I’d like to put at least one caveat on that: if either you have symptoms or know that you have been exposed to the virus and are still in the 14 day incubation period AND you need to go out somewhere, then mask use should be absolutely mandatory.
It’s kind of scary just how little we know about asymptomatic community spread and super-spreaders right now, just because a lot of the testing that’s been done has focussed on those with symptoms and/or high risk.
This is a hard one to answer.
If we are mandated to wear a mask, it should be all or none. Not state by state, county by county, etc.
One example that just doesn’t work is that you hear that State A phase 2 in place. You live in state B who hasn’t even started phasing, yet, but see other states are. Not even that, a county in your state has gone to phase 1. There is going to be some animosity.
Never said that masks don’t protect you and others. Just human nature to rebel, right or wrong. So these states that have loosened up their restrictions are putting innocent lives at risk ? No, they expect everyone to make responsible decisions.
But, media now think we cannot make responsible decisions in the areas that have loosened restrictions and they report the Virus is on the rise. These states haven’t changed a thing with this news. If anything, they’ve become complacent (at least where I am).
Take state B resident. How do you think they feel about this?
One side, they are like, “why do we still have to wait this out? My life can’t still stay on hold, financially.”
Other side is, “Look at those fools! They are silently killing themselves (and others).”
This half ass attempt at controlling a country doesn’t work.
All or nothing. I go with nothing.
Interesting point, I did not expect an argument against state rights in this. I think you have a good point here, but I’m not sure how it would hold up legally speaking depending on how it was implemented.
I will say this though, mask mandates are a rare case of a public safety law which actually makes sense. Both from the perspective that there’s a clear cause, and that much like helmet laws it’s easily visible.
Apart from that… my support for this kind of action is from a brutally simple point. Namely that almost all of what America is going through is from governmental mistakes. Essentially all of this, from the pandemic to the recession could’ve been mitigated extremely by basic precautions. A combination of a mask mandate, testing/tracing, and isolation for infected could have outright stopped the pandemic in its tracks. And the recession while it was due (we saw indicators for this last year), would not have been this severe if not for the pandemic.
Realistically the only near inevitable in this situation was a recession of some kind, but even the damage from that is mostly due to incompetence.
This is harsh to say. But saying it:
Pandemic has been the cleansing of unhealthy people and unstable businesses.
I’d almost agree, except it’s also killed people who weren’t doing stupid things or being unhealthy. And I’m actually worried that the finance sector will collapse, given it’s essentially a castle built on air at this point. Further, there are gross differences in circumstances of businesses. A small restaurant doesn’t have a lot of options, whereas huge failing businesses that are already drags on the economy? Got bailouts.
OK…addendum…”A lot of” on both instances.
It’s a fair point. Admittedly if being an idiot resulted in death normally we’d probably all be dead, but it’s a fair point. And made me smile. Which admittedly says uncomfortable things about my sense of humor.
Did you know this?
No, but unsurprised. I argued against this method of implementation for good reason. Not only did it cost in the hundreds of billions range to get the checks to people (similar to the value of the checks themselves!), but the means testing and fumbling methods meant things like this happened. Should’ve just cut a check to every American and got it back from the rich next year in taxes instead of trying to do things the complicated way.
Ok, this isn’t good. We are agreeing on something. XD
Back to some discussion:
My stance
Choice =
Abortion
Gun rights
Masks
You’re pro-choice? Mildly surprised, I’d presumed you were a conservative. Regardless, as mentioned before I’m socially libertarian, so I’m hardly going to argue against anything there except the masks. Which in the case of the pandemic I think we should’ve responded forcefully to.
Like I said a while back, I lean conservative. But I think our individual rights are constantly being abused. Most of my views are from personal experiences. Not from what I am constantly bombarded with as what my label should be.
I’m an independent on the books. My wife calls me an Indecisive.
I’m a registered independent as well, albeit in my case I’m opposed to partisanship in general in addition to not fitting into a party policy view wise.
I work retail at an essential business. I’ve got a relative in the hospital with covid who isn’t doing good. This has been a miserable year. PLEASE wear masks.
Agreed, albeit I think everyone in this thread does when out and around people as far as I recall. Still a good message. Hope your family member recovers.
It’s tough when different jurisdictions have different rules, doubly so if you happen to live close to the boundary.
Here it’s tied to proximity: you’re allowed to mingle in your ‘bubble’ of immediate family + select friends and neighbours (was 5 now 10) as long as yadayada; out and about generally only if 6 feet rule can’t be maintained; and certain specific situations are “at all times” - anything medical and the subway are the two I know about.
We are being encouraged to wear a mask at all times even if 6 feet can be maintained, which makes sense in my context because you never now when someone will step out of a store or home directly in front of you etc.
Overall, I’d say it’s fair and reasonable. Doesn’t stop some folks from being dumb schmucks, but then you can’t fix dumb.
Jesus - I leave for 5 hours and return to a libertarian circle-jerk. PUT ME IN THE MIDDLE.
It’s funny how much we all broadly agree on in here. Too often we focus on the little differences. (Like that time Temet supported using the government to enforce a mask mandate - at gunpoint if need be.)
But, if our biggest small-difference is whether someone should be cited for not wearing a mask, I say… Tricorner hats for all! And LETS GO BLUES.
Behold! I give onto you the World’s Greatest Deliberative Body! The Senate of the United States! Standing together to debate with the utmost sincerity the most pressing issues facing our Nation.
Oh… So wait - they chose to block the bill from coming to the floor for debate? But… why? Why not debate this all in public so we can all see and hear what each Senator thinks?
Well, either way - I’m sure our Senators are treating this issue with the seriousness it deserves.
“It’s interesting that we are on the right side of the police reform conversation, yet we’re on the wrong side according to the people, based on the way that we are characterized in the national press,” Scott told the Times.
Republicans were already going after Democrats ahead of Wednesday’s procedural vote, a sign of the partisan discord surrounding debate over the issue.
Cornyn said that Democratic opposition to beginning debate on a police reform bill is “completely insane” and said he is not interested in negotiating with “hostage takers.”
“It’s completely insane,” Cornyn told reporters moments after Senate Democrats said they would block the bill on a procedural vote Wednesday unless Republicans reached an agreement with them to allow votes on amendments to change the bill.
Cornyn argued Democrats should vote to let the debate begin and allow each side to offer amendments and that Democrats could block going to a final vote if they were not satisfied with the makeup of the bill at the point.
“It’s just mindless obstruction,” he said. “It’s the worst I’ve ever seen it.”
Democrats have also used strong language in criticizing the GOP proposal.
“Tim Scott’s bill is a half-assed bill that doesn’t do what we should be doing, which is doing honest police reform,” Sen. Mazie Hirono, a Hawaii Democrat, said earlier this week.
Frankly, I’m unsure how I could be more disappointed in my fellow citizens right now.
Sigh. Goddammit.
Tit-for-tat, I believe. The R’s have said the Democrat version in the other chamber is DoA. Obviously it would be better if common ground was being debated in both, but apparently that’s impossible. And it might be all moot anyway: I give anything that actually manages to seap through the cracks and come out the other side a 50:50 chance of presidential veto (if it happens before the end of the current term)
They are petulant little children who have, somehow, been elected to represent us.