Something still feels wrong

I was going through a game session tonight in the Holodome this evening when a friend made a remark that Wilhelm is not as good a character as say Athena in terms of damage. Ive gone back and looked over my equipment and stat bonuses from my COM and still feel in terms of math this shouldnt be. Id like input after I send out this information to see if the game with all the stats from the gear, perncentages are all added up that their still not right. Ok sigh, here goes and before judgement starts, yes, this is a laser build, so dont comment if all you plan to do is hack down the usefulness of lasers which I dont believe. First I have laser weapons varying in damage from 2,000 to 4,000. Next Ill jump to the COM it is a Master Blaster which buffs WTTGS and Laser Focus. 6 in the former 5 in the latter. When looked at on skill tree LF buffs those particular weapons 40%. WTTGS which its been debated with no proof either way but it does only say weapon damage so Im adding it in which adds in another 33 % weapon damage on top of that. Then you lay in the gear I have the Prismatic Bulwark adds 32.2% more, and the EDD1.E,which in turn adds even more damage with 27.7 percent. Now with the skills and equipment buffs not hving a cooldown constantly working the bonus damage output is 132.9% I do not know exact figuring when it comes to adding to the base damage of weapons to this nor the exact amounts of hp the enemies posess on uvhm specifically UBAS, Iwa, and raid boss Sentinel but I still wonder if its really accurate adding all this together or the games still broken with all these Stats…

Let’s just put it this way. Wilhelm only gets a couple of small boosts, around 200% gun damage and some 100% crit boosts, as well as up to 150% fire rate.

Athena can get up to 750% fire rate and 500% gun damage with free ammo at the raid boss if she keeps her kill skills going.

As Wilhelm, you have to time all your offense skills very well (Apply cryo, Overcharge, Paint, Emergency Response, hit crit spot, power fist) to get close to Athena’s average damage. Then again, Wilhelm’s survivability is a bit better than Ahtena’s. with my all out offense Wilhelm, it takes me about 60% longer to solo the raidboss compared to my all off Athena.

One advice for Laser Wilhelm and the Raid boss: Tediore Railguns + Terminator com + bomber oz kit. Huge base damage around 9000, mag size up to 70 with Gun Show. Even without the gunshow, I’m doing around 5 mil damage per reload on his shields, which comes very close to what you can do with IVFs.

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I have a couple terminator mods no purples,and a 60 chronicler for him, just havent used them.

Wilhelm gets no love – and he’s so EASY MODE! Compare –

Jack: hyper-OP but you have to farm for Money is Power stacks to get him there – boring!

Athena’s crazy, too – but you have to do that weird mechanic of switching weapons every, what 9 seconds!? No thanks.

Wilhelm pretty unobtrusive, though when those Z’s get scrolling on the screen it gets disorienting. Don’t know what I spec’d into that gives the Z’s (looks like shield/health recharge)?

OK, so it takes you a few minutes longer to finish things; s’ok, quietly & efficiently done. I’ve been playing Claptrap more lately – in prep for the Claptastic Voyage.

Gotta disagree a little.

Jack is strong because he can

A. Keep all his damage boosting kill skills going during his action skill (extra gun damage, free ammo, heals)
B. Refill the action duration gauge, so if he cancels it while it’s still pretty full, it’s ready within seconds

Money is Power itself gives you an additional 250% gun damage at best.

Elemental Athena builds don’t need to rely on weapon swapping. Her power comes from the up to 400% damage from maelstrom stacks, plus multiplicative boosts from rend and omega senshu

Clap is strong cause over 2400% damage from OLT on cryo.

Baroness - up to 400 % cryo damage and huge crits.

Nisha - trickshot tombstone all day.

And then there’s Wilhelm.

Yup…it was similar with Axton

All-around survivable character with no gimmicks per se

With less insane damage potential

Hence more of the challenge I am looking for…

It is why my personal taste have gravitated toward this type of character. Plus, Wilhelm had to be an ex soldier at some point and I’m partial to ex soldiers. LOL

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I still feel with my specs and added damage from both the COM and equipment the figures still seem wrong. And this wasnt really about Wilhelm being better than anyone it was about the stats of my build really not showing up in game and bosses like the sentinel still giving me quite the challenge. True while Id want the challenge, I just feel with all the bonuses I should be facerolling a lot more like the rosey before it was nerfed. But with using other gear.

To be fair, I think you need to add in the over 200% Continuous Laser Damage that Maliwan lasers have. I’m not even counting Rosie’s (at 300% +) since I find them too squirrely to be comfortable with.

Wilhelm’s argueably the best laser user in the game – fair enough? So he can use lasers night and day (continuously). His handy ammo regen plus nearly indestructible shield makes him scary. We’ll have to see how it goes on the route to level 70.

Indeed, I want to see what his specs, gear, look like at 70, with all the glitched weapons, a explosive laser is there now, ya we will see how it goes.

There’s an explosive Laser? ■■■■ that’d be real good with a howitzer com

It’s called the Laser Disker (a Tribes: Ascend reference iirc) and made by Tediore. I’m planning to snag one for my Claptrap whenever I get a laser subroutine.


Legendary Laser shotgun <3

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Regarding Jack, you can max out every skill in the middle tree + best foot forward and the shield sharing skill to do tremendous damage and survival without ever touching money is power.

Athena and Jack both have a “swap weapons to get a DPS boost” but I feel like you have to just let that flow naturally. I’d also rather not do that. And I don’t need to either. Athena and Jack can both do tons of damage without that.

You know if people assume Jack’s strength comes from “Money is power”. They haven’t played Jack lol

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My remarks come from having played him to 60 and being really impressed with Money is Power! I spent some time grinding Money is Power stacks just to test it out. It forces a different type of discipline – especially my habit of checking every vending machine and buying ammo & weapons all the time (since stacks are lost if you spend money). Don’t know if I’ll get back into Jack?

Oh I apologize for assuming you hadn’t played him CDR Shepard, sometimes I hear people think Jack’s DPS comes from MiP and I can’t comprehend it lol.

Jack’s fun (Very Fun!), I like Wilhelm more personally

Money is Power is high risk, high reward. I suppose it wouldn’t be bad to spec into for the badass round of the holodome because it’s about an hour long and you have to stay alive the whole time anyhow.

However, I’d pair it with the high survive-ability of the middle tree. It kind of reminds me of Law & Order in Nisha’s left tree.

a) it might not be totally apparent just how much it can help you survive and
b) at the same time help you cause tons of damage.
c) you don’t really have to think too far outside an average playstyle. With Nisha it pays off to slam or melee periodically and definitely to shoot something at least every 10 seconds. With Jack, sometimes I manipulate things by canceling my action skill early or throwing my holograms into pits, but not too crazy.

However, Wilhelm is definitely more straight forward.

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Yeah it’s definitely worth the point since whatever you do, you will be accumulating stacks.

And the Greater Good tree is amazing, is really all that needs to be said lol

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One of the few times I realized I could put almost all my points into one tree and it was actually a good idea too! TPS has a lot of that though. Compared to the other games in the series that’s certainly interesting.

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It’s not shotgun style, it shoots one disk per shot. And sadly the performance of that gun is pretty underwhelming. A purple Splitter should perform better than that because the Laser Disker can’t crit.