Sell the Duke rights now!

(Wesker500) #21

After DNF I still had some faith that Gearbox could deliver a solid Duke experience and had some understanding of the character, recent efforts have proven otherwise and they haven’t done anything to suggest that they understand the character nor have any intention to take him back to his action hero roots or develop him as a person, Gearbox is pushing their Borderlands meme humor on Duke and further making him into a Saints Row type parody.

This is why I’m hopeful for more spin off Duke games done by non Gearbox developers so the character can be experimented with from different points of view, some may do Duke in the classic action hero way for old times sake and some may try to develop him as a person more, who knows with what multiple developers can do.

But a main Gearbox entry is clearly going to keep this “Hashtag: Busy Killing Things!” Duke which is just painful to put up with, so yes Gearbox has got to go.

(Damien Azreal) #22

I find I’m more surprised by how “Duke fans” are reacting to the Bulletstorm DLC then anything else.
Taking it as some written in stone sign of how the next Duke game will be. When, it’s nothing more then a small little add-on for the hell of it.
Dialog that had to be written around existing dialog.

Hell, the majority of Duke’s dialog is just Grayson’s with a few words changed.
Grayson’s line “It’s a murder party, staring me!”… Duke’s… “It’s a murder party, staring the King!”…

I do disagree with the idea that Duke should be funny. But, that’s not a GBX idea. That was something that came around years ago on the 3DR forums. With tons of posts, threads and comments about things that should be in DNF cause… “FUNNY!”.
And then talk of previous stories that were so funny, and George and people talking about how funny Duke is, and that is.
DN3D is a mostly serious action game, with a few small samples of sarcasm and chuckles brought on by the “I get it” movie reference.

DNF… 3DRealms missed the boat, and took a very small element of the previous game and tried to make it larger then it originally was.
And, yes, the story and majority of the dialog for DNF was in place before they closed up in 2009. Small changes were additions or newer references, and a few ad-libs by JSJ.

But, I personally don’t feel the Bulletstorm DLC is indicative of anything other then it was held back by having to fit within the existing dialog in the game. That severely limits what is capable, and really, putting Duke in what is actually a very emotionally driven story… is an odd choice.
It doesn’t fit working around the existing story. One second, something bad happens to Ishi, Duke comments like he doesn’t care. But, because the game and story require it… the next scene he has to rush to Ishi’s side to help him. It’s a very narrowly focused DLC and not a full showing of anything.

(Wesker500) #23

It’s not just Bulletstorm, it’s also World Tour and just how Gearbox seems to be handling Duke.
Their lack of direction for JSJ is the big issue with Duke himself, they’re not directing him cause they have no idea what kind of Duke they want so they just let Jon do it as he pleases(They also did it with Michael Biehn in Colonial Marines, but we all know they just didn’t care with that).
Duke Nukem can not have a voice change, the Duke voice is easily the biggest part of the character and if they’re going to change it they may as well not even bother with the Duke IP at all and just make a brand new character.
It would be Sam Fisher all over again and rumor is they realized that mistake and Ironside is returning.

Duke needs to be that 80s Action Hero, it’s what made him legendary, sure they can tweak him to be more of a person, but the 80s Action Hero has to be the main priority.

On a related note, has Randy been watching us talk about Duke?

(Damien Azreal) #24

Because Michael is such a great voice actor. :wink: :stuck_out_tongue:
I mean, I loved him in Blood Dragon, but he sounds terrible there. His bad work as a voice actor worked in Blood Dragon because of the tone of the game. Just because he can be a good actor, doesn’t mean he can be a good voice actor.

Completely different set of skills. And, Michael just really doesn’t have that skill set.

(Wesker500) #25

No because Michael Biehn also said himself that Gearbox didn’t direct him so he had very little to work with and didn’t like working with them.

(GAR) #26

a Duke Nukem concept

(GAR) #27

I believe the only rights Gearbox has related to Duke, is for Duke Nukem Forever. (Look up Duke Nukem on the U.S. copyright website and see for yourself). It would explain why they haven’t made a legit “NEW” Duke Nukem game, and maybe even the reason why they stuck him into a game that isn’t “HIS”, that of course being Bulletstorm.

I’m certain that GBX is keen on finding LOOPHOLES.

(Nuclear Failure) #28

I agree with Wesker completely in this thread and it has just been confirmed by George Broussard here.

The poor characterization in Duke Forever, World Tour and Bulletstorm which I have seen a great many complaints about…these are also the only titles George Broussard did not direct the dialogue for!

Gearbox seems to want Duke to be total comedy…doesn’t anyone remember the old Duke game? Comedy was there but was not forced down the throat like in new games…

Even 2001 trailer and Zero Hour commercial show more the Duke that people seem to want.

On the topic of Slipgate…I say Rise of the Triad was fun but has many issues though when you read in to it the game was developed by people working for free - Their marketing guy Dave Oshry funded showing the game at events and overhead costs - and it was their first ever game, Bombshell was very clearly rushed probably due to retooling after Duke legal issue…I also thought it was priced too high but Voidpoint is doing new BUILD FPS based on Bombshell so something good is coming out of it…Rad Rodgers is actually fantastic with very good art and gameplay!

I would like to see them work on a Duke game but only as spin-off like Eurocom did, maybe polished re-release of the Zero Hour game or a new side-scroller in Unreal Engine 4.

(Damien Azreal) #29

You are incorrect.

In 2009/2010 when Gearbox stepped in to help Triptych finish DNF, they bought the IP and struck a deal with Take Two/2K.
That purchase granted GBX full ownership of the Duke Nukem IP from DNF and future.
So, DNF and any future Duke Nukem games were (at that time) fully owned by GBX.

3D Realms retained rights to all Duke Nukem titles released prior to DNF.

This all changed when Interceptor started development on a top down Duke Nukem shooter, violating copyright law. As they were developing a new Duke Nukem game without approval from GBX, and without a license to do so.

As settlement from that lawsuit, Gearbox gained complete ownership of the Duke Nukem IP. Past, present and future. 3DR lost ownership to all previous Duke titles, and GBX gained full ownership and control of the Duke Nukem trademark.

(GAR) #30

You are so full of sh*t.

I think the whole team at Gearbox is full of ■■■■ and If you don’t like me saying so, and are tired of everyone calling the company out on these forums, THEN DON’T HAVE FORUMS!

Y’ all can’t continue “sweeping the dirt under the rug” and not expect consumers to be disappointed with your product.

(Damien Azreal) #31

I will warn you once, if you cannot maintain a conversation in a civil and mature manor, or without calling other users names… don’t post.

It is against the rules of the forum, the same rules you agreed to when you joined.

(Wesker500) #32

The whole Parody Duke started when Gearbox got involved, 3DR had nothing to do with it as George just confirmed.
JSJ even confirmed more evidence to this back when DNF was released, on top of him not being directed in anyway, he said that the Duke lines were “written by 2 women”, clearly those women(who were at Triptych I think) had no understanding of Duke either, Triptych and Gearbox are the ones to blame.

On top of that Randy just continues to show he has no idea what he’s doing when it comes to Duke and continues to make relations with the Duke community even worse.
He said World Tour was not designed for the core Duke community, yet the game’s key marketing point was the new episode done by the original developers, how the “original developers” wasn’t for the core community is beyond me.
Because whether it was for a wider audience or for the core Duke fans, Gearbox failed horribly and both audiences hate Gearbox more.
Even worse he expected the core Duke fanbase to hype up the poorly made and overpriced World Tour for him when the core Duke community was already furious at him for canceling the Hail to the King collection and removing the Megaton Edition.

He even has the nerve to say that the core community is useless to Duke’s Future, every single day the Duke community continues to make far better Duke content while Gearbox continues to plummet.
That whole DNF2013 mod was pushed to mainstream media news by how great it was and how much the core community loved it and was pushing it.
The core community is only useless to Gearbox’s Duke future cause they have to earn our praise to support their products and Gearbox hasn’t made any attempt to earn anyone’s praise in general.
After Borderlands 2 Gearbox has been going down hill and building up backlash, Colonial Marines was Colonial Marines, Battleborn was shown up by Overwatch and is now barren, World Tour was an
epic failure and Bulletstorm’s rerelease was shown up by Bayonetta’s rerelease with 3 times as many players and much larger audience praise.
Let’s not forget when Randy sung that song insulting gamers.

It’s incredible just how much Randy is holding himself up to the “I’M NEVER WRONG!!” standard.

I almost feel sorry for him, part of me believes he has good intentions, but his actions just…sigh

(Nuclear Failure) #33

I enjoyed the new World Tour episode but that was the only positive part of that re-release. The omission of the third party expansions thus making them unable to be purchased anywhere is negative. Randy defends this by saying that they aren’t necessary but if that’s so why not include them as a free bonus anyway? What could it hurt? The previous re-releases included them and less content is less value… The so called updated graphics were just a rip off of the Polymer renderer…poor Duke characterization by Pitchford and company continued with lines such as ‘Bazinga!’ and Jon St. John sounding like he had absolutely no interest in what he was doing during the voice sessions…

I applaud Gearbox for getting Lee Jackson, Levelord and Allen Blum involved. That was great work. Everything else about the release was total rubbish. There wasn’t even any effort given to fans who had previous purchased Megaton Edition that they had removed from Steam, no discount voucher, no free copy, no nothing. How do you think that looks? Do you think people will be encouraged to buy more Duke Nukem titles when you treat owners of the game that way?

Those Tweets are terrible too. Randy basically saying the Duke fan community is terrible and he just wants to make money.

Fair enough you run a business you rely on income…do you think the best way to make a profit is to alienate the fan base of the franchise? Omit content from previous re-releases and your only reason for doing so is ‘just because’? What about all the other Duke games that aren’t available for purchase? 1/2/3Ds third party expansions/Manhattan Project for starters…

(GAR) #34

And like Jon St. Jon might be a talented Voice Over Artist, he may not quite possess the necessary timing skills and subtleties needed to take Duke Nukem away from what was essentially a cartoon character and into more of a Real person.
Jons voice plays out more like internal dialogue in the original games and he also never interacted with anyone and had conversations. Today, things are different and Duke is in cinematic cutscenes sharing dialogue with other characters but Dukes dialogue still plays out like internal voice or conscience and he seems disconnected.

(GAR) #35

Sounds too “Hollywood” for Texas.

(Damien Azreal) #36

I would agree with that.
It’s something I’ve noticed in recent games like DNF or World Tour. And something I’ve noticed when returning to titles like Manhatten Project or Zero Hour.

Duke doesn’t have a wide range of inflection in his voice. Everything seems about one tone, not yelling… but in that style. Loud, gruff… and almost without emotion. Which does detract from him in some ways.

Now, I’m a huge Duke fan. I have a shelf in my office just for Duke. I’ve loved each game for different reason (except Land of the Babes… just… awful). And being in the credits for DNF (no matter what public opinion) was awesome for me.
But, I want Duke to be more then what he has been in the past. I want Duke to show the kind of growth that Grayson does in Bulletstorm. That Lo Wang does in the 2013 reboot of Shadow Warrior.

To be human.

And, it’s a fine line.
It’s why I was hesitant about this thread. Topics like these have a trend of devolving into nothing but issues, which leads to more work as a mod. I partially expected it to be nothing more then “Bash GBX, blah, blah”… which would’ve gotten it closed.
But, I’m glad to see this thread continue in a decent manor. And, as long as it does so… I’m fine with it.
But, Duke fans are very fickle. And, there’s no way to really make everyone happy. Some want DN3D again. And that’s all they want.
Others, saw possibility in game’s like Zero Hour and want more of that. Some, loved DNF and are happy with that.
And others, like me, want something… new, but serious. Darker in tone, but engaging in action… and just a thin slip of sarcasm and black humor.

And, sadly, no matter what… there will be those that will be upset.
I know Duke Nukem fans, people that have been fans since DN3D that think the Bulletstorm DLC is hilarious and great. I know some that hate DNF, some that love DNF. Some that hated every side game like Zero Hour or Time to Kill, some that were only okay with them.
It’s a tricky situation to try and handle, and I think what GBX are doing right now is trying a few different things to see how people feel about it.

And, the more mature and decent fans can communicate that to GBX, the better the chance of them taking the feedback seriously.
Cause, I can tell you first hand, if you have two people telling you something. But ones just telling you how awful something is because of you… and the other is offering criticism and suggestions, the second guy is gonna be heard more clearly no matter how much or how loud the first guy screams.

(GAR) #37

Sorry. When I initially posted this link I didn’t have the video set to be viewed PUBLIC on my facebook page. It should work now.

(GAR) #38

I too am a huge fan.
Sometimes I get caught up in my own take on the character and can often come across as a hardass in online forums related to Duke.
I feel as though I have some decent ideas on how to handle new games but for me, I want to tie them in with two feature films.

I propose doing a re-imagining based off the first two original Duke Nukem games. Making the game 3rd person pov and even isometric and/or side scrolling and be a combination of Duke 1 and 2, while at the same time, building a film script around it (if one doesn’t exist already) and releasing the First Duke Nukem movie the same time as the game, based off the movie/based off the game. Like the 'ol days.

I have written a Duke Script of my own which I feel could be the follow up to the first First Duke movie and game, similar to Duke Nukem 3D. It’s an ambitious story to produce but I feel confident that with a modest budget for the first game and film and a talented crew behind it, it could help us to be able to afford a bigger budget for the follow up game/film.

I hope this makes sense…

Anyway, I’m a huge Duke fan and want to see a different take on him. So much so I made this video a while back showcasing MY take on Duke. Keep in mind, I’m a little bulkier now yet not in the best shape I could be in at the moment, and I need a little help with my Hair. But try and use your imagination and focus on my attitude, voice, delivery and timing, etc.

Anyway, check it out: My take on Duke Nukem