Please don't let micro transactions or loot boxes ruin borderlands 3


(LootHunter) #244

Millions of people, millions of disagreements. We all have likes and dislikes.

But tell me one thing. If your so against cosmetics in games, please tell why you didn’t relate to real world consumerism, where global corporates make billions from add-ons. Apple for one instance.

It’s the world we live. And without adding too much of a cliche, remember everyone is different and yes people do love the cosmetics in games. I’m surprised you haven’t picked up on this from all the social media forums or other gamers?? If people didn’t want them they would never have appeared in the main stream. Simple really.

edit: actually one thing i didn’t hit on - the prices they charge. it’s fair enough giving people options, but the prices they charge can be a little…uh ‘extreme’. And i’m sure we’ll all agree on that fact.


(How much time do we have?) #245

So just to make sure I understand you: if you pay say $60 USD for BL3, you’re saying that there should never be any extra cosmetic packs sold for BL3, even if those require more work to produce than simple palette or texture swaps?


(Guajiro Pandoreño) #246

They’re the same, and you’ll never guess what they gave those of us who owned the Orange Box when the Free-to-Play version came out. :cowboy_hat_face:

Seriously though, I’m glad they did this. I still consider the Orange Box an epic bundle, and the player volume is way higher now, extending the life of the game.


(Matrixneo42) #247

Please god. Especially not battle royale formula.


(Matrixneo42) #248

Speaking of, where the hell is a modern console port of the orange box?


(How much time do we have?) #249

Good question. Is it even on backwards compatibility for XB1 yet? I just saw that Jedi Academy: Jedi Knight appears to be getting that treatment later this month, and it’s an original XBox game!


(Matrixneo42) #250

I am all for DLC for comestic items because it satisfies the corporate A-holes. And players don’t seem to mind it. AND it doesn’t stop me from enjoying the game without feeling like I have to spend more real money to be relevant in the game.


(Matrixneo42) #251

That said, I am really tired of the recent trend for games to focus so much on loot crates. Usually I end up opting to not bother opening them after I have opened the 50th one. About 20 in, I started skipping the animation as fast as possible. Then I check my inventory later. I need to receive less crates for them to be meaningful and to have such fanfare. Also, give me a way to mass open all crates and show me the results.

Video game companies need to stop thinking that we love the fanfare of opening the crate. It’s just a %^#*ing virtual box onscreen. One click, open in half a second, show ALL results (don’t show them one at a time). Easy to click DONE. I just don’t get why anyone thinks it should be anything more than that.

Examples: Fortnite : save the world, walking dead: our world, Battleborn, most freemium iOS games, overwatch, even rocket league, etc.


(Guajiro Pandoreño) #252

Neither you nor I seem to like this, but apparently quite a few people do (and not understanding why they like it doesn’t mean they don’t). Are video game companies wrong about this? Thousands of YouTube publishers and viewers would like a minute for rebuttal.

Not having played Fortnite, are those screens skippable? This way, developers cater to two ends of the spectrum: players who love the fanfare can watch the whole thing; the more Spartan among us can cancel that and nose through it as we see fit.


(LootHunter) #253

Yes indeed. It’s irritating as hell.

But some people actually make popular youtube content on opening them…oh boy.

I shan’t keep this thread going, i’m fed up with this hysteria that’s going on. To me it’s simple. I look at a game, i try and play it via Alpha or Beta or Demo and make a decision on the actual game play. I really couldn’t give a ■■■■ about anything else. If others want to spend billions on looking fancy, that’s up to them. Just like people spending billions on phone and car cosmetics.


(What does it all mean!?) #254

Yes, that’s correct, if you pay full price for a game, you should not be charged for cosmetic extras as that idea comes from the free to play economy and should stay in free to play games. With regards to my comments on TF2, I was referring to the fact that they didn’t sell skins until the game went F2P, which is its own model. The fact other industries sell add-ons doesn’t make it right there either. The issue is not whether people love cosmetic items, but that companies exploit that love and charge additionally for them instead of including them in the product you bought.

Timely enough, I’m linking a recent, in my opinion excellent video that details why microtransactions and selling additional cosmetics and/or loot crates in full price is such a big deal. It is a 20 min video I realize so I will summarize some of the key reasons why I feel so strongly about this.

  • The main one is that games are being made worse by design as a result of this. What is the point of making something interesting or cool in a game (such as skins) when you can sell it later as an extra? Why not make the game a bit more grindy and have more filler so you can then sell XP boosters, while claiming, “well you can just play it ‘normally’”. Therefore, games are purposely made worse as a result.

  • There is no evidence that these additional purchases are going to developers or are actually needed to support developers. The major gaming companies are more successful than they have ever been, yet they are laying off staff and including not less, but more microtransactions. Most major publishers are spending less on actual game development as a % of their overall spending. It is part of a cycle of unsustainable growth not based around what should be their core business of making and selling games. If you want to sell extras, make the game F2P as that’s how that model works, if you want to make full price games, then put these “extras” (which have been extras recently, in the past they would have just part of the game) in the game.

video does contain some profanity


(Matrixneo42) #255

I played fortnight save the world for a little bit. The loot boxes can be fast forwarded, but it’s still annoying. I still get too many crates in that game to have any interest in paying attention to what I’m getting. And rarer crates have an extra step to open them. Like they are a harder to open piñata. Just give me an option at the very first crate in a game “always open crates fast with no BS? yes/no”

I hate to be one of those guys, but you start to look around sometimes and see where video gaming is headed, and it makes you kinda sad / annoyed. Especially in the freemium category…

Un-skippable 30 minute tutorials that treat you like an idiot, re-build the city on timers, gems and coins, cards that upgrade by getting more of the same card and spending coins, 5+ second long loot crate open animations that might even make you confirm each item received one at a time, match 3 clones, clash of clan clones, clones of clones, clones. Etc…


(Matrixneo42) #256

I do get what you’re saying. That said, Rocket League fits into this. Paid game but you earn cosmetic items as you play and you can earn crates that need a paid key to unlock. Those crates also contain cosmetics.

But… the core of Rocket League is fantastic car soccer gameplay. And in it’s case, the DLC doesn’t affect that. With or without the DLC, the game is damn fun to play. The game isn’t worse for having it.

I will say this, even. You get XP as you play rocket league. Quitting a match early or full team vote to forfeit will get you less or no xp for matches you play. So, if anything the XP system, at least, rewards you for being a “better player” or rather, “not being a poor sport”. That’s just the XP side of things.


(Matrixneo42) #257

Look upon the field where I grow *&#(s. See that it is barren. Know that I have none to give. LOL

They could still make their videos with crates that opened in half a second and showed all items received at once. Leave it up to a player or a youtubber to spend more time looking at the items. Don’t make us all suffer the waste of time.


(Guajiro Pandoreño) #258

We’ll said. :+1:


(LootHunter) #259

Do you not just think that this is because of how the gaming industry has changed though? The advent of the internet in such a big way and social media, gaming has become a far more social interaction, and all these cosmetics and sharing pics of such and loot drops is now the norm.

Many of these big publishers are no different to other corporate companies, surely? They are making money in what ever way they can and seeing how people react. Personally i don’t give a ■■■■ about the cosmetics being sold, i only care about the quality of the game.

Right now i’m playing Anthem, and when yo look through twitter it’s filled with screen shots of the Javelins. Evidence that cosmetics are the front of new games. Lots of people asking about getting new ones available in the game.


What was the last game you played?
(What does it all mean!?) #260

I don’t want to go into too much length because I feel I’ve already said my piece on this issue (and linked to a video presenting those points in a far more entertaining format that my text), I’ll just reiterate what I said above that I am concerned about all of this because I believe removal of what was normal content in games (cosmetics included) is part of a cycle making games worse overall, as like you, I only really care about the quality of the game. I personally did not like Anthem (I played the free demo) and won’t be playing it, but that’s just my opinion and my reasons for not liking it aren’t relevant here. To bring this back around to the OP, I’m very concerned these recent gaming practices will be forced upon GBX by Take 2 and lead to BL3 having far less content and being less good overall than BL2. BL3 has a great chance to stand out from its current competitors by launching in a finished state with a lot of content and few bugs, but I’m concerned as a fan of the franchise that Take 2 won’t allow that to happen.


(LootHunter) #261

Kinda makes you wonder who wears the big boy pants in some of the gaming companies. BioWare should not have released Anthem in its state. And it definitely goes along the road your talking about. I’d like to think that Gearbox’s status is far more substantial now they have publishing to their name, and wouldn’t be doing anything unless they say. Be interesting to hear what goes on in the boardroom meetings…

However. Not sure if you played Battleborn? But there was a big presence of Cosmetics and other MTX in that game. So i personally don’t see a new Borderlands being any different to the norm now. But the fact B2 had cosmetics in it, just can’t help to think it would be in B3 but more in depth.

I hope B3 will stick to the same method of earning heads and skins from looting, not going to the server side shop. That would be a tragedy for sure.


(What does it all mean!?) #262

I played a lot of Battleborn actually from release onwards. When the final update was released that seemed mainly to sell me more skins at exorbitant prices, I uninstalled the game and haven’t thought about it much since. I feel MTX (including cosmetics) actively harmed that game, though I won’t go far as to say it “killed” the game as no one factor did that. I had a number of other issues with the game, but this is not the thread for that.

Many many posts ago in this thread, I said that the absolute best we can hope for in BL3 is similar monetization to BL2 and I stand by that, despite not liking aspects of BL2’s monetization (that I’ve already gone over and so won’t again). EA straight up owns the majority of the gaming companies that produce games for it (including BioWare) whereas Take 2 does not own GBX as far as I can tell. I do hypothesize that Take 2 has an equity stake in the Borderlands IP, but that’s just a guess on my part based partly on the fact GBX now publishes titles, but hasn’t released a remastered BL1 despite the fact that would seem to sell far better than We Happy Few or Bulletstorm. A quick round of googling provides little to no evidence for or against my guess. It does say the license for the Borderlands IP for Tales from the Borderlands was provided by GBX AND Take 2, but that’s not enough evidence to back my guess.

I know there are rumors that a BL1 remaster is coming, but I’m guessing it will be through Take 2, though I hope not. As I said above, I think these MTX practices are harming games and I really hope Take 2 doesn’t force enough into BL3 to lower the quality and amount of content in it.


(˙pǝsɹǝʌǝɹ uǝǝq sɐɥ ʎʇıʌɐɹƃ ʃɐuosɹǝd ʎW) #263

I can tell you now, Take2 has exclusive borderlands publishing rights. Period. Gearbox owns the IP, but if they want to release a new game, It has to be through take2 or someone they allow. Which is how they can force Randy to add those cosmetics.