point?

EDIT: One final thought. Someone disconnecting for the first five minutes and coming back is still a significant and frustrating disadvantage. It is probably annoying enough that people will complain about it on the forums so if people are including those events was posting about their experience but those events are not included in your data that might explain some of the discrepancy.

EDIT 2: I in no way mean to complain, I just really want your game to succeed and think this issue is a major one that can have a big impact on the games success, I hope this doesnā€™t come off as negative, I love BB :slight_smile:

3 Likes
#21

I love this game, but itā€™s honestly annoying starting out every single match at level 1, having to grind to level 10 and around the time I get to level 4 or 5 they either RQ like crazy or surrender. The technical test had way more competitive matches.

#22

I left Story/Public (on my friendā€™s account) due to running out of lives and there seeming to be no point to sticking around, but leaving during a match is completely unacceptable, even if your team is totally fresh or junk.

#23

The problem with punishment is that it solves nothing. If they quit they canā€™t join another game, until the one they joined is done. That is enough. If you apply some kind of other punishment, all they will do is let the game run with their character standing in the corner. I have seen that happen too often, anyway.
Balancing the game accordingly would be any kind of solution.

#24

You know what causes toxicity and frustration? Playing many games in a row, of pvp, and consistently not being able to perform well or win. Obviously the some of that is personal performance and canā€™t really be taken into the equation but the not winning several games in a row is a huge deal. Especially when they are not even close games like itā€™s been a rofl stomp 5 games in a row type of deal. All different teams. Honestly, what is the point of playing when there is no foreseeable way to bounce back? You might as well concede at that point or go do something else. That is not ā€˜ggā€™ material that is ā€˜rageā€™.

Iā€™ll admit I left during a match because I was not up for round 6 of getting stomped. I have no idea what is strong or weak yet and getting owned every single match is not making me like this. Is there some glitch or some exploit Iā€™m not using? Iā€™m not a great player but I at least like to think I understand the basics. For example, seeing people with Thorn do 20-0 and then I try it some games and canā€™t even do better than maybe like 3 and many deaths.

Just to say it, sometimes people have to leave a match for a much better reason like time constraints and something real life happens. How is any kind of system going to account for legit quits?

#25

Every existing MOBA has this problem and there are standard established solutions that deal with it quite well. In League for example, if you quit during a game your team can report you for quitting. If you get reported once every now and then nothing happens. If you do it frequently then the automated system notices and bans you from multiplayer for increasing periods of time.

Same thing for intentionally feeding the enemy team / trolling / afking etc. There is a similar system for berating your team mates / being racist / etc where the in game chat logs are also reviewed. The system also keeps track of how much each player reports others and how often the rest of the team also reports and ignores reports from players who report lots of people when the rest of their team does not.

If you quit during champion select (after the queue finds a match) you lose ladder points as though you lost and you cannot join the queue again for 5 minutes (increasing each time you dodge the queue). There is also an AFK check prior to entering champ select so that if you queue and go afk and a match is found you are not penalized.

4 Likes
#26

[quote=ā€œW4cky, post:24, topic:1345426ā€]You know what causes toxicity and frustration? Playing many games in a row, of pvp, and consistently not being able to perform well or win. Obviously the some of that is personal performance and canā€™t really be taken into the equation but the not winning several games in a row is a huge deal. Especially when they are not even close games like itā€™s been a rofl stomp 5 games in a row type of deal. All different teams. Honestly, what is the point of playing when there is no foreseeable way to bounce back? You might as well concede at that point or go do something else. That is not ā€˜ggā€™ material that is ā€˜rageā€™.[/quote]In a word, demoralization.

#27

Yeah thatā€™s the word I was looking for.

#28

I can tell you that I, personally, would rather wait a few more minutes in matchmaking than start a game 4v5 100% of the time, no excepions, no hesitation. 4v5s may not be completely unwinnable, but theyā€™re frustrating enough that Iā€™d really rather not play them.

One thing to consider is how it feels to lose a 4v5. If you get stomped in a 5v5, you at least know that their team played better than your thing. When you get stomped in a 4v5, you just feel like you never had a chance and the whole game was a waste of 10-20 minutes of your life.

Couldnā€™t trolls be addressed by simply temporarily stopping someone from entering matchmaking if they disconnect during character select, with an increasing penalty each time? The first time, no penalty or lock them out for a minute or two, the second time, lock them out for maybe 15 minutes, then half an hour, etc. Anyway, if someoneā€™s determined to waste other peopleā€™s time, doesnā€™t them quitting and leaving people in a 4v5 waste even more time?

4 Likes
#29

Gigantic has a system that only starts games with 5v5. If anyone leaves, disconex, everyone gets booted back to start screen. Many a reason why twitchers refer to playing gigantic as ā€˜queue simulatorā€™. Iā€™ve spent over halves to hours just trying to play one game. Iā€™m surprised battleborn doesnā€™t have a bot system in place.

#31

The matchmaking and quitting players is the very reason I havenā€™t pre-ordered Battleborn yet. I loved the beta, made it to level 83 and still couldnā€™t stop playingā€¦ yet I donā€™t think I can go through a 4 v 5 game nearly every game just to get pounded on for a half hour and lose. Something does need to be done about it before I purchase the gameā€¦at this point Iā€™m waiting for the Overwatch beta to see how their matchmaking runs. I am willing to buy both games should it seem worthwhile. But with the number inactive, disconnected, and leaving players in battleborn itā€™s beyond frustrating. 4 v 5 in a game where every player participating counts in not acceptable in my opinion. I had spurts where nobody quit, other night I had the opposite, and couldnā€™t get in a game with a full teamā€¦ that is when I shut off battleborn. As the beta went on it got worseā€¦maybe itā€™s a beta thing and people not caring for that reason. But to risk spending that money on a game where I know most matches will be 20+ minutes long, and having no chance because someone had to leave, rage quit, or just lost connectionā€¦ well theres no reason, it becomes a waste of time in a sense, because who plays to lose?! Occasionally the team of 4 will win, but that is greatly out shadowed by the number of losses.

#32

I think that as the real game progresses, match making will filter out leavers (maybe not disconnectors) from constant players. Especially in ranked.

#33

Just tried to play 3 straight matches where someone left as soon as we started. I agree with the WOW penalty.

Also Iā€™ve had a problem where two or so members of the group never leave the ship on meltdown. They just walk around the whole match and never help. Should have a penalty for idk what kind of player does this unless their friends are on the opposing team.